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Should there be Reparations for slavery???
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Mar 1, 2019 11:15:27   #
JoyV
 
acknowledgeurma wrote:
I guess my layout wasn't as clear as I thought. Johnson's "tragically great" was my overall assessment of his presidency. On foreign policy, I gave him a D instead of an F, because he didn't nuke Hanoi and he decided to not try to be reelected, but instead devoted his efforts to bringing the North Vietnamese into negotiations (foiled by Nixon's subversive conspiracy with the South Vietnamese).

Truman was a tough SOB. As an artillery captain in WWI, he kept his guns firing up to the last second, causing who knows how much needless suffering (and end to all suffering for how many?). One of the best things he did was fire the crazy narcissist MacArthur.

Carter is a great ex-president. I think his Fed Chair Volcker gets unwarranted credit for bringing the inflation of the 70's under control. I think it mainly ended because the effects of OPEC finally percolated through the world economy. I think Carter's restraint in the face of Iran's invasion of US territory was admirable. Who knows what would have happened if not for a sandstorm?

Clinton, hmm...the best thing about him was Robert Reich.

Obama, near great because he didn't flub the Great Recession recovery. The length of which may be due to the Republican's resistance to most of the stimulus he proposed. Also, near great, because I need to keep peace with my partner. Also he seems to be honored more outside his own land.
I guess my layout wasn't as clear as I thought. Jo... (show quote)


You can't spend your way out of a recession. New money has to come in instead of just being shifted around. The 'spend your way out' approah of Obama had money from taxpayers going to various federal programs while those administering the programs siphon off their cut and the politicians' cuts. With each cycle, more and more money lines the pockets of the politicians and administrators, while the taxpayers get hit harder and harder. Businesses stagnate, out-source, or collapse, leaving more people in line for the government hand-outs. The only reason this wasn't the ultimate result of FDRs New Deal spending was WWII. Businesses expanded to meet the war effort which created LOTS of jobs which were NOT paid for by taxpayers!!!!

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Mar 1, 2019 11:28:21   #
JoyV
 
acknowledgeurma wrote:
You wrote, "Although the majority of freed slaves chose to work for wages instead of taking up land ownership. Most of those who took the land wound up selling it back to whites...".

I took issue with the idea that "most chose to work for wages". From what I read in some states they were not allowed to purchase land so the only alternative was to become wage slaves. Also, most who could take up land, didn't take up offers of free land, but purchased it (all be it seemingly at below the market rate). And even though black farm ownership increased after the war (mainly through purchase), economic downturns harmed black ownership more that white.
You wrote, "Although the majority of freed sl... (show quote)


I won't quibble over whether it was "most" or many. Nor do I disagree that they faced extreme opposition from whites, especially Democratic whites. What I posted about choosing wages over land came from the Wikipedia article posted by another. I never challenged the wage assertion by doing my own research, so will not hold firm to it.

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Mar 1, 2019 12:58:58   #
Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton
 
acknowledgeurma wrote:
Is "debate" the OPP code for name calling?

Ha! Apparently. You called it!

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Mar 1, 2019 13:28:01   #
proud republican Loc: RED CALIFORNIA
 
Larry the Legend wrote:
Ha! Apparently. You called it!


I love your Avatar,Larry!!!

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Mar 1, 2019 13:41:44   #
Bcon
 
JoyV wrote:
1)Bay of Pigs. During the period between the election and his inauguration, JFK was briefed on a CIA plan developed within the Eisenhower administration to train Cuban exiles for an invasion of their homeland. The United States was distrustful of Fidel Castro, the leader of Cuba, and wary of his relationship with Nikita Khrushchev, the Soviet premier. The plan anticipated that support from the Cuban people and perhaps even from elements of the Cuban military would lead to the overthrow of Castro and the establishment of a non-communist government friendly to the United States. His fault that he allowed the prevailing wisdom of the CIA and Eisenhower to allow it to continue over his reluctance for the plan.

2) Vietnam. So getting assassinated was sticking it to Johnson? He was pulling out. In fact, that is one of the hypothesis on why he was assassinated. Another being his pro-civil rights stance. Johnson reversed his plan and beefed things up.

3) Civil Rights. Again he died before his Civil Rights proposal had been passed as a bill let alone signed by him. Johnson signed it and got the credit. By the 1960 presidential campaign, civil rights had emerged as a crucial issue. Just a few weeks before the election, Martin Luther King Jr. was arrested while leading a protest in Atlanta, Georgia. John Kennedy phoned his wife, Coretta Scott King to express his concern, while a call from Robert Kennedy to the judge helped secure her husband's safe release. The Kennedys' personal intervention led to a public endorsement by Martin Luther King Sr., the influential father of the civil rights leader.

Across the nation, more than 70 percent of African Americans voted for Kennedy, and these votes provided the winning edge in several key states. When President Kennedy took office in January 1961, African Americans had high expectations for the new administration.

Thank you JoyV. A great history lesson. Even living through the era, we do not realize everything that happened and the causes of the happenings. Then, after a while, we get a lot of skewed history.. you do great research.

