A comment from one with Russian ties to the area: #3 (Page 79): Provoked by NATO expansion, Abuse of Russian nationals in Crimea and the donbas, indiscriminate shelling and killing of...

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nwtk2007 Loc: Texas

kemmer wrote:

What is it about unprovoked invasion, war crimes, mass civilian graves, and wanton attacks on civilian apartment buildings that you don’t understand?

Provoked by NATO expansion, Abuse of Russian nationals in Crimea and the donbas, indiscriminate shelling and killing of men, women and children since 2014; them having voted multiple times to break away from Ukraine and having asked Russia to assist them via annexation and military aid.

War crime being crimes committed by Ukraine military but made to look like committed by Russian military. Since 2014, the Ukraine military has killed over 4000 children. Interviews with Ukrainian soldiers reveal great heart ache at having to target churches, schools and neighborhoods. Ukraine soldiers have stated that they do not want to know their targets so they can at least sleep at night. Investigations into some of the atrocities by neutral parties are being held up by the Ukraine government.

Mass civilian graves have been proven to be Russians and not Ukrainians killed by the Ukraine military and have also been shown to be Ukrainians killed by the Ukraine military Nazi regiments.

The only attacks by the Russian military on civilian targets have been in returning fire from those areas. Ukraine military equipment is routinely stored and set up in neighborhoods and near schools.

What part of that don't you understand? I have provided links to area reporters and journalists who have written about what they have seen. You ignore those and pay attention only to western media sources.

kemmer

nwtk2007 wrote:

Provoked by NATO expansion….

NATO’s reason for being is solely to prevent Russian expansion, and because of Putin’s aggression, traditional neutral countries like Sweden and Finland felt safer joining NATO. And it was a no brainer for Ukraine to want to join.

Quote:

Abuse of Russian nationals in Crimea and the donbas, indiscriminate shelling and killing of men, women and children since 2014; them having voted multiple times to break away from Ukraine

Since when can a country’s province “vote” to join another country? Didn’t we go through that in 1860?
Russian regulars and “volunteers” invaded Donbas to fight against Ukraine. Of course Ukraine retaliated. And then Russia outright annexed the Ukrainian territory of Crimea.

Quote:

Interviews with Ukrainian soldiers reveal great heart ache at having to target churches, schools and neighborhoods..

That’s a ton of BS. Those early on were prime targets to destroy morale after their initial assault against Kyiv failed—which Putin promised would be a cakewalk.

Quote:

The only attacks by the Russian military on civilian targets have been in returning fire from those areas.

Uh-huh. Howitzers at every apartment window, crowded train station, and theatre balcony.

Quote:

You…pay attention only to western media sources.

I may be forgiven for not paying any attention to Russian state propaganda.

nwtk2007 Loc: Texas

kemmer wrote:

I may be forgiven for not paying any attention to Russian state propaganda.

Everything you have is from western media from a president well known for his out and out lies and a media know for their out and out lies, not to mention suppression of news items for political purposes. Until you actually look at other sources and weigh the evidence then you can't possibly have a valid opinion.

And Putin NEVER said it would be easy (a cakewalk), ever.

kemmer

nwtk2007 wrote:

And Putin NEVER said it would be easy (a cakewalk), ever.

Putin said joyous Ukrainians would meet his troops with bouquets of flowers.

whole2th

kemmer wrote:

What is it about unprovoked invasion, war crimes, mass civilian graves, and wanton attacks on civilian apartment buildings that you don’t understand?

Russia/Putin were provoked is what I know.

Shelling the ethnic Russian regions for 8 years. Violations of the Minsk agreements that promised not to put NATO military presence on Russia's border via Ukraine. About 40 biolabs proximate to Russia. Shoot-down of MH17 which was blamed on Russia/Putin. And more.

kemmer--a sychophant for the people of the lie

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

whole2th wrote:

Russia/Putin were provoked is what I know.

Shelling the ethnic Russian regions for 8 years. Violations of the Minsk agreements that promised not to put NATO military presence on Russia's border via Ukraine. About 40 biolabs proximate to Russia. Shoot-down of MH17 which was blamed on Russia/Putin. And more.

