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Is Climate Change for Real ?
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Sep 28, 2013 10:38:34   #
Navysnipe Loc: Old West
 
Voice of Reason wrote:
Right. It's just one part of Agenda 21.


That's right. But be careful when you mention agenda 21, as it really doesn't exist, and you will be labeled a terrorist for speaking out against it.

Reply
Sep 28, 2013 11:25:44   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
Miss Brandi wrote:
NO THEY WON'T. I DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN AND WAS RESPONSIBLE ENOUGH NOT TO HAVE ANY...keep my whisker biscuit OUT of your arguments, thank you very much.


Why worry be fore some thing happens it just a waste of time.

But to be on the safe side build high enough that water may not wash you house away. Be sure that you build where the won't be a tornado. And at all cost avoid building where there are trees that can burn.

But not to worry others may worry for you.

Reply
Sep 28, 2013 11:36:47   #
grey gringo Loc: South Texas
 
The only thing NASA has proven is that they can spend the taxpayers money!!!

Reply
 
 
Sep 28, 2013 12:25:59   #
joe1941
 
John Deere wrote:
You folks need to give Raylan Wolfe a break. He's right that NASA proved global warming does happen. The climate got warmer after the end of the dark ages and Europe agriculture prospered and the standard of living when up for the Europeons. But I realize that Raylan is talking about the earth warming up to where it will be impossible for any life to survive. This will happen because of the sun's expanding mass and it's gravitational pull will increase on the planets slowing moving them closer. NASA said we have about 3 to 4 billion years left. So I guess I should be worried about children that are 20,000 generations in to the future. I doubt if buying an electric Obamamobile will change that. Meanwhile, I'll keep burning trash outside mixed in with old tires and used oil to at least get alittle global warming started because I HATE WINTER! Hey Raylan, you have any coal you want to get rid of? I'll take it.
You folks need to give Raylan Wolfe a break. He's... (show quote)


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 00:10:44   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
Raylan Wolfe wrote:
NASA has proven the World is warming dramatically!
http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence


Yes. Its been warming since the Little Ice Aged around 1850, which began after the Medievil Warming period, which began at the end of the cold period that started at the end of the Roman Warming period, which put a period on the cold period that began after the unnamed warm period that preceeded the Roman Warming period and so forth and so on until we get to the last Ice Age where trillions of tons of fresh water were locked in ice sheets that covered much of the Northern Hemisphere - ice sheets that lowered sea levels so far people could walk from the British Isles to the mainland - ice sheets which melted very rapidly at first, for a reason that is still a mystery to the manipulators who would have us running around in tight, panic-stricken circles in our brains. Apparently the earth has been through many ice ages in the last few million years. Brutally cold periods followed by warm periods in which LIFE FLOURISHED. There is no such thing as a climate norm. The climate is ALWAYS getting cooler or warmer. The earth is an immense machine with cycles we don't understand, and its affected by the sun's cycles, which we know even less about AND its affected by sources outside the solar system we know even less about. All you people worried about global warming need to start riding bikes,eating your meals raw and going to sleep with the chickens.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 00:15:43   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
John Deere wrote:
You folks need to give Raylan Wolfe a break. He's right that NASA proved global warming does happen. The climate got warmer after the end of the dark ages and Europe agriculture prospered and the standard of living when up for the Europeons. But I realize that Raylan is talking about the earth warming up to where it will be impossible for any life to survive. This will happen because of the sun's expanding mass and it's gravitational pull will increase on the planets slowing moving them closer. NASA said we have about 3 to 4 billion years left. So I guess I should be worried about children that are 20,000 generations in to the future. I doubt if buying an electric Obamamobile will change that. Meanwhile, I'll keep burning trash outside mixed in with old tires and used oil to at least get alittle global warming started because I HATE WINTER! Hey Raylan, you have any coal you want to get rid of? I'll take it.
You folks need to give Raylan Wolfe a break. He's... (show quote)


In 20,000 years, if the trend continues as it has for the past few million years, we should be on the downhill side of another ice age.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 00:20:36   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
Raylan Wolfe wrote:
I realize that you don't care about Global Warming, but your children's, children will.


Read "Unstoppable Global Warming". It will put your mind at ease. I'd reccommend it to anyone reading these posts. Its a meticulously sourced and footnoted book on the 1500 year climate cycle the earth has been going through for the past few million years. What the earth is doing now is not new.

Reply
 
 
Sep 29, 2013 01:24:06   #
Miss Brandi
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
Why worry be fore some thing happens it just a waste of time.

