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Understanding climate change.
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Dec 24, 2015 23:43:01   #
hejohnson43 Loc: Portal, Ga.
 
The problem is the youngsters have been brain washed since grade school or since they were toddlers. Climate has been changing since the begging of time. Like the one scientist said, the volcano in Iceland that erupted a few years ago, put more pollution into the Atmosphere than Man kind has in the last 100 years. All you have to do is watch Jesse Waters interviews on fox news to see how many brain dead young people there are out there. You sound like you are brain dead also or brainwashed.

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Dec 25, 2015 00:42:47   #
EconomistDon
 
Glaucon wrote:
Let's not argue as we will both be dead from old age before earth will no longer have a climate that will sustain humans. Old minds are often impossible to change no matter how convincing the evidence.


Did the earth lose its ability to sustain humans during the warming in 1100 B.C.; no civilization was making great strides in Egypt and Mesopotamia where mathematics, science, and the written language were being developed. Did the earth lose its ability to sustain humans during the Roman Empire in 200 A.D.; no, the Romans expanded their empire throughout most of Europe, developing culture, laws , and modern conveniences like indoor plumbing. Did the Earth lose its ability to sustain humans during the Medieval Warming in 1300; no the cold and plagues of the Dark Ages gave way to the Renaissance that gave us art, literature, and a tremendous expansion in economic development.

Glaucon, do not fear the warmth. Warmth is good, cold is bad.



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Dec 25, 2015 00:51:58   #
EconomistDon
 
Glaucon wrote:
The experts agree that much of dangerous climate change is man made and you are certain they are all wrong. Amazing.


No Glaucon!! The scientific experts do not agree with that. Only the politicians and their paid pseudo-scientists agree with that. REAL scientists agree that the Sun and its varying output are responsible for climate change. The solar cycle and climate cycle are will do what they damn well want to do regardless of man. Trying to stop global warming would be like trying to stop a hurricane.

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Dec 25, 2015 00:58:50   #
RWNJ
 
EconomistDon wrote:
No Glaucon!! The scientific experts do not agree with that. Only the politicians and their paid pseudo-scientists agree with that. REAL scientists agree that the Sun and its varying output are responsible for climate change. The solar cycle and climate cycle are will do what they damn well want to do regardless of man. Trying to stop global warming would be like trying to stop a hurricane.


Theoretically, we could stop a hurricane. If a hydrogen bomb was detonated in the eye of the storm, it would stop it in it's tracks. But then we'd have to deal with the radiation. Oh well.

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Dec 25, 2015 01:27:58   #
EconomistDon
 
Glaucon wrote:
The scientific evidence will and should always be open to question, but the data supports the hypothesis that a large part of climate change Is man made and the deniers have a lot of gossip and no data. I have to go with the scientists. To not do so is like thinking you are going to win the lottery and betting your life you are going to win. You could win the lottery and climate change could be a hoax, but that is not the way to bet.


If you go with scientists, you support the truth that the solar cycle is entirely responsible for the climate cycle. There is no scientific proof that CO2 is responsible. Certainly, CO2 is a greenhouse gas, but at 400 parts per million in the atmosphere, its greenhouse contribution is minuscule. Please understand that 400 parts per million means that CO2 is only 0.04 percent of the atmosphere. Real scientists understand that. The science that you support is 30 years old, and supported only by politicians and alarmists.

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Dec 25, 2015 01:51:09   #
beammeupscotty Loc: 31°07'50.8"N 87°27'00.8"W
 
EconomistDon wrote:
If you go with scientists, you support the truth that the solar cycle is entirely responsible for the climate cycle. There is no scientific proof that CO2 is responsible. Certainly, CO2 is a greenhouse gas, but at 400 parts per million in the atmosphere, its greenhouse contribution is minuscule. Please understand that 400 parts per million means that CO2 is only 0.04 percent of the atmosphere. Real scientists understand that. The science that you support is 30 years old, and supported only by politicians and alarmists.
If you go with scientists, you support the truth t... (show quote)



The untold fact is they have no idea what a "healthy" Co2 saturation level "is". Nor do they know how much plants would absorb under "ideal" conditions. No Sir, the "science" is no where near freakin' settled.
Besides, we all know it's about "global government" not "global climate change"

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Dec 25, 2015 02:01:12   #
EconomistDon
 
nwtk2007 wrote:
That is the truth. Computer models are built on data. The data is incomplete, yes, but it is data, and it is factual.


