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Just solutions to the "Muslim Problem" in America
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Aug 10, 2014 13:59:41   #
cesspool jones Loc: atlanta
 
jeff smith wrote:
by our laws they have a right to be here. I also believe that they should be watched very closely. to many of them are here in hiding and waiting for their orders to start bombing or killing anyone who does not agree with their way of life. this does not mean that I agree with our law on letting them stay here.


when push comes to shove...they will have to be rounded up, checked out and quite possibly...removed. don't like it either `cause i know muslims.

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Aug 10, 2014 14:06:24   #
PaulPisces Loc: San Francisco
 
cesspool jones wrote:
ok, well, lemme see what ya got. hit me with yer rhythm stick.


That's a fair question. I'll illustrate what I was looking for by addressing some of Rumitoid’s points.

1) Recognize that the nation of Islam has very real and legitimate grievances against our nation.

I think Rumitoid’s choice of “nation of Islam” is an unfortunate one. My guess is he is referring to the body of believers around the world, and maybe specifically in the Middle East. In general I think progress comes when one truly tries to see the issue from the other’s point of view (not required to agree with it, just try to understand it.) That having been said, it would be more productive to know the specific grievances to which Rumitoid refers.

3) Clearly and freely remember how many countless times in our history that we "righteously" violated the 1st Amendment for "safety" or other rationalized concerns.

Probably a good idea to review the basic tenants of the 1st Amendment:

The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble or prohibiting the petitioning for a governmental redress of grievances.

Because this discussion is centered on Islam I suspect the free exercise of religion is Rumitoid’s Amendment reference. I think (as it seems clear our Founding Fathers did) Muslims should be as free to practice their religion as Christians, Jews, Wiccans or whatever. But within the limits of a law-abiding society. All religions seem to be susceptible to fringe fanatic behavior that is somehow justified by religious texts (remember the Crusades and Inquisition). One of the teachings of Islam (currently being ignored by Muslim terrorist/extremists) is that differing religions should coexist peacefully – something that worked well in Spain among Christians, Muslims and Jews until the Catholic monarchs came to power.

6) Love not only thy neighbor but thy enemy as yourself.
7) Turn the other cheek, go the extra mile to resolve this growing conflict, taking no thought for yourself.

I’m surprised no one commented on these, which are near-direct quotes from Jesus himself. How do they apply in the context of terrorism? These are difficult directives that have no easy answer, on either side.

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Aug 10, 2014 14:22:40   #
cesspool jones Loc: atlanta
 
PaulPisces wrote:
That's a fair question. I'll illustrate what I was looking for by addressing some of Rumitoid’s points.

1) Recognize that the nation of Islam has very real and legitimate grievances against our nation.

I think Rumitoid’s choice of “nation of Islam” is an unfortunate one. My guess is he is referring to the body of believers around the world, and maybe specifically in the Middle East. In general I think progress comes when one truly tries to see the issue from the other’s point of view (not required to agree with it, just try to understand it.) That having been said, it would be more productive to know the specific grievances to which Rumitoid refers.

3) Clearly and freely remember how many countless times in our history that we "righteously" violated the 1st Amendment for "safety" or other rationalized concerns.

Probably a good idea to review the basic tenants of the 1st Amendment:

The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble or prohibiting the petitioning for a governmental redress of grievances.

Because this discussion is centered on Islam I suspect the free exercise of religion is Rumitoid’s Amendment reference. I think (as it seems clear our Founding Fathers did) Muslims should be as free to practice their religion as Christians, Jews, Wiccans or whatever. But within the limits of a law-abiding society. All religions seem to be susceptible to fringe fanatic behavior that is somehow justified by religious texts (remember the Crusades and Inquisition). One of the teachings of Islam (currently being ignored by Muslim terrorist/extremists) is that differing religions should coexist peacefully – something that worked well in Spain among Christians, Muslims and Jews until the Catholic monarchs came to power.

6) Love not only thy neighbor but thy enemy as yourself.
7) Turn the other cheek, go the extra mile to resolve this growing conflict, taking no thought for yourself.

I’m surprised no one commented on these, which are near-direct quotes from Jesus himself. How do they apply in the context of terrorism? These are difficult directives that have no easy answer, on either side.
That's a fair question. I'll illustrate what I wa... (show quote)


this all revolves around 'live and let live.' i'm sorry but those days are over considering that there ARE people in this country who will use bombs on civilians. What Jesus said will always resonate...but not to an enemy who hates Jesus and the bible. Rumitoid lives in a lullaby.