But to be on the safe side build high enough that water may not wash you house away. Be sure that you build where the won't be a tornado. And at all cost avoid building where there are trees that can burn.

But not to worry others may worry for you.

As a matter of fact, I don't worry about global warming and if a flood or tornado happens, then it happens, that is beyond my control. And no, there is no one to worry about me, so I pick and choose wisely what I invest my energy worrying about.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 01:38:28   #
Voice of Reason Loc: Earth
 
BigMike wrote:
Read "Unstoppable Global Warming". It will put your mind at ease. I'd reccommend it to anyone reading these posts. Its a meticulously sourced and footnoted book on the 1500 year climate cycle the earth has been going through for the past few million years. What the earth is doing now is not new.


But, but, but........CONSENSUS!

Of course, the ones promoting this the most (aside from those who want to profit from it and know it's a scam) tend to forget that Galileo went against the prevailing consensus and was labeled a heretic as well.

Here's a little story I wrote a couple years ago which I think sums AGW up pretty well:


What’s a billionaire elitist to do?

Suppose you are a billionaire, from a long line of super wealthy elitist ancestors, who is getting up in age. You remember the good ol’ days, when you sat in air-conditioned comfort in the back of your Rolls while your chauffer whisked you through the almost empty streets of LA and up the coast highway to those fantastic parties at Hurst’s castle. You remember the wonderful trips to the beaches on the French Riviera in your private yacht. Those marinas and beaches were the exclusive domain for you and your kind. You remember the Hamptons and Palm Beach as they used to be.

Everything has changed now, the rabble are everywhere. Sure you can still have your chauffer take you out in the Rolls, but the rabble are crowding the streets forcing you to sit in traffic, and they don’t even have the common decency to get out of your way. Sure you can still go to the French Riviera, but the rabble now crowd the beaches and even the marinas. And, oh, those nouveau-rich! Rabble! All your favorite haunts are now accessible to the common rabble and it’s just not right! You’re better than they are, you know it and they should too, but what can you do?

So you consider the problem. How did it happen that the common rabble can afford to visit what used to be the private haunts of you and your kind? How did it happen that so many commoners have now become nouveau-rich? How did it happen that so many common rabble can drive cars that congest your streets?

You realize that the problem began with the beginnings of the industrial revolution. With the advent of machines that do the work of hundreds of men and cheap energy to power them, wealth was created at an unprecedented rate. As industries progressed ever more wealth was created and shared by the masses, the middle-class thrived and expanded to the point where today they’re able to go to the places and do the things that only the elite upper class could do just 60 years ago.

This situation is unacceptable, but how do you fix it? The solution is to lower the standard of living of the middle class back to what it should be, but how to do that? You could get the politicians you own to pass laws mandating the commoners lower their standard of living, but there are thousands of them for every one of you and they’d revolt. So what do you do?

You need to find a way to make them voluntarily lower their standard of living. So you go back to the root cause of the increase in wealth…cheap abundant energy in the form of fossil fuels. If you can eliminate the availability of cheap energy, the problem will fix itself. But how do you get the masses to accept that? What is common to all fossil fuel? Well, when it’s burned to produce energy, carbon dioxide is produced. There is nothing that can be done to prevent that, it’s just physics. That’s it! You can pay scientists to tell the rabble that burning fossil fuel is releasing ancient CO2 into the atmosphere and destroying the planet! You can pay your politicians to pass laws to limit the use and raise the cost of fossil fuel under the guise of saving the planet! The stupid rabble will, for the most part, believe it and voluntarily give up their luxuries for the good of the planet.

This will take a massive PR campaign, but you already have the politicians, the media and the universities (with the scientists) on your payroll, this is going to work! There will be some smart enough to see the scam, but the massive PR campaign can silence them. There can even be suggestions made that those who don’t go along should be accused of crimes against humanity. It will take a few decades but by the time your grandchildren reach your age things will be back to the way they should be. The rabble will be back in their place and the elites will be able to enjoy themselves again without having to endure the indignities of mingling with the common rabble.

Problem solved!

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 02:53:49   #
AuntiE Loc: 45th Least Free State
 
Zemirah wrote:
It is impossible to "prove," dramatically, or otherwise, a nontruth:

http://www.latimes.com/science/la-sci-climate-change-uncertainty-2013/09/23,0,791164.story

Global warming 'hiatus' puts climate change scientists on the spot
By Monte Morin

Theories as to why Earth's average surface temperature hasn't risen in recent years include an idea that the Pacific Ocean goes through decades-long cycles of absorbing heat. It's a climate puzzle that has vexed scientists for more than a decade and added fuel to the arguments of those who insist man-made global warming is a myth.

