The real reason for high gas prices
May 22, 2014 11:09:57 #
I know we have had some lengthy discussions on OPP recently about economic realities, free enterprise, government regulations, corp tax rates and profits. I believe this article sheds some light and perspective on all of these.
I know the conservatives get it and I only hope this helps to enlighten the more extreme liberals, lowering their angry hate filled rhetoric just a bit.
Subject: The Real Reason For High Gas Prices
The real reasons for higher than necessary gasoline prices and regional shortages.
By Chip Beck
This article is long, but if you take the time to read it, perhaps a few things will come to light.
I have read and I have on good authority that one out of four Americans today is functionally illiterate, this means that they cannot read and comprehend a daily newspaper. Worse than that, approximately 50% of all adult Americans are numerically illiterate, meaning they cannot add, subtract, multiply, and divide three digit numbers using a sheet of paper and a pencil. It has also become abundantly clear that at least 95% of adult Americans are economically illiterate. The current national furor over high gasoline prices, with accusations by politicians and citizens alike of conspiracies and gouging by oil companies in collusion with one another are evidence of this. As I have on this forum in the past, I feel compelled here to point out a few basic economic principles, along with a few facts for you to ponder. Fact number one, current oil company profits on a gallon of gas at three dollars per gallon are currently 9% or about $.27 per gallon. Of that $.27, approximately 40% is taken by the government in taxes before the remaining 60% is distributed to shareholders. Thus the after-tax profit distributed to the tens of millions of Americans who own oil company stocks is about $.16 per gallon. There are no greedy oil company owners colluding with one another to gouge American citizens, only shareholders like you and me, our pension funds, our IRAs, and our investment portfolios. The largest American oil company is Exxon Mobil; they are the fifth largest oil company in the world and control less than 5% of the world oil market. The top three US oil companies combined control less than 10% of the world oil market. This is hardly a market dominating monopoly.
Large markets are more efficient than small markets. Any governmental regulation that inhibits the free flow of products or its production will result in either higher prices, product shortages, or both. Essential products like gasoline without readily available substitutes are by definition, inelastic, meaning that large increases in price will have only a small effect upon consumption. Nonessential products with readily available substitutes like apple juice are by definition, elastic, meaning that even small increases in price will have a large effect upon consumption.
Most products including automobiles and gasoline are assembled from multiple components as well as requiring numerous processes to produce the finished product. Any shortage of an essential component or any bottleneck in the manufacturing process will limit total production to the number that may be produced by what ever item is in shortest supply. It matters not a whit how abundant the other components or manufacturing processes are, nor does it matter what the bottleneck is. All that matters is that a bottleneck exists. The six speed transmission in the 2007 Ford Shelby GT500 Mustang is an example of such a bottleneck. Despite enormous demand for the Shelby version, Mustang sales were down 19% that year, the cars were available in large numbers, and Ford Motor Co. would obviously have liked to sell them. But because only 10,000 of the six speed transmissions necessary to build a Shelby GT500 were available to Ford that year, total production (and Shelby sales) were limited to 10,000.
I have not seen in any publication, nor have I heard on any newscasts the actual reason for today's high gasoline prices. There is a reason why gasoline is about $.50 to $.75 per gallon more expensive today than it should be given today's price of oil. And though the reason is not obvious or even readily apparent to those outside the gas & oil business, neither is it particularly difficult to explain or to understand. So here you go.
Up until the 1970s in the United States gasoline was essentially a commodity. Produced in over 150 refineries nationwide gasoline was piped or trucked wherever it was needed. A production disruption or breakdown in any one refinery affected less than 1% of the national supply. The vacuum created by one plant's production stoppage was immediately filled by product flowing in from other areas drawn to the affected region by temporarily higher prices. Much like the scooping of a bucket of water out of the surface of a lake is immediately filled by water rushing in from the rest of the lake, the force of Adam Smith's "invisible hand" sent gasoline quickly and efficiently where ever it was needed. Prices were essentially equal, coast to coast. But in the late 1970s, government and its well meaning yet isolated and economically ignorant bureaucrats got involved. First was the State of California deciding that it needed its own special blend of gasoline. Next high altitude areas decided a special blend would be better for them too. State after state and county after county decided to dictate special fuel blends for their communities as well. Four years ago the number of refineries in the United States had shrunk to about 100 due to environmental regulations and government mandates. At the same time, the total number of regular unleaded gasoline blends had reached the absurd number of 165.