The Bolshevik / Soviet Revolution

As they had during the 1905 War with Japan, the Communist revolutionaries used popular discontent over World War I and an economic crisis to foment another attempt at Revolution in 1917. The Bolshevik Reds promised agitated mobs that they would bring about a “worker’s paradise” - an earlier version of “Hope & Change”. Red leader Lenin returned to Russia in “the sealed train”, bringing with him sacks of gold given to him by the German banker Max Warburg; whose brother Paul was the chief architect behind the 1913 founding of the Federal Reserve System (Central Bank of the United States). Warburg and the German government knew that a revolution would undermine the Russian government and ultimately knock Russia out of the war. But Warburg’s motives were less than “patriotic”.
Financiers such as the Warburg Brothers, the Rothschild Clan, John D Rockefeller, JP Morgan and Jacob Schiff coveted control over Russia’s vast territory and resources. They saw the mighty Empire as the chief obstacle to their ultimate vision of global economic integration; an ambitious idea which, even back then, was openly discussed within the elite circles of London, Paris and New York.
In February of 1917, Tsar Nicholas was forced to abdicate. Russia became a democratic Republic led by the socialist Alexander Kerensky. The Tsar and his family were taken into custody with the expectation that they would eventually be exiled. Probably due Rothschild’s influence, Britain, the Tsar’s supposed “ally” refused to grant asylum to the Romanov family.
In October of that same year, the Bolsheviks staged a second revolution. Kerensky was overthrown and the Bolsheviks seized the city of St. Petersburg. Their dictatorial power grab would trigger a civil war. When the Tsar and his family fell into Bolshevik hands, efforts to exile the Romanovs ceased.
The Royal Family was marked for death. As a boy, Tsar Nicholas had witnessed the bombing murder of his grandfather, Alexander II, in 1881. The same fate now awaits him and his beautiful family.
On the evening of July 16/17, 1918, the Romanov Family was awakened at 2AM, told to dress, and then herded into the cellar of the house in which they were being held. Moments later, Bolshevik killers stormed in and gunned down the entire family, their doctor and three servants. Some of the Romanov daughters were stabbed and clubbed to death after initial gunfire had failed to kill them. News of the brutal murder of the Romanovs sent shock waves throughout Russia and all of Christian Europe.