Since just before the start of the 21st century, the Earth's average global surface temperature has failed to rise despite soaring levels of heat-trapping greenhouse gases and years of dire warnings from environmental advocates.

Now, as scientists with the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change gather in Sweden this week to approve portions of the IPCC's fifth assessment report, they are finding themselves pressured to explain this glaring discrepancy.

The panel, a United Nations creation that shared the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize with Al Gore, hopes to brief world leaders on the current state of climate science in a clear, unified voice. However, experts inside and outside the process say members probably will engage in heated debate over the causes and significance of the so-called global warming hiatus.

"It's contentious," said IPCC panelist Shang-Ping Xie, a professor of climate science at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography at UC San Diego. "The stakes have been raised by various people, especially the skeptics."

Though scientists don't have any firm answers, they do have multiple theories. Xie has argued that the hiatus is the result of heat absorption by the Pacific Ocean — a little-understood, naturally occurring process that repeats itself every few decades. Xie and his colleagues presented the idea in a study published last month in the prestigious journal Nature.

The theory, which is gaining adherents, remains unproved by actual observation. Surface temperature records date to the late 1800s, but measurements of deep water temperature began only in the 1960s, so there just isn't enough data to chart the long-term patterns, Xie said.

Scientists have also offered other explanations for the hiatus: lack of sunspot activity, low concentrations of atmospheric water vapor and other marine-related effects. These too remain theories.

"This unpredicted hiatus just reflects the fact that we don't understand things as well as we thought," said Roger Pielke Jr., a professor of environmental studies at the University of Colorado in Boulder and vocal critic of the climate change establishment.

"Now the IPCC finds itself in a position that a science group never wants to be in. It's in spin management mode."
It is impossible to "prove," dramaticall... (show quote)


You really should not confuse them with facts. If it is warming so drastically, one has to question the very large increase in the ice cap of recent.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 02:56:07   #
AuntiE Loc: 45th Least Free State
 
BigMike wrote:
Read "Unstoppable Global Warming". It will put your mind at ease. I'd reccommend it to anyone reading these posts. Its a meticulously sourced and footnoted book on the 1500 year climate cycle the earth has been going through for the past few million years. What the earth is doing now is not new.


You actually perceive they want to be out at ease?

:idea: I already posted this; however, it is worth repeating. Do not confuse them with facts.

Reply
 
 
Sep 29, 2013 08:14:40   #
John Deere
 
Voice of Reason wrote:
But, but, but........CONSENSUS!

Of course, the ones promoting this the most (aside from those who want to profit from it and know it's a scam) tend to forget that Galileo went against the prevailing consensus and was labeled a heretic as well.

Here's a little story I wrote a couple years ago which I think sums AGW up pretty well:


What’s a billionaire elitist to do?

Suppose you are a billionaire, from a long line of super wealthy elitist ancestors, who is getting up in age. You remember the good ol’ days, when you sat in air-conditioned comfort in the back of your Rolls while your chauffer whisked you through the almost empty streets of LA and up the coast highway to those fantastic parties at Hurst’s castle. You remember the wonderful trips to the beaches on the French Riviera in your private yacht. Those marinas and beaches were the exclusive domain for you and your kind. You remember the Hamptons and Palm Beach as they used to be.

Everything has changed now, the rabble are everywhere. Sure you can still have your chauffer take you out in the Rolls, but the rabble are crowding the streets forcing you to sit in traffic, and they don’t even have the common decency to get out of your way. Sure you can still go to the French Riviera, but the rabble now crowd the beaches and even the marinas. And, oh, those nouveau-rich! Rabble! All your favorite haunts are now accessible to the common rabble and it’s just not right! You’re better than they are, you know it and they should too, but what can you do?

So you consider the problem. How did it happen that the common rabble can afford to visit what used to be the private haunts of you and your kind? How did it happen that so many commoners have now become nouveau-rich? How did it happen that so many common rabble can drive cars that congest your streets?

You realize that the problem began with the beginnings of the industrial revolution. With the advent of machines that do the work of hundreds of men and cheap energy to power them, wealth was created at an unprecedented rate. As industries progressed ever more wealth was created and shared by the masses, the middle-class thrived and expanded to the point where today they’re able to go to the places and do the things that only the elite upper class could do just 60 years ago.

This situation is unacceptable, but how do you fix it? The solution is to lower the standard of living of the middle class back to what it should be, but how to do that? You could get the politicians you own to pass laws mandating the commoners lower their standard of living, but there are thousands of them for every one of you and they’d revolt. So what do you do?