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Aug 10, 2014 14:24:24   #
Byran
 
if America takes that approach then America will be no more in a decade or two

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Aug 10, 2014 14:44:53   #
AuntiE Loc: 45th Least Free State
 
PaulPisces wrote:
You misunderstood my comment, Cesspool. I was hoping for an intelligent conversation with the participants of One Political Plaza.


I find it interesting you have been a member since Fecruary, have posted nine comments; however, find it quite easy to critique an entire body of members. It would seem, from my personal perception, you are the individual unwilling to engage in conversation.

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Aug 10, 2014 14:47:26   #
AuntiE Loc: 45th Least Free State
 
PaulPisces wrote:
That's a fair question. I'll illustrate what I was looking for by addressing some of Rumitoid’s points.

1) Recognize that the nation of Islam has very real and legitimate grievances against our nation.

I think Rumitoid’s choice of “nation of Islam” is an unfortunate one. My guess is he is referring to the body of believers around the world, and maybe specifically in the Middle East. In general I think progress comes when one truly tries to see the issue from the other’s point of view (not required to agree with it, just try to understand it.) That having been said, it would be more productive to know the specific grievances to which Rumitoid refers.

3) Clearly and freely remember how many countless times in our history that we "righteously" violated the 1st Amendment for "safety" or other rationalized concerns.

Probably a good idea to review the basic tenants of the 1st Amendment:

The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble or prohibiting the petitioning for a governmental redress of grievances.

Because this discussion is centered on Islam I suspect the free exercise of religion is Rumitoid’s Amendment reference. I think (as it seems clear our Founding Fathers did) Muslims should be as free to practice their religion as Christians, Jews, Wiccans or whatever. But within the limits of a law-abiding society. All religions seem to be susceptible to fringe fanatic behavior that is somehow justified by religious texts (remember the Crusades and Inquisition). One of the teachings of Islam (currently being ignored by Muslim terrorist/extremists) is that differing religions should coexist peacefully – something that worked well in Spain among Christians, Muslims and Jews until the Catholic monarchs came to power.

6) Love not only thy neighbor but thy enemy as yourself.
7) Turn the other cheek, go the extra mile to resolve this growing conflict, taking no thought for yourself.

I’m surprised no one commented on these, which are near-direct quotes from Jesus himself. How do they apply in the context of terrorism? These are difficult directives that have no easy answer, on either side.
That's a fair question. I'll illustrate what I wa... (show quote)


Wow...When you come out commenting, you come out in a big way.

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Aug 10, 2014 15:09:55   #
Libya21
 
since the FBI reports that there are more than 11 known Muslim camps in the US training radicals to kill us at some future point, why are you so sheepish? That's the problem with the FBI. They claim their hands are tied and they can't do anything because of the administration's hands-off policies. The FBI's leaders need to speak out and American citizens need to get off their fat asses and start observing, reporting, and harassing!

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Aug 10, 2014 15:49:06   #
Sicilianthing
 
Libya21 wrote:
Have you lost touch with reality? Or do you live in GaGaland? We don't need Muslims in America. Now or ever!


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
That would be nice ....
Now you have to place the BluePrint here for
Waking the Sleepers
Taking action and
Making that happen !

Reply
Aug 10, 2014 16:02:19   #
alex Loc: michigan now imperial beach californa
 
Sicilianthing wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
That would be nice ....
Now you have to place the BluePrint here for
Waking the Sleepers
Taking action and
Making that happen !



http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=LPjzfGChGlE&feature=player_embedded__

hope this works

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Aug 10, 2014 16:17:55   #
Sicilianthing
 
alex wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=LPjzfGChGlE&feature=player_embedded__

hope this works


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I've seen that one and very good...
But we're going to need something on YouTube much much stronger
I mean something of severity here in America will have to take place on film...
So that people come out of their homes and offices
to Form Camp !

Reply
Aug 10, 2014 16:59:33   #
ldsuttonjr Loc: ShangriLa
 
jeff smith wrote:
by our laws they have a right to be here. I also believe that they should be watched very closely. to many of them are here in hiding and waiting for their orders to start bombing or killing anyone who does not agree with their way of life. this does not mean that I agree with our law on letting them stay here.


Jeff: They must be marked with the "Scarlet Letter M" if they expect to live in this Country!

