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Posts for: Vacaman
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Feb 18, 2015 19:45:57   #
United States girl wrote:
I beg your parten ! This Iraq Leader gas over a million Christians in there village, Northern Prov. of Iraq; and any that survived were taken back to bagdad and put in a human stredder by his Sons. Pure Evil people. The left over gas ( yellow in color ) was poured into the River, when the Troops came. We had to put our Army Engineers to work, cleaning up the mess in the River and shore line and land area. No matter what made President Bush say what he did. It was dangerous and makes me sick to hear you say these things. Video or not. My nephew is a Chemical Engineer in the Army. He had the burns to prove the dangerous work. And he has to live with it. Can you?
I beg your parten ! This Iraq Leader gas over a m... (show quote)


Thank god for the real men of American, like your nephew the true freedom fighters that give us the chance to enjoy these luxeries we take for granted out here stateside. Tell him thank you on behalf of my family.
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Feb 18, 2015 19:42:53   #
Raylan Wolfe wrote:
GW Bush tells Americans that there were no WMD"s on live television!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soohikNdbWs


Babahahhaha! First rollingstone magazine"old" now YouTube"old"
Have you no life?
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Feb 18, 2015 19:34:51   #
Thanks for the interesting read, these papers are typical of the worldly man and satans lies. No big deal for me or you if this is how you conclude mankinds dark times. The Old Testament is not Christian would be my first point to the obvious as a flaw, Christians never practiced animal or human sacrafices. WTF!!!??? Eat my body! Drink my blood! That is human sacrifice. I believe you are taught that Jesus was fully human as well as fully God... (200% BS) Christians do beleive that Christ paid for our sins and yes this includes murder as no sin is greater than any other. I have a hard time with that part and it doesn't sound fair, but when a person is in Christ they have typically repented and left their sinful way. Why not just repent, leave your sinful ways, AND leave the creepiness involved in eating Jesus' body and blood in effigy in the past where it belongs.Again very hard to do in this hate filled world. Christians are not perfect people Then whats the POINT! If it doesn't even work!! and if they are true Christians you may not even know they are Christians at all unless you catch them during sacrament. This sacrament is an old ritual that Christ asked us to perform so that we would again feel his sacrafice. Exactly my point! Then whats your POINT! If it doesn't even work so as to allow others to be able to see any noticeable difference in behavior and lifestyle??!!??!!

First off it seams pretty clear that you once believed and now don't, perhaps a lost loved one?
Secondly the sacrament is in no way human sacrafice and if you think about it it was the last sacrafice the Jews had to be liable for.
Thirdly Christians like me work very hard to better ourselves and help those in need without judging them,in otherword be Christlike.
Fourth, if it were easy to accept faith without any other of our senses being used there would likely be even more than the 2 billion or so Christians in the world today.
If it were only that easy to explain the feeling if when the Holy Spirit moves you. When a person experiences that, you don't forget. We may pass it off as coincidence until it happens again and I find it amazing that atheist and Muslims are discovery Christ more frequently than ever in spite of all the persecution and denial by those who can not tell who is who unless they ask.
Christians do their best, just as you are doing your best to deny.
Thanks again.
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Feb 18, 2015 19:15:26   #
nwtk2007 wrote:
Oxygen producing plants arose prob 750 million years ago or sooner. They were there before the dinos.

But that still meant a few billion withot oxygen. It was a reducing atmosphere. Nothing rusted.


Nothing rusted? You are claiming zero oxygen?
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Feb 18, 2015 17:51:32   #
Vacaman wrote:
Yes there is some evidence when you stretch the imagination but how could it all have happened in last 200,000 years to what we know today?


Sorry I meant 200 million years per carbon dating.
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Feb 18, 2015 10:38:28   #
Singularity wrote:
Exerpted from Christopher Hitchens:

Obsessed with the ineffectual shedding/drinking of blood:

“For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.” Leviticus 17:11

“He was wounded for our transgressions,He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him,and by His wounds we are healed." Isaiah 53:5