You need to find a way to make them voluntarily lower their standard of living. So you go back to the root cause of the increase in wealth…cheap abundant energy in the form of fossil fuels. If you can eliminate the availability of cheap energy, the problem will fix itself. But how do you get the masses to accept that? What is common to all fossil fuel? Well, when it’s burned to produce energy, carbon dioxide is produced. There is nothing that can be done to prevent that, it’s just physics. That’s it! You can pay scientists to tell the rabble that burning fossil fuel is releasing ancient CO2 into the atmosphere and destroying the planet! You can pay your politicians to pass laws to limit the use and raise the cost of fossil fuel under the guise of saving the planet! The stupid rabble will, for the most part, believe it and voluntarily give up their luxuries for the good of the planet.

This will take a massive PR campaign, but you already have the politicians, the media and the universities (with the scientists) on your payroll, this is going to work! There will be some smart enough to see the scam, but the massive PR campaign can silence them. There can even be suggestions made that those who don’t go along should be accused of crimes against humanity. It will take a few decades but by the time your grandchildren reach your age things will be back to the way they should be. The rabble will be back in their place and the elites will be able to enjoy themselves again without having to endure the indignities of mingling with the common rabble.

Problem solved!
But, but, but........CONSENSUS! br br Of course, ... (show quote)


You forgot to mention that the rich find the perfect puppet. A man that came out of nowhere with no history,has no common sense, faked all his education, married an idiot that's greedy and lazy, and wants to destroy the fast food industry. The rich man's name-GEORGE SOROS.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 08:47:37   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
Voice of Reason wrote:
But, but, but........CONSENSUS!

Of course, the ones promoting this the most (aside from those who want to profit from it and know it's a scam) tend to forget that Galileo went against the prevailing consensus and was labeled a heretic as well.

Here's a little story I wrote a couple years ago which I think sums AGW up pretty well:


What’s a billionaire elitist to do?

Suppose you are a billionaire, from a long line of super wealthy elitist ancestors, who is getting up in age. You remember the good ol’ days, when you sat in air-conditioned comfort in the back of your Rolls while your chauffer whisked you through the almost empty streets of LA and up the coast highway to those fantastic parties at Hurst’s castle. You remember the wonderful trips to the beaches on the French Riviera in your private yacht. Those marinas and beaches were the exclusive domain for you and your kind. You remember the Hamptons and Palm Beach as they used to be.

Everything has changed now, the rabble are everywhere. Sure you can still have your chauffer take you out in the Rolls, but the rabble are crowding the streets forcing you to sit in traffic, and they don’t even have the common decency to get out of your way. Sure you can still go to the French Riviera, but the rabble now crowd the beaches and even the marinas. And, oh, those nouveau-rich! Rabble! All your favorite haunts are now accessible to the common rabble and it’s just not right! You’re better than they are, you know it and they should too, but what can you do?

So you consider the problem. How did it happen that the common rabble can afford to visit what used to be the private haunts of you and your kind? How did it happen that so many commoners have now become nouveau-rich? How did it happen that so many common rabble can drive cars that congest your streets?

You realize that the problem began with the beginnings of the industrial revolution. With the advent of machines that do the work of hundreds of men and cheap energy to power them, wealth was created at an unprecedented rate. As industries progressed ever more wealth was created and shared by the masses, the middle-class thrived and expanded to the point where today they’re able to go to the places and do the things that only the elite upper class could do just 60 years ago.

This situation is unacceptable, but how do you fix it? The solution is to lower the standard of living of the middle class back to what it should be, but how to do that? You could get the politicians you own to pass laws mandating the commoners lower their standard of living, but there are thousands of them for every one of you and they’d revolt. So what do you do?

You need to find a way to make them voluntarily lower their standard of living. So you go back to the root cause of the increase in wealth…cheap abundant energy in the form of fossil fuels. If you can eliminate the availability of cheap energy, the problem will fix itself. But how do you get the masses to accept that? What is common to all fossil fuel? Well, when it’s burned to produce energy, carbon dioxide is produced. There is nothing that can be done to prevent that, it’s just physics. That’s it! You can pay scientists to tell the rabble that burning fossil fuel is releasing ancient CO2 into the atmosphere and destroying the planet! You can pay your politicians to pass laws to limit the use and raise the cost of fossil fuel under the guise of saving the planet! The stupid rabble will, for the most part, believe it and voluntarily give up their luxuries for the good of the planet.