Actually not. NOAA had land temperature data that lined up well with satellite data until recently. It would seem that too much attention was being given to the undeniable trend of stable temperatures since 1998. This just did not fit NOAA's alarmist agenda that claimed continued warming along with rising CO2 levels. So they CHANGED their data. They came up with many reasons for the revised data, claiming new parking lots, missing thermometers, etc., etc., etc. Now viola, their temperature shows continued warming. Problem is, it doesn't line up with satellite temperature data. Satellite data are consistent, no new parking lots, no forests cut down, no nothing, just consistent readings. And, stable temperatures since 1998. SOOOO, data are not always factual, especially when they are adjusted by alarmists.

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Check out topic: Pretending It All Works
Dec 25, 2015 02:17:21   #
EconomistDon
 
permafrost wrote:
I would like to mention "clean coal", once a favorite topic of mine..

The coal industry refused to do research for this back in 1990 or so, now we see that result.

But a bit of research is lingering via the green people you love to hate.

Down in Texas, at a very large power plant a test is being done which captures the CO2, captures it and makes long term storage possible.. They may indeed find a method which puts coal back in our menu of energy solutions..

But it will not be by any action of the very corporations who are now paying the price for refusing to fund this sort of research...
I would like to mention "clean coal", on... (show quote)


Perm, that technology is not new. It is very expensive and cannot be implemented profitably. But it does not have to be, because CO2 is not a source of global warming. Until politicians and the general public finally agree with scientists on that, we will continue to destroy hundreds of thousands of jobs in coal mining, trucking, railroad, and coal-fired utility plants. These are good-paying jobs for middle-class Americans that are being destroyed, all because of the AGW fraud.

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Dec 25, 2015 02:25:08   #
RWNJ
 
EconomistDon wrote:
Did the earth lose its ability to sustain humans during the warming in 1100 B.C.; no civilization was making great strides in Egypt and Mesopotamia where mathematics, science, and the written language were being developed. Did the earth lose its ability to sustain humans during the Roman Empire in 200 A.D.; no, the Romans expanded their empire throughout most of Europe, developing culture, laws , and modern conveniences like indoor plumbing. Did the Earth lose its ability to sustain humans during the Medieval Warming in 1300; no the cold and plagues of the Dark Ages gave way to the Renaissance that gave us art, literature, and a tremendous expansion in economic development.

Glaucon, do not fear the warmth. Warmth is good, cold is bad.
Did the earth lose its ability to sustain humans d... (show quote)


Question. How are they able to determine the temperature thousands of years ago? They didn't have thermometers, nor did they keep records.

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Dec 25, 2015 05:57:56   #
mark13 Loc: usa
 
Glaucon wrote:
The problem is that the oldsters may not be dying off fast enough for us to take action against man made climate change and the resulting human extinction.

“Scientific proof does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it.” Max Planck


Science Fraud is foisted off on a collectivist indoctrinated : 'dummied' down public under the pretense of America caused climate change... an exceptionally stupid, Hate America to destruction, enviro-commee lie.

There is, in fact, no science going on on the face of this planet = in this solar system = in this universe that even vaguely supports Anthropogenic [Man caused] climate change...

the actual KNOWN historical climate drivers are occurring 'all at once' = at virtually the exact same moment in geological history 'AS A UNIQUE EVENT THAT HAS NEVER OCCURED BEFORE IN ALL OF THIS PLANETS KNOW HISTORY !” what part of the actual Natural geological forces : science that is changing our climate and shaping our environment RIGHT NOW ! today ! do you not understand ???

Apparently none of the NATURAL controlling : driving historical geological forces in motion today... all of which Solar - Global - nino driven climate change Natural forces are unaffected by the outright lies that you puny Humanists just make up and spew to advance you hate America to destruction agendas.

[treat my whole statement as a quote from me] then, wash your mouth out with soap and go Enjoy the day.

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Dec 25, 2015 09:25:31   #
EconomistDon
 
RWNJ wrote:
Question. How are they able to determine the temperature thousands of years ago? They didn't have thermometers, nor did they keep records.


History books and archaeology give clues during the past few thousand years. When Eric the Red and his son Lief Ericsson lived in Greenland around 1000 A.D., there was far less ice than now. They called it Greenland for a reason. But decedents of the Norse men had to abandon Greenland when the Little Ice Age covered the it with ice. The area where they lived is still buried deep in ice.