Only, in reality…we aren’t…!
In the dimmest, darkest, most primitive phase of humanity’s psychological development…(still evident and rampant amongst the religious today)… ignorance fueled superstitious minds “reasoned”…that the wild seas were trying to kill them…therefore (obviously, duh!).,..the gods of the seas must be angry with them. So, quick! murder a virgin/infant/animal/human, and eat it…and drink it’s blood…(“reasoning” similarly, concerning gods of volcanoes, hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes, lava flows, famines, floods, plagues of pests etc)…
…until they finally realized…that the cost involved (in offspring and livestock) was just not justified by the random positive results (similar to the rate of coincidence)…deducing that it would be far cheaper to simply assume that there was just one god responsible for all these life threatening events…cutting down drastically on the number of blood lettings required to appease the god, per annum…
…until they finally realized…that the cost involved (in offspring and livestock) was still not justified by the random positive results (similar to the rate of coincidence)…further deducing that it would be even cheaper to just shed some blood/slice off a piece of anatomy/genitals…cutting down drastically on the quantity of blood required to appease the one god, per annum…
…until they finally realized that the pain and hassle involved (in offspring and livestock) was still not justified by the random positive results (similar to the rate of coincidence)… deducing even further, that it would be even cheaper to just pretend that the one god had a part-god offspring that could be the ultimate and final part-human sacrifice to itself…and everyone could just pretend they were eating, and drinking it’s blood…stopping altogether, the number of blood lettings required to be made to the god, per annum…
…until a small number of students of reality and reason, finally realized that the whole sacrifice-blood-to-god pretense was rather silly… as it was just not justified by the random positive results (similar to the rate of coincidence)…deducing finally, that it would be far more sensible to abandon these unfounded magical-blood-and-god myths…and instead, study the natural phenomena and risks in close detail…and devise practical and sensible means to protect people from natural threats…
…which actually worked…! And the people prospered and flourished…
…but for many, particularly those non-students of reality and reason…their ingrained and indoctrinated superstitions…proved very hard to relinquish…

And:
https://freethoughtsociety.wordpress.com/2009/11/25/vicarious-redemption-of-sin/Freethought Society of Greater Philadelphia

Vicarious Redemption of Sin
Posted by dangeroustalk

A lot of times I talk about the immorality of Christianity. Most of the time, Christians and even a few atheists jump to defend Christianity by talking about various good deeds particular Christians have done and continue to do. But I wasn’t talking about Christians being immoral; I was talking about Christianity being immoral. What can be more immoral then the vicarious redemption of sin?

The whole idea that I can go and murder someone or work on Saturday and have my sins forgiven vicariously by someone else is a license for crime. Christians often use the analogy of some small offense like a drunk driving charge (which for the record isn’t really a small offense) and they talk about how Judge God lets the offender off the hook because Jesus paid his or her fine. But that isn’t how the world works.

If someone went and murdered someone else and was found guilty, no one would be able to pay the fine of prison time except that person who was found guilty. There is an old expression, “If you do the crime, you will do the time.”

But that isn’t the worst part of the Christian redemption system. The way Jesus allegedly pays for your sins is through blood sacrifice. It is funny that when most Americans hear about some cult sacrificing an animal to the Gods they laugh and think such a ritual is absurd and yet 80% or more believe the same thing.

The whole Christian belief system centers around the idea of blood sacrifice. Back before Jesus allegedly came, the Abrahamic God wanted people to sacrifice goats to him so that he could forgive them for their sins. This is where the term scapegoat comes from. Everyone in the village puts all their sins on to the goat and kills the goat as a sacrifice to God. But God wanted more than just a goat.

Lambs were more desirable to God apparently, because he wanted the people to sacrifice an innocent lamb to show how much they care instead. Let me repeat that last part. God wanted people to sacrifice an Innocent Lamb.

Now of course there is no need to sacrifice an Innocent Lamb or any other lamb for that matter because Jesus is the “Lamb of God.” In other words, he is the innocent blood sacrifice that God needs for the redemption of sin.

Some people will say that not all Christians believe this and that I am generalizing. But the fact is that this whole blood sacrifice thing is a pretty central point the Christian belief system. I really don’t think one could seriously be considered a Christian if they don’t buy into the idea that the death of Jesus was a necessary sacrifice to God for their sins. That is pretty much the whole grounding of the religion. God forgives those who have accepted the sacrifice of Jesus for payment of their sins.