My home here in Scottsdale, Arizona is in the middle of Maricopa County. The Maricopa County Board of Supervisors in their infinite wisdom dictated a blend of regular unleaded gasoline that was not sold or used any other place in the world. This, despite the fact that the entire state of Arizona does not contain a single refinery. Therefore our own little special blend needed to be piped in from Texas or California where it was produced in a total of three refineries. No other blend of unleaded gasoline could legally be sold in Maricopa County. The results of this folly to anyone with even a rudimentary understanding of economics were predictably disastrous. A production disruption at any one of the three refineries producing our boutique blend immediately cut off one third of Maricopa Countys fuel supply. This was brought into sharp focus by the bursting of the Kinder-Morgan pipeline from Texas into Maricopa County two years ago bringing the Valley of the Sun to it's knees for two weeks. While I sat in my Chevron station out of fuel and out of business for four straight days, gasoline was plentiful just 25 miles away and in every other county of Arizona. But I was not allowed to pick up the phone and have a tanker deliver it to me as selling a non-Maricopa County blend fuel would result in fines exceeding $100,000, and most likely jail time as well. Our fuel supply is no longer a lake with Adam Smith's invisible hand sending gasoline quickly and efficiently where it is needed. Blend requirements have turned it into an ice cube tray with solid walls blocking the flow of fuel from the rest of the full tray into the cube that is presently dry. Our Democrat Governor Janet Napolitano, a hard-core liberal and an economic idiot, could have solved this problem with the stroke of a pen, exercising an executive order temporarily eliminating Maricopa Counties fuel blend requirement. Instead of taking this simple step to help all Arizonans, she dithered and did what all good liberals would do, she used this shortage and the hardship created by it to demonize gas station operators like me, my suppliers including Chevron, and to score political points for herself by taking cheap shots at the entire gas and oil industry.
The United States of America has taken a huge step backwards in both the production and distribution of gasoline because of these blend requirements. And it gets even worse as twice a year most municipalities switch from a summer blend to a winter blend and then back to their summer blend. As government regulatory agencies insist on testing these blends in the field at tank farms, each blend changeover results in a draw down of existing fuel stocks to critical levels. That done, it takes a while before the new blend can be shipped or piped in sufficient quantities to restock tank farms all across the country. Instead of just producing fuel 24 hours a day seven days a week, refineries must now constantly gauge individual markets and do their best to estimate how much fuel will be needed, and therefore produced for each little cube in the tray. A miscalculation by refiners or a change in demand of any market results in either a glut or shortage that cannot be shipped to or from another market because fuel produced for one market cannot legally be sold in another market. Instead of the lake we used to have with 150 streams of product flowing into it immediately assessable nationwide we now have this ice cube tray of small individual cubicles, each filled by just a couple refineries. Where a production disruption at an individual refinery used to be invisible to the American public because of its small effect on the total supply, now a production disruption at an individual refinery creates a crisis, eliminating 30% and sometimes as much as 50% of the fuel available for sale in that market. This has led to huge differences in the cost of gasoline from one market to another. And when a production difficulty arises such as a refinery fire is not uncommon for the price of gas in that affected market to spike up more than a dollar a gallon.
Let me add that every single time a refinery needs to change from one blend to another, that refinery needs to be shut down in order for the change to take effect. These constant shutdowns and start ups are eliminating as much as 20% of the capacity of each refinery and adding enormously to the cost of operating that facility. These blend requirements are adding $.50 to $.75 to the cost of each gallon of gasoline that we purchase. In addition to this, taxes at both the federal, state, and local levels totaled nearly $.60 per gallon. After-tax profits to shareholders of oil companies on the sale of a $3 gallon of gasoline will total about $.16. Even if oil companies eliminated 100% of their before tax profit that would only amount to $.27 per gallon. Oh, let me mention that the oil companies have to do 100% of the work to find, transport, refine, and deliver our fuel supply. Our government on the other hand, does none of the work, yet gouges American citizens to the tune of approximately $.60 cents per gallon in direct taxes, plus income tax of approximately $.11 per gallon on distributed oil company profits, plus between $.50 and $.75 per gallon in mandated regulatory costs. Clearly there is some gouging going on by local and state governments that rip our heads off to the tune of over one dollar per gallon! These same economic nitwits tell us that the .16 cent after-tax profit on the Exxon Mobil stock in your IRA is unconscionable!! All of this is possible of course because we run our public school system not for the benefit of our children, but instead for the benefit of the NEA teachers union and their cash campaign contributions to the Democratic Party. The laws of economics are as certain as the law of gravity. Yet economics is not being taught in public schools today. This economic illiteracy combined with the misinformation spewed at us daily by our left wing agenda driven mainstream press has public anger directed at the wrong culprit.