The Communist Party of America was also part of the Trotsky-Lenin ‘Comintern’
To win the Civil War, the Reds used strategic terror to intimidate their White adversaries into submission. On orders from Lenin and Trotsky, the "Red Terror" was announced by Yakov Sverlov. The Red Terror was marked by mass arrests in the middle of the night, executions, and hideously creative tactics of torture. As many as 100,000 Russians were brutally tortured and murdered during the Red Terror, carried out by the ‘Cheka’ (secret police).
Lenin and Trotsky’s oppression of the Russian people broke their strength and will to resist the Reds. ‘The Famine of 1921’ was partly due to the folly of central economic planning, as well as to a deliberate effort to kill off any Russians still not willing to support the Red takeover.
The Communists-Bolsheviks had run the money-printing presses to finance their civil war and welfare schemes. When inflation followed, they imposed price controls; causing farmers to lose money by farming. The shortages were compounded by the Reds’ seizure of seeds and food. The horrific famine was then used to selectively feed those regions submissive to the Reds, and starve out those loyal to the White factions.
Hungry Russians and Ukrainians resorted to eating grass and even cannibalism. The horror escalated when Lenin deliberately blocked foreign relief efforts. When the death toll reached 8-10 million, (1) Lenin finally relented. Were it not for the mostly American aid, the death toll for Lenin and Trotsky’s cruel folly might have doubled or tripled.
The demoralizing terror took a heavy psychological toll on the frightened people of the former Russian Empire. By 1922, many will have been broken into total submission to the Red monsters of the dreaded Cheka. At the conclusion of the Red Terror, Red Famine, and Red-White Civil War, Lenin and Trotsky formally established the Soviet Union with its capital city in Moscow. The former Russian Empire was now also known as the USSR (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics).
The Communist giant spanned the Eurasian landmass. Of its multi-ethnic "republics" the Russian republic was by far the largest and most populated. The well-known criminal brutality of the Soviets shocked the world, as did the bold Communist declarations to overthrow all other nations from within; including the United States. For these reasons, three consecutive American Presidents (Harding, Coolidge, Hoover), all refused to diplomatically recognize the Soviet Union. It was not until 1933 that President Franklin D Roosevelt, with string support from the NY Times & Washington Post, granted recognition to the Soviet Union.
As Bolshevism fastened its death grip over Russia, the parallel movement known as Globalism was gaining added momentum in the West. During this time, the Royal Institute of International Affairs (now Chatham House) was founded in London and the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) was established in New York City, with “Father of the Federal Reserve” Paul Warburg serving as CFR’s first Director. To this day, these influential “think tanks” work toward global economic and political integration. To that end, these same players set up the ‘League of Nations’ (forerunner of the United Nations) soon after the end of World War I.
"Chatham House Rules" of secrecy govern the members of both of these exclusive clubs. Membership is by invitation only. Members may discuss generalities of group meetings, but are expected to remain discreet concerning who attends the meetings and what is said.
Up until the present day, the membership roster of the CFR & Chatham has consisted of top names from politics, media, banking, business, and academia. Membership has included Finance Capitalists, Communists, “Neo-Conservatives”, ambitious careerists, and starry eyed academic types. The chosen few recruited by these Globalist groups often find themselves on a fast track to greater fame and fortune. Prior to the actual establishment of the CFR, these Globalists had worked to destroy the Tsar. Today, their successors seek to destroy Putin.
Banking is institutionalized murder:
http://henrymakow.com/2014/07/banking-is-institutionalized-m.html

nwtk2007 Loc: Texas

whole2th wrote:

Russia/Putin were provoked is what I know.

Shelling the ethnic Russian regions for 8 years. Violations of the Minsk agreements that promised not to put NATO military presence on Russia's border via Ukraine. About 40 biolabs proximate to Russia. Shoot-down of MH17 which was blamed on Russia/Putin. And more.

Great meme. It reminds me of the leftists democrats like Schiff, Nadler, Pelosi, Schumer, etc, etc and all the ones wo parrot the same lies over and over again.

eagleye13 Loc: Fl

nwtk2007 wrote:

Great meme. It reminds me of the leftists democrats like Schiff, Nadler, Pelosi, Schumer, etc, etc and all the ones wo parrot the same lies over and over again.

They want both an arm and a leg!
Another reason I don’t golf!

Take the penalty (Hole 16 Oak Crest Golf Club, Florida) Get your Tums ready ... Not for the weak stomach.

Except for a misinterpretation of the rules (lateral hazard: one stroke) the lesson seems accurate. ..... the ball was in the pond on Hole 16 at Oak Crest Golf Club/Florida.

......it was a brand new Titlelist with the Verso logo on it and he didn't want to lose it OR take the two stroke penalty as he was already behind in points!

He reached in to retrieve the golf ball . . .

https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-XQfNcqEiTKw%2FYVJW-LVuq7I%2FAAAAAAAAypo%2F42zTkrx-itkZbIinD-qtLWPS5Mc6_bRnQCLcBGAsYHQ%2Fs580%2F1.jpeg&data=05%7C01%7C%7C66a184163fc74a6c682e08da804be1c9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637963360647618194%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=YDLNlAYMV%2BTFhNC4qJ%2BMp3PmhB04AqXSwbE%2FhBXGSAc%3D&reserved=0

https://ecp.yusercontent.com/mail?url=https%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-npmFGOYIYP4%2FYVJW-DJzSHI%2FAAAAAAAAyps%2FXKgPmZemR6YmdwFw0JJA2mtatuXJW1WBQCLcBGAsYHQ%2Fw640-h440%2F2.jpeg&t=1670001615&ymreqid=dabe3c22-f422-7a26-1c2c-9a000c019300&sig=7.M9P6NhoNr1uI3JiI5ynA--~D