In reality, there is no vicarious redemption for sin. God can’t forgive you for your wrongs. Only those who you have wronged can forgive you. Next time you lie to a friend or family member about something, instead of asking Jesus for forgiveness, try slaughtering an innocent lamb instead. Let me know if that works out for ya.
Exerpted from Christopher Hitchens: br br Obsesse... (show quote)


Thanks for the interesting read, these papers are typical of the worldly man and satans lies. No big deal for me or you if this is how you conclude mankinds dark times. The Old Testament is not Christian would be my first point to the obvious as a flaw, Christians never practiced animal or human sacrafices. Christians do beleive that Christ paid for our sins and yes this includes murder as no sin is greater than any other. I have a hard time with that part and it doesn't sound fair, but when a person is in Christ they have typically repented and left their sinful way. Again very hard to do in this hate filled world. Christians are not perfect people and if they are true Christians you may not even know they are Christians at all unless you catch them during sacrament. This sacrament is an old ritual that Christ asked us to perform so that we would again feel his sacrafice. "Rituals" cause emotion. The Holy Spirit is still amongst us some call that a guardian angel today and the spirit is doing gods work around the world. Is there suffering due to the dark ages of religion? Yes look at Islam! The Jews stopped sacrificing animals either because they actually beleive the gospels or as your paper reads, figured the cost was too steep. As I said before the only thing Christ brought was the new covenant to all the Gentiles and Jews. He brought the word of forgiveness and directed us to do "as he did" spread love, tolerance, and acceptance of our brothers and sisters on this earth. Because of this teaching I try very hard not to hate and gudge others, and without knowing that Christ wants us to do this, I would be my old self, partying, fighting, hating, cheating, lieing, stealing all because what is a little white lie? What is a piece if candy? What is a bit of gossip? What is an extra deduction on my taxes? What is being mean to my neighbor? What's a little too much drink everyday? I realize some people over one these worldly things but typically fall right back into the groove with the " I'm cool" I can handle it ! That would be me too on occasion because we are fallible, nobody is perfect, not even the pope. You seem very knowledgable in the scriptures so I guess you recognize the great false prophet when it arrives?
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Feb 18, 2015 02:45:11   #
nwtk2007 wrote:
Im good with God but Ill look at the science without his input. If there are things not known, I wont chalk it up to the tiny baby jesus and his manufactuting pop.


Science is wonderful and if you use it accordingly. If we accept the bible as the hypothesis of creation by god, we must now use science to disprove that god exists. This we can not do. Jesus did not create anything except the new covenant. He merely educated those who would listen about gods everlasting unfailing love for us, and how he was sent to fulfill the old teststament prophecies. Why? Because obviously animal sacrafices would never atone us of our sinful nature.
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Feb 17, 2015 21:04:38   #
nwtk2007 wrote:
Single to oxygen base? What ever are you talking about?


Since you didn't read between the lines, from single cell "beginning of life per evolution" to oxygen breathing carbon emitting multiple cell structures which science claims occurred in the last 200,000 years. 4 billion years ago there was essentially no life form as the planet was too toxic.
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Feb 17, 2015 14:51:55   #
nwtk2007 wrote:
More like three to four billion years.


No, from single to oxygen base happen in less than 200,000
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Feb 17, 2015 12:05:52   #
nwtk2007 wrote:
But we DO have very strong evidence that life was not created as it is now; that it has evolved from simple forms of life to gradually give rise to the diversity we have today.


Yes there is some evidence when you stretch the imagination but how could it all have happened in last 200,000 years to what we know today?
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Feb 17, 2015 01:40:22   #
Nickolai wrote:
Medical doctors are not evolutionary biologist or paleontologist or geologist, or cosmologist or astronomers. My daughter holds a BS in Nursing too but she is a Christian that believes in Devine intervention but belief does not make it so . It stands to reason that a god would not create a world according to certain absolute physical laws then violate those laws with virgin births and Resurections from death taking snakes and such.


I know geologists that are Christian as well.
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Feb 17, 2015 01:39:19   #
Nickolai wrote:
The one I read said walketh and yes god is real for the believers I don't have any doubt. I used to think they were faking it then one night when I was about 14 years old mu buddy sand I was walking down the street in Okieville south of Hayward Ca as we started to pass the assembly of God Church we heard a greatr commotion going on so we went to see what was happening and they were jumping and shouting an a neighbor lady old lady Unger was hopping up and down pumping her little fists in the air her eyes closed yelping and shouting I thought they were all faking it but she fell against the back of a pew with her stomach hard enough to have ruptured a mule but it didn't phase her she just kept going and that's when I knew God was real for those people. then about 50 yeas ago I had an experience that convinced me that committed Christian's had brains made of kryptonite the hardest stuff in the universe. You couldn't change their minds with a stick of dynamite. So I'm well aware how real God is to people who like that kind of stuff. And get off on it
The one I read said walketh and yes god is real fo... (show quote)


