A new book for the nut job right to ban (Page 17): Why would you swim for 40 days just hold onto a log. Think before you post.

BIRDMAN

Wildlandfirefighter wrote:

uh huh; I can swim too, but not for 40 days, and all that swimming would make me use up even more energy reserves so even if I was a polar bear I would likely not make it.

But at least you are agreeing with me that there were not 2 of every animal in the world on the ark. That is a good start for you.

Why would you swim for 40 days just hold onto a log. Think before you post.

Big Bass

Wildlandfirefighter wrote:

uh huh; I can swim too, but not for 40 days, and all that swimming would make me use up even more energy reserves so even if I was a polar bear I would likely not make it.

But at least you are agreeing with me that there were not 2 of every animal in the world on the ark. That is a good start for you.

Polar bears spend most of summer swimming in the seas in the Arctic. You would not last more than a couple of hours in those waters. Prove me wrong.

padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al

Wildlandfirefighter wrote:

So tell me oh great and all knowing Kahuna, since we know that there were not 2 of every animal with Noah, how did all the millions of species not on the ark survive???? If these species could survive, don't you think that some other human cultures that were present in the world back then would have been able to survive as well?

There were no polar bears on the ark, nor brown bears, black bears, Kodiak bears, moose, elk, caribou, white tailed deer, mule deer, mountain lions, lynx, bobcats, otters, wolverines, mink, martin, snowshoe hares, and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on. There are more than 10,000 species of birds in the world. How many of these do you think made it on the ark? How about reptiles, amphibians, mollusks and even insects? We have identified some 900,000 insect species to date and there are probably 5 million or more that we have not even gotten that far on. There is little mention of insects on the ark, yet they are animals.

But what I really want to know is where did all that water come from, and even more, where did it all go. What would have stopped anyone who had a boat from living out the flood?

If only Noah and his family were on the ark, how did all the other races on the earth manage to survive (other boats, big ass rafts?).

Religious scholars have determined a date for the great flood of somewhere around 4128 BC. I find it interesting that there are numerous cultures (at least 5 that I know of) that have written language that started hundreds to thousands of years prior to the flood, and continued for hundreds to thousands of years after the flood. So how did all these civilizations continue if only Noah and his family survived the flood.

Here's an even funner question: How much rain had to fall every hour on average to cover the earth in water and make the ark necessary? There are mountains in excess of 29,000 feet above sea level on this planet. Doing some simple math and considering the fabled 40 days and nights of rain, that comes out to a total of 960 hours of rain. It would have had to average 30 FEET of rain an hour (or 6 inches of rain per minute) for all 960 hours to provide sufficient water to make this a reality.

Its a great story, there may have been localized flooding in the area known to Noah, but there just is no way that the entire world was under water and there is no way that 2 of every animal on the planet were on the ark. It is a story that brought me much consternation and got me into trouble as a child in Catholic school. When I asked the nun's or the priests these questions their answer was that I should simply have faith and believe. That doesn't work for me, probably why I was not fooled by Trump for a second.

Anyway, it is a lie to say that there were 2 or more of every animal in the world on Noah's ark. There might have been 2 of each species in the "known" world of the middle east and Africa at the time, but there was no representation from the unknown areas of the world at that time on the ark, yet all those species survived.

The native American cultures here in North America go back over 9000 years. They were here before the flood, and they are still here today, and none of these people were on the ark. So obviously it was not just Noah and his family that survived.

So tell me oh great and all knowing Kahuna, since ... (show quote)

It is a great mystery that personally I'm not putting all my faith into because we just don't know. However the Chickasaw Indians are not the only North American Indian Tribe who has a story of the flood. Almost every other ancient people, from the Chinese to the Mayans and Incas, had their own version that told of destruction of the world by water. In Truth, there is no way every civilization could say anything except the part of the world they inhabited was flooded at the same time. Faith does not demand proof. I've found petrified sharks teeth in Kaycee Wyoming and other sea fossils.

BIRDMAN

padremike wrote:

It is a great mystery that personally I'm not putt... (show quote)

I have work in Quarries Throughout the United States you can find every kind of fossil imaginable

Big Bass

Wildlandfirefighter wrote:

Hey fool, I happen to have a degree in wildlife management, how about you?

So tell me just what your definition of "Kinds" of animals is. Are you trying to tell me that two mammal kinds of animals, say two horses, could then repopulate the caribou, deer, musk ox and every other "hoofed" animal species in the world after the flood.

You really are confused if that is what you believe!

Go back and reread the Bible’s account of Noah. The setting was the known world at that time. The Americas were unknown, as they didn’t have airlines to ferry them back and forth. As a wildlife degree holder, you should know that water, can neither be created nor destroyed. It can change to steam, ice or vapor, or be separated into its component oxygen and hydrogen. As for flooding the world, there is not enough water on this planet to do that.