But Kennedy's narrow election victory and small working margin in Congress left him cautious. He was reluctant to lose southern support for legislation on many fronts by pushing too hard on civil rights legislation. Instead, he appointed unprecedented numbers of African Americans to high-level positions in the administration and strengthened the Civil Rights Commission. He spoke out in favor of school desegregation, praised a number of cities for integrating their schools, and put Vice President Lyndon Johnson in charge of the President's Committee on Equal Employment Opportunity. Attorney General Robert Kennedy turned his attention to voting rights, initiating five times the number of suits brought during the previous administration.

In 1962, James H. Meredith Jr., an African American Air Force veteran, was denied admission to the University of Mississippi, known as "Ole Miss." Meredith attempted to register four times without success.

Long telephone conversations between the president, the attorney general, and Governor Ross Barnett failed to produce a solution. When federal marshals accompanied Meredith to campus in another attempt to register for classes, rioting erupted. Two people died and dozens were injured. President Kennedy mobilized the National Guard and sent federal troops to the campus. Meredith registered the next day and attended his first class, and segregation ended at the University of Mississippi.

After the Bull Conner fiasco, invoking federal authority, President Kennedy sent several thousand troops to an Alabama air base, and his administration responded by speeding up the drafting of a comprehensive civil rights bill.

Governor George Wallace had vowed at his inauguration to defend "segregation now, segregation tomorrow, and segregation forever." In June 1963, he upheld his promise to "stand in the schoolhouse door" to prevent two black students from enrolling at the University of Alabama. To protect the students and secure their admission, President Kennedy federalized the Alabama National Guard. And on June 11, the president addressed the nation.

Kennedy defined the civil rights crisis as moral, as well as constitutional and legal. He announced that major civil rights legislation would be submitted to the Congress to guarantee equal access to public facilities, to end segregation in education, and to provide federal protection of the right to vote.

Kennedy's comprehensive civil rights bill cleared several hurdles in Congress and won the endorsement of House and Senate Republican leaders. It was not passed, however, before November 22, 1963, when President Kennedy was assassinated. The bill was left in the hands of Lyndon B. Johnson. Before becoming vice president, Johnson had served more than two decades in Congress as a congressman and senator from Texas. He used his connections with southern white congressional leaders, and with the assistance of Robert Kennedy’s Justice Department and the outpouring of emotion after the president's assassination, the Civil Rights Act was passed as a way to honor President Kennedy.

4) Taxes. Kennedy had campaigned on the slogan of “getting America moving again” He battled congress over his tax cut plan as the socialist idea that the way to increase the economic wealth was by spending us out of a recession. Those in favor of high taxes claimed the ending of the depression had nothing to do with WWII but was all due to FDRs New Deal spending. JFK disagreed! And 60% of Americans agreed with JFK.
1)Bay of Pigs. During the period between the elect... (show quote)

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Mar 1, 2019 14:51:13   #
Sonny Magoo Loc: Where pot pie is boiled in a kettle
 
The more I think about it.
When you look at the big picture.
Reparations are flowing and have been flowing long enough. And when you consider educational, social, and economical. ...somebody owes somebody else!

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Mar 1, 2019 18:26:57   #
Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton
 
proud republican wrote:
I love your Avatar,Larry!!!

Why thank you. As you'll remember, I started out with the dragon, then the fierce dog, now I've graduated to the 'flaming finger'. I'm actually starting to wonder how I'm going to top that one.

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Check out topic: Biden v Trump Debate Topics?
Mar 1, 2019 18:56:22   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Larry the Legend wrote:
Why thank you. As you'll remember, I started out with the dragon, then the fierce dog, now I've graduated to the 'flaming finger'. I'm actually starting to wonder how I'm going to top that one.


With the flaming 'rooster' of course

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Mar 1, 2019 18:59:00   #
Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
With the flaming 'rooster' of course

Hmm. Interesting.....

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Mar 1, 2019 19:01:57   #
Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
With the flaming 'rooster' of course


How about this?



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Mar 1, 2019 19:02:43   #
proud republican Loc: RED CALIFORNIA
 
Larry the Legend wrote:
How about this?



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Mar 1, 2019 19:09:03   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Larry the Legend wrote:
How about this?


"rooster"... Note the quotation marks

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Mar 1, 2019 19:10:50   #
Larry the Legend Loc: Not hiding in Milton
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
"rooster"... Note the quotation marks

Are you trying to get me in trouble? You know I'd do it...

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Mar 1, 2019 19:12:39   #
proud republican Loc: RED CALIFORNIA
 
Larry the Legend wrote:
Are you trying to get me in trouble? You know I'd do it...


Is that what you call IT nowdays???

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Mar 3, 2019 09:45:16   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
proud republican wrote:
What do you guys think???.....As for me...My ancestors werent even here....And if we were going to give reparations for this,then how about reparations to Russian Jews whose ancestors were murdered by Nazi Germany in Concentration Death Camps...Should we ask Germany to pay Jewish people for something that their Nazi ancestors were responsible for???....Simple question...


"What do you guys think???.....As for me...My ancestors weren't even here.."

Democrats are still here!!!
There should be reparations from Democrats!!!!

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