Nickolai just as you accept light as being from the sun it is also very real and from the son of man. When you decide to take a leap of faith and accept Christ you too will feel the same things you witnessed as a young man.
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Feb 16, 2015 20:59:23   #
Nickolai wrote:
I meant that for vacaman that no reputable scientist believes that it would take much more than 4.5 billions of years for life to developed on Earth. The Burgess shale in Canada shows that complex life forms had fully developed in the sea by 550 million years ago. And it's believed that
these forms had been developing for hundreds of millions years before that and that it was only about 3 billion years before multi celled animals excreted enough oxygen for complex organisms to begin developing
I meant that for vacaman that no reputable scienti... (show quote)


Yes and then we have Nicholai, and with no gills and no link to any water born creature. So why is it that apes have not learned to speak or spend time on OPP?
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Feb 16, 2015 20:32:27   #
Singularity wrote:
Your argument has been adequately refuted by numerous methods. Most if the arguments presented by YEC's are untrue or logically fallacious.

101 evidences for a young age of the Earth and the universe

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101 evidences for a young age of the earth and the universe is an extensive list of arguments for young Earth creationism, YEC, compiled by Don Batten in June 2009 for Creation Ministries International, CMI.

The text below is the version of 26th March, 2012.

Batten collects a variety of supposed uncertainties in science dealing with the past that could allow one to simultaneously maintain belief in the validity of the scientific method and the literal interpretation of the Book of Genesis through confirmation bias. The apparent intent of the article is to help other creationists struggling with cognitive dissonance, and for use as a conversion tool.
In addition to numerous factual errors and failures to understand the theories which it is intended to criticize, the document suffers from faulty logic. A list of arguments broken down by fallacy is presented at the end of this page.
Although the list claims to have 101 points, several are just reworded duplicates and one is even a copy of the preceding item. Almost every reference link in the original article either goes directly to creationist sources, or to popular science magazines which support creationism; as there are no reputable peer-reviewed scientific papers. Ultimately, the article seeks to persuade by force of numbers, rather than force of argument.

Read more at http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/101_evidences_for_a_young_age_of_the_earth_and_the_universe

As stated in the article, the list of YEC arguments are refuted and broken down by exposing logical fallacies and faulty reasoning is presented at the end of this link.
Your argument has been adequately refuted by numer... (show quote)


I will read this once I find the time, glossing over it appears to support creation. I am not saying that god did not have a hand in creating our world. I am saying evolution exists, we have witnessed this within our own lifetime. Many creatures including Insects, Arachnids and Reptiles have shown us let alone Birds.
I know plenty of medical doctors who are Christians and beleive in Devine intervention.
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Feb 16, 2015 20:17:30   #
Kevyn wrote:
This is not my writing or my belief but it is a good answer to your question from a non believer.

Many believers try to rationalize God's existence by saying something like this: "The existence of the universe proves God's existence. Something had to create the universe. Science has no explanation for the universe's creation. Therefore, God created it."

The way to understand that this is a rationalization is to look back in history. Ancient people, before they had science, explained many things that they did not understand with "gods." There have been sun gods, thunder gods, fertility gods, rain gods, etc.

The Bible works the same way. It tries to explain many things that its ancient authors did not understand by attributing them in God. For example, if you read Genesis 9:12-13 you will find this:

And God said, "This is the sign of the covenant which I make between me and you and every living creature that is with you, for all future generations: I set my bow in the cloud, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between me and the earth..."
This is the Bible's explanation of rainbows. Of course we now know that rainbows are a prismatic effect of raindrops. In the same way, Genesis chapter 3 tries to explain why human childbirth is so painful and Genesis chapter 11 tries to explain why there are so many human languages. These are myths, nothing more.
In the same way, Genesis chapter 1 contains the Bible's creation myth. The creation of the universe and life is attributed to God. We already know that God had nothing to do with the creation of life, but religious people still try to attribute the creation of the universe to God.

The fact is, God had nothing to do with the creation of the universe, in the same way that God has nothing to do with the sun rising or rainbows appearing. Science does not have a complete explanation for the universe's creation, yet. While it is true that science does not yet know everything there is to know about the universe, scientists will eventually figure it out. When they do, what they will find is that nature created the universe, not an imaginary being.
This is not my writing or my belief but it is a go... (show quote)


It's obvious that you don't beleive in God the creator. Do you aknowledge that Jesus existed?
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