BIRDMAN

Big Bass wrote:

Go back and reread the Bible’s account of Noah. The setting was the known world at that time. The Americas were unknown, as they didn’t have airlines to ferry them back and forth. As a wildlife degree holder, you should know that water, can neither be created nor destroyed. It can change to steam, ice or vapor, or be separated into its component oxygen and hydrogen. As for flooding the world, there is not enough water on this planet to do that.

Stop it with the facts their brains will freeze up

Parky60 Loc: People's Republic of Illinois

Wildlandfirefighter wrote:

Hey fool, I happen to have a degree in wildlife management, how about you?

So tell me just what your definition of "Kinds" of animals is. Are you trying to tell me that two mammal kinds of animals, say two horses, could then repopulate the caribou, deer, musk ox and every other "hoofed" animal species in the world after the flood.

You really are confused if that is what you believe!

You are confused in your thinking that a “species” is a “kind.” Species is a man-made term used in the modern classification system. And frankly, the word species is difficult to define. The Bible uses the term “kind.” The Bible’s first use of this word (Hebrew: min) is found in Genesis 1 when God creates plants and animals “according to their kinds.” It is used again in Genesis 6 and 8 when God instructs Noah to take two of every kind of land-dwelling, air-breathing animal onto the ark and also in God’s command for the animals to reproduce after the Flood. A plain reading of the text infers that plants and animals were created to reproduce within the boundaries of their kind. Evidence to support this concept is clearly seen (or rather not seen) in our world today, as there are no reports of dats (dog + cat) or hows (horse + cow). So, a good rule of thumb is that if two things can breed together, then they are of the same created kind. It is a bit more complicated than this, but for the time being, this is a quick measure of a “kind.”

As an example, dogs can easily breed with one another, whether wolves, dingoes, coyotes, or domestic dogs. When dogs breed together, you get dogs; so, there is a dog kind. It works the same with chickens. There are several breeds of chickens, but chickens breed with each other and you still get chickens. So, there is a chicken kind. While the concept is fairly easy to understand, mentally challenged people such as yourself might have extreme difficulty understanding this.

But in today’s culture, where evolution and millions of years are taught as fact, many people have been led to believe that animals and plants (that are classed as a specific “species”) have been like this for tens of thousands of years and perhaps millions of years. So, when they see things like lions or zebras, they think they have been like this for an extremely long time.

From a biblical perspective, though, land animals like wolves, zebras, sheep, lions, and so on have at least two ancestors that lived on Noah’s ark, only about 4,300 years ago. These animals have undergone many changes since that time. But dogs are still part of the dog kind, cats are still part of the cat kind, and so on. God placed variety within the original kinds, and other variation has occurred since the Fall due to genetic alterations.

Creation scientists use the word baramin to refer to created kinds (Hebrew: bara = created, min = kind). Because none of the original ancestors survive today, creationists have been trying to figure out what descendants belong to each baramin in their varied forms. Baramin is commonly believed to be at the level of family and possibly order for some plants/animals (according to the common classification scheme of kingdom, phylum, class, order, family, genus, species). On rare occasions, a kind may be equivalent to the genus or species levels.

Baraminology is a field of study that attempts to classify fossil and living organisms into baramins. This is done based on many criteria, such as physical characteristics and DNA sequences. For living organisms, hybridization is a key criterion. If two animals can produce a hybrid, then they are considered to be of the same kind. However, the inability to produce offspring does not necessarily rule out that the animals are of the same kind, since this may be the result of mutations (since the Fall).

Zonkeys (from a male zebra bred with a female donkey), zorses (male zebra and female horse), and hebras (male horse and female zebra) are all examples of hybrid animals. Hybrid animals are the result of the mating of two animals of the same “kind.” Perhaps one of the most popular hybrids of the past has been the mule, the mating of a horse and donkey. So, seeing something like a zorse or zonkey shouldn’t really surprise anyone, since donkeys, zebras, and horses all belong to the horse kind.

The concept of kind is important for understanding how Noah fit all the animals on the ark. If kind is at the level of family/order, there would have been plenty of room on the ark to take two of every kind and seven of some. For example, even though many different dinosaurs have been identified, creation scientists think there are only about 50 “kinds” of dinosaurs. Even though breeding studies are impossible with dinosaurs, by studying fossils one can ascertain that there was likely one Ceratopsian kind with variation in that kind and so on.

After the Flood, the animals were told to “be fruitful and multiply on the earth” (Genesis 8:17). As they did this, natural selection, mutation, and other mechanisms allowed speciation within the kinds to occur. Speciation was necessary for the animals to survive in a very different post-Flood world. This is especially well illustrated in the dog kind in which current members (e.g., coyotes, dingoes, and domestic dogs) are confirmed to be descended from an ancestral type of wolf.

Hybrid animals are usually the result of parent animals that have similar chromosome numbers. Many times, the hybrids are infertile due to an uneven chromosome number that affects the production of eggs and sperm. However, this is not always the case, as even some mules (horse + donkey) have been known to reproduce. Consider some of the following amazing animal hybrids.