https://ecp.yusercontent.com/mail?url=https%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-oLshyzUjUnY%2FYVJW_e8JmKI%2FAAAAAAAAyp8%2FLk4zujFNFEoHM-ABrMMVkmLQLl3P3Ei6gCLcBGAsYHQ%2Fw640-h480%2F6.jpeg&t=1670001615&ymreqid=dabe3c22-f422-7a26-1c2c-9a000c019300&sig=s.HzxghDEGRpRXAgxTjGzw--~D

kemmer

whole2th wrote:

Shoot-down of MH17 which was blamed on Russia/Putin.

The Court in The Hague last week judged that it was Russia’s doing. I remember when you used to say the plane was loaded with embalmed bodies. Why should anyone believe you now?

kemmer

eagleye13 wrote:

The Bolshevik / Soviet Revolution

As they had during the 1905 War with Japan, the Communist revolutionaries used popular discontent over World War I and an economic crisis to foment another attempt at Revolution in 1917. The Bolshevik Reds promised agitated mobs that they would bring about a “worker’s paradise” - an earlier version of “Hope & Change”. Red leader Lenin returned to Russia in “the sealed train”, bringing with him sacks of gold given to him by the German banker Max Warburg; whose brother Paul was the chief architect behind the 1913 founding of the Federal Reserve System (Central Bank of the United States). Warburg and the German government knew that a revolution would undermine the Russian government and ultimately knock Russia out of the war. But Warburg’s motives were less than “patriotic”.
Financiers such as the Warburg Brothers, the Rothschild Clan, John D Rockefeller, JP Morgan and Jacob Schiff coveted control over Russia’s vast territory and resources. They saw the mighty Empire as the chief obstacle to their ultimate vision of global economic integration; an ambitious idea which, even back then, was openly discussed within the elite circles of London, Paris and New York.
In February of 1917, Tsar Nicholas was forced to abdicate. Russia became a democratic Republic led by the socialist Alexander Kerensky. The Tsar and his family were taken into custody with the expectation that they would eventually be exiled. Probably due Rothschild’s influence, Britain, the Tsar’s supposed “ally” refused to grant asylum to the Romanov family.
In October of that same year, the Bolsheviks staged a second revolution. Kerensky was overthrown and the Bolsheviks seized the city of St. Petersburg. Their dictatorial power grab would trigger a civil war. When the Tsar and his family fell into Bolshevik hands, efforts to exile the Romanovs ceased.
The Royal Family was marked for death. As a boy, Tsar Nicholas had witnessed the bombing murder of his grandfather, Alexander II, in 1881. The same fate now awaits him and his beautiful family.
On the evening of July 16/17, 1918, the Romanov Family was awakened at 2AM, told to dress, and then herded into the cellar of the house in which they were being held. Moments later, Bolshevik killers stormed in and gunned down the entire family, their doctor and three servants. Some of the Romanov daughters were stabbed and clubbed to death after initial gunfire had failed to kill them. News of the brutal murder of the Romanovs sent shock waves throughout Russia and all of Christian Europe.