This will take a massive PR campaign, but you already have the politicians, the media and the universities (with the scientists) on your payroll, this is going to work! There will be some smart enough to see the scam, but the massive PR campaign can silence them. There can even be suggestions made that those who don’t go along should be accused of crimes against humanity. It will take a few decades but by the time your grandchildren reach your age things will be back to the way they should be. The rabble will be back in their place and the elites will be able to enjoy themselves again without having to endure the indignities of mingling with the common rabble.

Problem solved!
But, but, but........CONSENSUS! br br Of course, ... (show quote)


I go a long with the bit about the common rabble.

Its the few that want it to be their world.
The rabble should only be there to do their biding, then go back to some slum to live.

So why do so many rabble kiss up to them for crumbs?

You got it right about them wanting others to be only rabble & not wanting them sharing in their world.

The thing that is wrong about the economy is that more & more people are just so much rabble & it seems that the few feel that is best.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 12:35:23   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
Voice of Reason wrote:
But, but, but........CONSENSUS!

Of course, the ones promoting this the most (aside from those who want to profit from it and know it's a scam) tend to forget that Galileo went against the prevailing consensus and was labeled a heretic as well.

Here's a little story I wrote a couple years ago which I think sums AGW up pretty well:


What’s a billionaire elitist to do?

Suppose you are a billionaire, from a long line of super wealthy elitist ancestors, who is getting up in age. You remember the good ol’ days, when you sat in air-conditioned comfort in the back of your Rolls while your chauffer whisked you through the almost empty streets of LA and up the coast highway to those fantastic parties at Hurst’s castle. You remember the wonderful trips to the beaches on the French Riviera in your private yacht. Those marinas and beaches were the exclusive domain for you and your kind. You remember the Hamptons and Palm Beach as they used to be.

Everything has changed now, the rabble are everywhere. Sure you can still have your chauffer take you out in the Rolls, but the rabble are crowding the streets forcing you to sit in traffic, and they don’t even have the common decency to get out of your way. Sure you can still go to the French Riviera, but the rabble now crowd the beaches and even the marinas. And, oh, those nouveau-rich! Rabble! All your favorite haunts are now accessible to the common rabble and it’s just not right! You’re better than they are, you know it and they should too, but what can you do?

So you consider the problem. How did it happen that the common rabble can afford to visit what used to be the private haunts of you and your kind? How did it happen that so many commoners have now become nouveau-rich? How did it happen that so many common rabble can drive cars that congest your streets?

You realize that the problem began with the beginnings of the industrial revolution. With the advent of machines that do the work of hundreds of men and cheap energy to power them, wealth was created at an unprecedented rate. As industries progressed ever more wealth was created and shared by the masses, the middle-class thrived and expanded to the point where today they’re able to go to the places and do the things that only the elite upper class could do just 60 years ago.

This situation is unacceptable, but how do you fix it? The solution is to lower the standard of living of the middle class back to what it should be, but how to do that? You could get the politicians you own to pass laws mandating the commoners lower their standard of living, but there are thousands of them for every one of you and they’d revolt. So what do you do?

You need to find a way to make them voluntarily lower their standard of living. So you go back to the root cause of the increase in wealth…cheap abundant energy in the form of fossil fuels. If you can eliminate the availability of cheap energy, the problem will fix itself. But how do you get the masses to accept that? What is common to all fossil fuel? Well, when it’s burned to produce energy, carbon dioxide is produced. There is nothing that can be done to prevent that, it’s just physics. That’s it! You can pay scientists to tell the rabble that burning fossil fuel is releasing ancient CO2 into the atmosphere and destroying the planet! You can pay your politicians to pass laws to limit the use and raise the cost of fossil fuel under the guise of saving the planet! The stupid rabble will, for the most part, believe it and voluntarily give up their luxuries for the good of the planet.

This will take a massive PR campaign, but you already have the politicians, the media and the universities (with the scientists) on your payroll, this is going to work! There will be some smart enough to see the scam, but the massive PR campaign can silence them. There can even be suggestions made that those who don’t go along should be accused of crimes against humanity. It will take a few decades but by the time your grandchildren reach your age things will be back to the way they should be. The rabble will be back in their place and the elites will be able to enjoy themselves again without having to endure the indignities of mingling with the common rabble.

Problem solved!
But, but, but........CONSENSUS! br br Of course, ... (show quote)


Unstoppable Global Warming talks about that too. Has a chapter about it. It also addresses the "consensus" issue. Its a very good book.

Reply
Sep 29, 2013 12:37:40   #
BigMike Loc: yerington nv
 
AuntiE wrote:
You actually perceive they want to be out at ease?

:idea: I already posted this; however, it is worth repeating. Do not confuse them with facts.


Nope! Don't perceive that. Just figgered I'd put it out there anyway.

Reply
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