More ancient temperatures are determined from ice cores. Antarctica has been covered in ice for more than 4 million years. Ice core drilling can reach that ancient ice to look at its composition. We have been in a long-term ice age for more than 4 million years. Prior to that, there was no ice in Antarctica, or anywhere else in the world. Antarctica was covered with forest. The world was once covered with huge, dense vegetation that thrived in much warmer temperatures and much higher CO2 levels than now; and that vegetation became today's coal and oil deposits.

Here is a chart of temperatures during the last 400,000 years as measured from Antarctic ice cores. Use caution reading the time scale, it is logarithmic. Ancient times are squeezed together while recent times are stretched out.



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Dec 25, 2015 19:28:44   #
Glaucon
 
RWNJ wrote:
Several Blatant Lies... Here Are 3 of Them

*Lie No.1: The World Is Getting Hotter . . .FAST!

You’ve heard how the earth is rapidly heating up . . . causing drought and mayhem.

For sure, the media jumps on the “global warming” story every time there is a heat wave and each time a hurricane hits the East Coast.

But how much has the world really warmed?

Well, according to NASA’s own data, the world has warmed .36 degrees Fahrenheit over the last 35 years (they started measuring the data in 1979).

I think you would agree that a .36 degree increase in temperature over the last 35 years is hardly anything to get in a panic about.

Granted, that does mean the world is warmer, right?

The problem with that argument is that we experienced the bulk of that warming between 1979 and 1998 . . . we’ve actually had temperatures DROPPING ever since!

Fact: We Haven't Seen Any 'Global Warming' for 17 Years!

The reality is this: The world is 1.08 degrees cooler than it was in 1998.

Just take a look at this chart from Remote Sensing Systems, which provides data to NASA, NOAA, and other scientific organizations.



If you’re like me, this makes a lot of sense.

We’ve had cooler summers and longer winters.

Again, take one more look at the chart above — global warming reversed its rise in 1998. In the dossier John handed me, he explains exactly why this happened . . . and what’s going to happen next.

But for now, just keep this fact in your back pocket: the case for “global warming” is dead in its tracks.

Lie No. 2: The Oceans Are Getting Warmer

“Global warming” proponents have said for a long time we’d see a heating of the oceans.

This proposition is necessary, since it means all those big chunks of ice are supposed to melt, killing off polar bears and causing states like Florida to get swallowed up by water.

In 2007, while accepting his Nobel Prize for his “global warming” initiative (and quietly pocketing millions of dollars), Al Gore made a striking prediction . . .

“The North Polar ice cap is falling off a cliff. It could be completely
gone in summer in as little as seven years. Seven years from now.”

Fact: The North Polar Ice Cap Is Increasing in Size!


The arctic ice caps have increased in size by 43% to 63%.
It is seven years later, and recent satellite images show that not only have the icecaps not melted . . . but they’ve expanded in size by 43% to 63%.

Here’s what a Globe and Mail article had to say: “An area twice the size of Alaska — America's biggest state — was open water two years ago and is now covered in ice.”

I think we know who’s using actual science, and who’s fear-mongering their way to wealth and fame.

Since 2002, the ocean temperatures have fluctuated less than 1 degree Fahrenheit. There is no warming.

Again, there is nothing to get hysterical about here.

Lie No. 3: Scientists Agree — Humans Are Causing ‘Global Warming’ FAST!

You’ve heard for years how climate change has been caused by . . . well, you!

Al Gore and his liberal friends have stood onstage blaming you and your “gas-guzzling” car, standard four&#8209;bedroom house, and the factory downtown.


Al Gore spreads “Global Warming” propaganda for his own profit.
Shame on you, right?

Of course, the hypocrisy of the claim is that Al Gore himself racks up annual electric and gas bills of $30,000, more than 20 times the national average.

Now, while I am all for keeping the environment clean (I recycle, drive a fuel-efficient car, and reuse materials), humans have not caused “global warming” . . . nothing can be further from the truth.

Indeed, “global warming” alarmists and their allies in the liberal media are famous for saying that scientists agree that man has caused “global warming.”

President Obama even tweeted on May 16, 2014, “97% of scientists agree: climate change is real, man-made and dangerous.” John Kerry, Al Gore, and a host of others have championed this statistic.