We have taken the world's largest and most efficient market for gasoline and turned it into over 100 little tiny inefficient markets. We have taken the world's best gasoline distribution system and made it irrelevant by making it illegal to ship fuel from its intended market into another market where it is needed. And worst of all, we have not built a new fuel refinery in the United States in over 30 years. Many oil companies have tried yet it is virtually impossible to obtain all of the permits necessary to build one as environmental groups sue time and time again to stop construction and left wing Liberal Democrat appointed judges grant these environmental wackos endless impact studies that stop construction. We have permanently closed down about one third of the refineries that existed 30 years ago however because governmental regulatory requirements have made it impossible to keep them operating profitably. Our current refineries are operating at very close to their maximum capacity. But this is not sufficient as we now need to import 14% of our refined gasoline. The United States of America, the greatest economic power on earth, is incapable of refining its own gasoline supply because we have willingly crippled ourselves with suicidal environmental restrictions. Shipping crude oil is relatively safe as it is fairly inert and not very combustible. Shipping refined gasoline is tricky and dangerous as it gives off explosive fumes and is extremely flammable. We are playing national Russian roulette with our own energy security. We have very little room for error and with our expanding population and economy we are nearing a crisis point. As 20% of our refining capacity has been eliminated through shutdowns and start ups required by continual blend changes, refinery capacity is the bottleneck. Until the United States deals with this issue, and it is not going to deal with it, our gasoline supply will remain restricted and prices will remain high regardless of the price of oil.
These are the real reasons for our fuel prices being higher today than they should be given the price of oil. What baffles me is that President Bush was willing to take the political hit for those high fuel prices yet did not even make an attempt to explain it to the American people. I know President Bush understood that problem because after hurricane Katrina he immediately issued an executive order suspending all fuel blend requirements nationwide. He knew that without taking this decisive action there is no way that America's remaining undamaged fuel refineries could keep up with demand.
Ahhh, I'm sure there's a big environmental payoff for all of the economic pain that these blend requirements have imposed upon us right?? The air is certainly much cleaner than it would be if we all used the same blend, right?? We now have the answer to that question. For about two months after Katrina all gasoline sold in the United States was essentially the same blend. There was no detectable difference in air quality during this time. No detectable benefit for the incredible expense incurred in brewing up 165 different blends of gasoline!!! Yet as soon as refineries came back online these ridiculous blend requirements were put back in place.
And that is where we stand today. This post has been quite lengthy, both for you to read and for me to write. I hope the payoff for those of you patient enough to slog your way through it has been a better understanding of the economics involved, fuel production and its current price, and the real problem and its solution.
I know the conservatives get it and I only hope this helps to enlighten the more extreme liberals, lowering their angry hate filled rhetoric just a bit.
Subject: The Real Reason For High Gas Prices
The real reasons for higher than necessary gasoline prices and regional shortages.
By Chip Beck
This article is long, but if you take the time to read it, perhaps a few things will come to light.
I have read and I have on good authority that one out of four Americans today is functionally illiterate, this means that they cannot read and comprehend a daily newspaper. Worse than that, approximately 50% of all adult Americans are numerically illiterate, meaning they cannot add, subtract, multiply, and divide three digit numbers using a sheet of paper and a pencil. It has also become abundantly clear that at least 95% of adult Americans are economically illiterate. The current national furor over high gasoline prices, with accusations by politicians and citizens alike of conspiracies and gouging by oil companies in collusion with one another are evidence of this. As I have on this forum in the past, I feel compelled here to point out a few basic economic principles, along with a few facts for you to ponder. Fact number one, current oil company profits on a gallon of gas at three dollars per gallon are currently 9% or about $.27 per gallon. Of that $.27, approximately 40% is taken by the government in taxes before the remaining 60% is distributed to shareholders. Thus the after-tax profit distributed to the tens of millions of Americans who own oil company stocks is about $.16 per gallon. There are no greedy oil company owners colluding with one another to gouge American citizens, only shareholders like you and me, our pension funds, our IRAs, and our investment portfolios. The largest American oil company is Exxon Mobil; they are the fifth largest oil company in the world and control less than 5% of the world oil market. The top three US oil companies combined control less than 10% of the world oil market. This is hardly a market dominating monopoly.
Large markets are more efficient than small markets. Any governmental regulation that inhibits the free flow of products or its production will result in either higher prices, product shortages, or both. Essential products like gasoline without readily available substitutes are by definition, inelastic, meaning that large increases in price will have only a small effect upon consumption. Nonessential products with readily available substitutes like apple juice are by definition, elastic, meaning that even small increases in price will have a large effect upon consumption.