The Communist Party of America was also part of the Trotsky-Lenin ‘Comintern’
To win the Civil War, the Reds used strategic terror to intimidate their White adversaries into submission. On orders from Lenin and Trotsky, the "Red Terror" was announced by Yakov Sverlov. The Red Terror was marked by mass arrests in the middle of the night, executions, and hideously creative tactics of torture. As many as 100,000 Russians were brutally tortured and murdered during the Red Terror, carried out by the ‘Cheka’ (secret police).
Lenin and Trotsky’s oppression of the Russian people broke their strength and will to resist the Reds. ‘The Famine of 1921’ was partly due to the folly of central economic planning, as well as to a deliberate effort to kill off any Russians still not willing to support the Red takeover.
The Communists-Bolsheviks had run the money-printing presses to finance their civil war and welfare schemes. When inflation followed, they imposed price controls; causing farmers to lose money by farming. The shortages were compounded by the Reds’ seizure of seeds and food. The horrific famine was then used to selectively feed those regions submissive to the Reds, and starve out those loyal to the White factions.
Hungry Russians and Ukrainians resorted to eating grass and even cannibalism. The horror escalated when Lenin deliberately blocked foreign relief efforts. When the death toll reached 8-10 million, (1) Lenin finally relented. Were it not for the mostly American aid, the death toll for Lenin and Trotsky’s cruel folly might have doubled or tripled.
The demoralizing terror took a heavy psychological toll on the frightened people of the former Russian Empire. By 1922, many will have been broken into total submission to the Red monsters of the dreaded Cheka. At the conclusion of the Red Terror, Red Famine, and Red-White Civil War, Lenin and Trotsky formally established the Soviet Union with its capital city in Moscow. The former Russian Empire was now also known as the USSR (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics).
The Communist giant spanned the Eurasian landmass. Of its multi-ethnic "republics" the Russian republic was by far the largest and most populated. The well-known criminal brutality of the Soviets shocked the world, as did the bold Communist declarations to overthrow all other nations from within; including the United States. For these reasons, three consecutive American Presidents (Harding, Coolidge, Hoover), all refused to diplomatically recognize the Soviet Union. It was not until 1933 that President Franklin D Roosevelt, with string support from the NY Times & Washington Post, granted recognition to the Soviet Union.
As Bolshevism fastened its death grip over Russia, the parallel movement known as Globalism was gaining added momentum in the West. During this time, the Royal Institute of International Affairs (now Chatham House) was founded in London and the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) was established in New York City, with “Father of the Federal Reserve” Paul Warburg serving as CFR’s first Director. To this day, these influential “think tanks” work toward global economic and political integration. To that end, these same players set up the ‘League of Nations’ (forerunner of the United Nations) soon after the end of World War I.
"Chatham House Rules" of secrecy govern the members of both of these exclusive clubs. Membership is by invitation only. Members may discuss generalities of group meetings, but are expected to remain discreet concerning who attends the meetings and what is said.
Up until the present day, the membership roster of the CFR & Chatham has consisted of top names from politics, media, banking, business, and academia. Membership has included Finance Capitalists, Communists, “Neo-Conservatives”, ambitious careerists, and starry eyed academic types. The chosen few recruited by these Globalist groups often find themselves on a fast track to greater fame and fortune. Prior to the actual establishment of the CFR, these Globalists had worked to destroy the Tsar. Today, their successors seek to destroy Putin.
Banking is institutionalized murder:
http://henrymakow.com/2014/07/banking-is-institutionalized-m.html

The Bolshevik / Soviet Revolution br br As they... (show quote)

How many times are you going to post your little history lesson in an attempt to justify Putin’s crimes in Ukraine?

kemmer

nwtk2007 wrote:

Great meme. It reminds me of the leftists democrats like Schiff, Nadler, Pelosi, Schumer, etc, etc and all the ones wo parrot the same lies over and over again.

😂😂😂. Do tell.

nwtk2007 Loc: Texas

kemmer wrote:

How many times are you going to post your little history lesson in an attempt to justify Putin’s crimes in Ukraine?

How many times will you ignore it?

kemmer

nwtk2007 wrote:

How many times will you ignore it?

Oh. as many times as I've ignored eagleye posting his hideous selfie.

whole2th

kemmer wrote:

The Court in The Hague last week judged that it was Russia’s doing. I remember when you used to say the plane was loaded with embalmed bodies. Why should anyone believe you now?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dd81fppe9jge8c8/CC%2018%2B%20MH17%20is%20MH370%21.mp4?dl=0 Find someone who speaks Russian to confirm the accuracy of the captions. I’ve done this and conclude the plane carried already dead bodies—inconsistent with the claimed white European passenger list.

kemmer

whole2th wrote:

I’ve done this and conclude the plane carried already dead bodies

We're all impressed with your amazing insight.