Shame on Them, Because That 97% Figure Is Completely Fabricated.

NOTE: I’ve shared a quick snapshot of the facts in John’s controversial 164-page document. Truth be told, John has 33 scientifically reviewed reasons that “global warming” is more than just a farce . . . it’s the product of bad, botched science. In John’s own words, the research in this document is “something you have not been allowed to hear for almost 20 years.” That is, the truth about our climate, the politicians manipulating the science, and the real key that controls our planet’s temperature — the sun.
As The Wall Street Journal reported, “The assertion that 97% of scientists believe that climate change is a man-made, urgent problem is a fiction.”

When further review was done, it was discovered that a mere 1% of scientists believe human activity is causing most of the climate change.

In outrage, a petition was signed by more than 31,000 scientists that states “there is no convincing scientific evidence that human release of . . . carbon dioxide, methane, or other greenhouse gases is causing or will, in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating of the Earth's atmosphere and disruption of the Earth's climate."

Indeed, even a founding father of the man-made “global warming” theory — Claude Allegre — recently came out and renounced his position by admitting, “The cause of this climate change is unknown.”

Fact: There Has Always Been, And Always Will Be Climate Change

The reality is simply this: The climate changes over time.

When Alexander the Great was conquering Persia, climate change was a big factor. And we all learned in high school that the “little ice age” that rocked Europe killed hundreds of thousands of people from the 1600s through the 1800s. Additionally, we know about the heat wave and drought that wiped out much of America during the 1930s. Thousands of people were dislocated in search of survival.

Were those events caused by man-made “global warming”?

Of course not.

And, the reality is, most scientists who advocate “global warming” today know mankind has nothing to do with climate change.

Remember: Temperatures have only risen .36 degrees since 1979 . . . and the bulk of that happened during the 1990s! We haven’t seen any warming for the last 17 years . . . in fact we have seen a drop in temperatures.



Read more: http://www.newsmax.com/Finance/MKTNews/Global-Warming-climate-change/2014/11/17/id/607827/
Several Blatant Lies... Here Are 3 of Them br br ... (show quote)


If this nitwit is bloviating from the bar stool next to you, ignore him. He speaks nonsense and unless you also communicate nonsense, just ignore him.

Younger people and more educated people understand and are doing something about man made climate change and slow it down and try to prevent it. People who don't know and don't want to know who are less educated, ageing rapidly and dying off like RWNJ will solve the problem by dying off. They accept nonsense instead of information and come to unsubstantiated conclusions.

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Dec 25, 2015 19:32:45   #
Glaucon
 
nwtk2007 wrote:
II do agree with you about the taxing of citizens but it is obvious that you are not aware of some of the basics, like the difference between ice coverage and ice mass.
You are a danger to yourself and to humans who will face extinction if we bet on your bar room nonsense and ignore the findings of climate scientists.

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Dec 25, 2015 19:58:52   #
Artemis
 
EconomistDon wrote:
Actually not. NOAA had land temperature data that lined up well with satellite data until recently. It would seem that too much attention was being given to the undeniable trend of stable temperatures since 1998. This just did not fit NOAA's alarmist agenda that claimed continued warming along with rising CO2 levels. So they CHANGED their data. They came up with many reasons for the revised data, claiming new parking lots, missing thermometers, etc., etc., etc. Now viola, their temperature shows continued warming. Problem is, it doesn't line up with satellite temperature data. Satellite data are consistent, no new parking lots, no forests cut down, no nothing, just consistent readings. And, stable temperatures since 1998. SOOOO, data are not always factual, especially when they are adjusted by alarmists.
Actually not. NOAA had land temperature data that... (show quote)


Lovely weather we're having ain't it? :wink:
Warmest Christmas Eve on Record in many places. But there is no such thing as climate warming and 200 foreign country's don't believe it either, right. Just not credible.

http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/christmas-eve-record-warmth-ny/54313801

http://news.yahoo.com/climate-change-grinch-stole-europes-christmas190650954.html;_ylt=A0LEVvfn4n1W0QkAYFEnnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTByMjB0aG5zBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzYw--

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Dec 25, 2015 23:15:01   #
nwtk2007 Loc: Texas
 
Glaucon wrote:
You are a danger to yourself and to humans who will face extinction if we bet on your bar room nonsense and ignore the findings of climate scientists.


Dude, there is not the slightest chance that global warming will cause the extinction of man.

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