Most products including automobiles and gasoline are assembled from multiple components as well as requiring numerous processes to produce the finished product. Any shortage of an essential component or any bottleneck in the manufacturing process will limit total production to the number that may be produced by what ever item is in shortest supply. It matters not a whit how abundant the other components or manufacturing processes are, nor does it matter what the bottleneck is. All that matters is that a bottleneck exists. The six speed transmission in the 2007 Ford Shelby GT500 Mustang is an example of such a bottleneck. Despite enormous demand for the Shelby version, Mustang sales were down 19% that year, the cars were available in large numbers, and Ford Motor Co. would obviously have liked to sell them. But because only 10,000 of the six speed transmissions necessary to build a Shelby GT500 were available to Ford that year, total production (and Shelby sales) were limited to 10,000.
I have not seen in any publication, nor have I heard on any newscasts the actual reason for today's high gasoline prices. There is a reason why gasoline is about $.50 to $.75 per gallon more expensive today than it should be given today's price of oil. And though the reason is not obvious or even readily apparent to those outside the gas & oil business, neither is it particularly difficult to explain or to understand. So here you go.
Up until the 1970s in the United States gasoline was essentially a commodity. Produced in over 150 refineries nationwide gasoline was piped or trucked wherever it was needed. A production disruption or breakdown in any one refinery affected less than 1% of the national supply. The vacuum created by one plant's production stoppage was immediately filled by product flowing in from other areas drawn to the affected region by temporarily higher prices. Much like the scooping of a bucket of water out of the surface of a lake is immediately filled by water rushing in from the rest of the lake, the force of Adam Smith's "invisible hand" sent gasoline quickly and efficiently where ever it was needed. Prices were essentially equal, coast to coast. But in the late 1970s, government and its well meaning yet isolated and economically ignorant bureaucrats got involved. First was the State of California deciding that it needed its own special blend of gasoline. Next high altitude areas decided a special blend would be better for them too. State after state and county after county decided to dictate special fuel blends for their communities as well. Four years ago the number of refineries in the United States had shrunk to about 100 due to environmental regulations and government mandates. At the same time, the total number of regular unleaded gasoline blends had reached the absurd number of 165.
My home here in Scottsdale, Arizona is in the middle of Maricopa County. The Maricopa County Board of Supervisors in their infinite wisdom dictated a blend of regular unleaded gasoline that was not sold or used any other place in the world. This, despite the fact that the entire state of Arizona does not contain a single refinery. Therefore our own little special blend needed to be piped in from Texas or California where it was produced in a total of three refineries. No other blend of unleaded gasoline could legally be sold in Maricopa County. The results of this folly to anyone with even a rudimentary understanding of economics were predictably disastrous. A production disruption at any one of the three refineries producing our boutique blend immediately cut off one third of Maricopa Countys fuel supply. This was brought into sharp focus by the bursting of the Kinder-Morgan pipeline from Texas into Maricopa County two years ago bringing the Valley of the Sun to it's knees for two weeks. While I sat in my Chevron station out of fuel and out of business for four straight days, gasoline was plentiful just 25 miles away and in every other county of Arizona. But I was not allowed to pick up the phone and have a tanker deliver it to me as selling a non-Maricopa County blend fuel would result in fines exceeding $100,000, and most likely jail time as well. Our fuel supply is no longer a lake with Adam Smith's invisible hand sending gasoline quickly and efficiently where it is needed. Blend requirements have turned it into an ice cube tray with solid walls blocking the flow of fuel from the rest of the full tray into the cube that is presently dry. Our Democrat Governor Janet Napolitano, a hard-core liberal and an economic idiot, could have solved this problem with the stroke of a pen, exercising an executive order temporarily eliminating Maricopa Counties fuel blend requirement. Instead of taking this simple step to help all Arizonans, she dithered and did what all good liberals would do, she used this shortage and the hardship created by it to demonize gas station operators like me, my suppliers including Chevron, and to score political points for herself by taking cheap shots at the entire gas and oil industry.