Zonkeys, Zorses, and Mules
These hybrids are the result of mating within the family Equidae. As I said before, zonkeys are the result of mating a male zebra and a female donkey; zorses are the result of mating a male zebra and a female horse; and mules are the result of mating a male donkey and a female horse. But reverse matings (such as hinnies produced from a male horse and female donkey) are rare, although still possible. All are considered “infertile” due to uneven chromosome numbers, but fertility has been observed in some cases. Zonkeys and zorses have a mixture of their parents’ traits, including the beautiful striping patterns of the zebra parents.

Ligers, Tigons, and Other Cats
These hybrids are the result of mating within the family Felidae. Ligers are the result of mating a male lion and a female tiger. Ligers are the largest cats in the world, weighing in at over 1,000 pounds (450 kg). Tigons are the result of mating a female lion and a male tiger. These matings only occur in captivity, since lions live in Africa, tigers live in Asia, and the two are enemies in the wild. Female hybrids are typically fertile while male hybrids are not.

Other hybrids in this family include bobcats that mate with domestic cats and bobcats with lynx (Blynx and Lynxcat). There have been mixes of the cougar and the ocelot, as well as many others. This shows that large, midsize, and small cats can ultimately interbreed, and therefore suggests that there is only one cat kind.

Wolphin
Turning to the ocean, this hybrid is the result of mating within the family Delphinidae. The wholphin is the result of mating a false killer whale (genus Pseudorca) and bottlenose dolphin (genus Tursiops). Such a mating occurred in captivity at Hawaii’s Sea Life Park in 1985. The wholphin is fertile. This hybrid shows the difficulty of determining the species designation, since a major criterion is the ability to interbreed and produce fertile offspring. Even though the whale and dolphin are considered separate genera, they may, in fact, belong to the same species. This shows how difficult it is to define the term species. Of course, from a biblical perspective it is easy to say they are both the same kind!

A Great Place for Creation Research
All of these animals’ ancestors that we have discussed above—horses, donkey, zebras, tigers, lions, whales, and dolphins—were created with genetic diversity within their various kinds. Through time, the processes of natural selection, mutation, and other mechanisms have altered that original information (decreased or degenerated) to give us even more variation within a kind.

Great variety can be observed in the offspring of animals of the same kind, just as the same cake recipe can be used to make many different cakes with various flavors and colors. Hybrids have a portion of the same genetic information as their parents but combined in a unique way to give a very unique-looking animal. What an amazing diversity of life God has created for us to enjoy!

The study of created kinds is an exciting area of research, and our hope is to help encourage others to get involved. Whether studying the duck-goose kind, elephant-mammoth kind, camel-llama kind, apple-pear kind, or others, the field of baraminology is a great place for biologists, botanists, geneticists, and paleontologists (for extinct kinds) to get immersed in creation research.

BIRDMAN

Parky60 wrote:

You are confused in your thinking that a “species”... (show quote)

Very good

Big Bass

Birdmam wrote:

Stop it with the facts their brains will freeze up

I despise liars, Birdma’am. I’m am sick of listening to the communists blaming Trump for all their crimes they’ve committed and getting away with it. These commie idiots have no ability to think for themselves.

kemmer

padremike wrote:

Everytime you open your mouth you show your ignorance.

What a coincidence. I’ve ALWAYS thought that about you.

kemmer

Big Bass wrote:

Better than having piss for blood and shitferbrains.

Poor kid. Have you seen someone about that? 😂

kemmer

Big Kahuna wrote:

The climate did actually change during Noah's time. But it wasn't man made but was an act of God. Man was so immoral, sinful, arrogant and sexually confused (like now where homosexuality is rampant) that God had enough and only spared Noah, his family and at least 2 of each animal.

Uh-huh. And all 7 billion+ people on Earth, their various races, cultures, languages, and religions evolved from Noah’s 7 family members. All in 4-5000 years. Now I’ll tell one. 🙄

padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al

kemmer wrote:

What a coincidence. I’ve ALWAYS thought that about you.

That makes me exceedingly happy because it's confirmation that I'm on the right path.

Parky60 Loc: People's Republic of Illinois

kemmer wrote:

Uh-huh. And all 7 billion+ people on Earth, their various races, cultures, languages, and religions evolved from Noah’s 7 family members. All in 4-5000 years. Now I’ll tell one. 🙄

Now I'll tell you one... from 4 original couples, using a population growth growth calculator, it is possible with only 0.48 percent growth for the population to grow to 7.1 billion in 4280 years.

kemmer

Parky60 wrote:

Now I'll tell you one... from 4 original couples, using a population growth growth calculator, it is possible with only 0.48 percent growth for the population to grow to 7.1 billion in 4280 years.

If that were even true, what about races, NON monotheistic religions etc.? Did God’s hissy fit drown all the innocent Chinese, Japanese, indigenous of N & S America too?
BTW, floods are common all over the globe except at the Poles.