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Aug 10, 2014 17:12:46   #
Cherokee38 Loc: Atlanta
 
grumbledog wrote:
Only question is where do you come with this trash.Not all Muslin want us dead a small percentage do and in their minds just like your they are justified

MexiBola where did you hear that probably Fox news or a tea party rep.
Apparently, you learned little in school about history. Most Germans did not want to exterminate the Jewish race, just a small percentage of extremist. What makes you think the Muslims are different? That is not fear, but common sense. The USA has a history of not honoring treaties it writes, so how are you going to make friends with them? Are all libs born with therir head up their a__???

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Aug 10, 2014 17:18:59   #
alex Loc: michigan now imperial beach californa
 
ldsuttonjr wrote:
Jeff: They must be marked with the "Scarlet Letter M" if they expect to live in this Country!


no Muslim can be an American citizen as they must take an oath to follow the constitution and the koran doesn't allow that of course liberals and RINOs don't want to follow it either

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Aug 10, 2014 17:52:56   #
True Believer
 
I have no problem with any religion however, when the Muslims want their laws in the USA instead of our laws, then go back to where you are from or immigrate to a country that has those laws plus it really upsets me that they come here an get on welfare immediately. That is not right as any legal immigrant has to show that they have the where with all to support themselves here or have a spouncer. What happened to those laws? I'm tired of paying people to kill me. Remember the Boston Marathon bombing. Those people had been on welfare for 10 years. No common sense anymore.

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Aug 10, 2014 22:03:24   #
angery american Loc: Georgia
 
rumitoid wrote:
I mean the word "just" as a double entendre: "only and right (by our Bill of Rights)."

A little history: "On Oct. 27, 1838, Missouri Governor Lilburn W. Boggs issued an official order declaring, "The Mormons must be treated as enemies, and must be exterminated or driven from the state if necessary for the public peace." On mayoral Election Day Aug. 6, 1855, the Know Nothing Party -- an anti-Catholic political organization -- sparked riots in Louisville, Kentucky against Catholic immigrants, leaving 22 dead. On Dec. 17, 1862, General Ulysses S. Grant issued Order 11, which read, "The Jews, as a class... are hereby expelled from Tennessee within twenty-four hours..." Expelled Jews, murdered Mormons and massacred Catholics -- and lest we think otherwise, the really gruesome stories involve African and Native Americans." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/qasim-rashid/americas-muslim-problem_b_1168709.html

"That is, unless the minority is American Muslims. In that case, the age-old rule applies. It is not bigotry nor discrimination that is being exercised, but American security that is being protected." As in the Patriot Act nearly every American has come to hate but felt necessary in their profound fear and need for safety.

The Declaration of Independence did not give liberty to slaves, native Americans, women, or non-property owning white folks. We steadily grew into a larger idea of equality, with much and costly resistance I might add. But we did--and to me that alone makes America great and unequaled in history. Liberty is a tough and expensive ideal to maintain, and very, very messy. But this was not fear-based when we became a nation but the thinking of the time about class. How we may come to treat the Muslims, in light of our disgrace as to how we treated Japanese Americans in WWII, Native Americans, and the oppression of the McCarthy era, will tell us if a republic such as ours deserves to survive.

Fear has a few disguises, one of those is "practical security." Another is patriotism. There are dozens more that, like the above, hide fear from ourselves and present it as something else more reasonable and respectable. Enough said and onto the solutions.

1) Recognize that the nation of Islam has very real and legitimate grievances against our nation.

2) Look to address those grievances as openly as possible, apologies, just recompense, and fair treaties included.

3) Clearly and freely remember how many countless times in our history that we "righteously" violated the 1st Amendment for "safety" or other rationalized concerns.

4) Become a dedicated peacemaker.

5) Put Constitutional and/or Religious principles before personal gain or desire, looking only for what is the best for the common good (true patriotism).

6) Love not only thy neighbor but thy enemy as yourself.

7) Turn the other cheek, go the extra mile to resolve this growing conflict, taking no thought for yourself.

8) Last but first, "Fear not!" Fear corrupts everything and looks suave doing it: the man to rely on and trust.
I mean the word "just" as a double enten... (show quote)
Tell you what....why don't you get on a plane, go to Ira k...walk down the street holding an AMERICAN FLAG and a sign in Arabic that says..." WE APOLOGIZE".......Maby you can change their minds.....If you think this will work...go for it...But Personally I think you are a fool...

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