The United States of America has taken a huge step backwards in both the production and distribution of gasoline because of these blend requirements. And it gets even worse as twice a year most municipalities switch from a summer blend to a winter blend and then back to their summer blend. As government regulatory agencies insist on testing these blends in the field at tank farms, each blend changeover results in a draw down of existing fuel stocks to critical levels. That done, it takes a while before the new blend can be shipped or piped in sufficient quantities to restock tank farms all across the country. Instead of just producing fuel 24 hours a day seven days a week, refineries must now constantly gauge individual markets and do their best to estimate how much fuel will be needed, and therefore produced for each little cube in the tray. A miscalculation by refiners or a change in demand of any market results in either a glut or shortage that cannot be shipped to or from another market because fuel produced for one market cannot legally be sold in another market. Instead of the lake we used to have with 150 streams of product flowing into it immediately assessable nationwide we now have this ice cube tray of small individual cubicles, each filled by just a couple refineries. Where a production disruption at an individual refinery used to be invisible to the American public because of its small effect on the total supply, now a production disruption at an individual refinery creates a crisis, eliminating 30% and sometimes as much as 50% of the fuel available for sale in that market. This has led to huge differences in the cost of gasoline from one market to another. And when a production difficulty arises such as a refinery fire is not uncommon for the price of gas in that affected market to spike up more than a dollar a gallon.
Let me add that every single time a refinery needs to change from one blend to another, that refinery needs to be shut down in order for the change to take effect. These constant shutdowns and start ups are eliminating as much as 20% of the capacity of each refinery and adding enormously to the cost of operating that facility. These blend requirements are adding $.50 to $.75 to the cost of each gallon of gasoline that we purchase. In addition to this, taxes at both the federal, state, and local levels totaled nearly $.60 per gallon. After-tax profits to shareholders of oil companies on the sale of a $3 gallon of gasoline will total about $.16. Even if oil companies eliminated 100% of their before tax profit that would only amount to $.27 per gallon. Oh, let me mention that the oil companies have to do 100% of the work to find, transport, refine, and deliver our fuel supply. Our government on the other hand, does none of the work, yet gouges American citizens to the tune of approximately $.60 cents per gallon in direct taxes, plus income tax of approximately $.11 per gallon on distributed oil company profits, plus between $.50 and $.75 per gallon in mandated regulatory costs. Clearly there is some gouging going on by local and state governments that rip our heads off to the tune of over one dollar per gallon! These same economic nitwits tell us that the .16 cent after-tax profit on the Exxon Mobil stock in your IRA is unconscionable!! All of this is possible of course because we run our public school system not for the benefit of our children, but instead for the benefit of the NEA teachers union and their cash campaign contributions to the Democratic Party. The laws of economics are as certain as the law of gravity. Yet economics is not being taught in public schools today. This economic illiteracy combined with the misinformation spewed at us daily by our left wing agenda driven mainstream press has public anger directed at the wrong culprit.
We have taken the world's largest and most efficient market for gasoline and turned it into over 100 little tiny inefficient markets. We have taken the world's best gasoline distribution system and made it irrelevant by making it illegal to ship fuel from its intended market into another market where it is needed. And worst of all, we have not built a new fuel refinery in the United States in over 30 years. Many oil companies have tried yet it is virtually impossible to obtain all of the permits necessary to build one as environmental groups sue time and time again to stop construction and left wing Liberal Democrat appointed judges grant these environmental wackos endless impact studies that stop construction. We have permanently closed down about one third of the refineries that existed 30 years ago however because governmental regulatory requirements have made it impossible to keep them operating profitably. Our current refineries are operating at very close to their maximum capacity. But this is not sufficient as we now need to import 14% of our refined gasoline. The United States of America, the greatest economic power on earth, is incapable of refining its own gasoline supply because we have willingly crippled ourselves with suicidal environmental restrictions. Shipping crude oil is relatively safe as it is fairly inert and not very combustible. Shipping refined gasoline is tricky and dangerous as it gives off explosive fumes and is extremely flammable. We are playing national Russian roulette with our own energy security. We have very little room for error and with our expanding population and economy we are nearing a crisis point. As 20% of our refining capacity has been eliminated through shutdowns and start ups required by continual blend changes, refinery capacity is the bottleneck. Until the United States deals with this issue, and it is not going to deal with it, our gasoline supply will remain restricted and prices will remain high regardless of the price of oil.
These are the real reasons for our fuel prices being higher today than they should be given the price of oil. What baffles me is that President Bush was willing to take the political hit for those high fuel prices yet did not even make an attempt to explain it to the American people. I know President Bush understood that problem because after hurricane Katrina he immediately issued an executive order suspending all fuel blend requirements nationwide. He knew that without taking this decisive action there is no way that America's remaining undamaged fuel refineries could keep up with demand.
Ahhh, I'm sure there's a big environmental payoff for all of the economic pain that these blend requirements have imposed upon us right?? The air is certainly much cleaner than it would be if we all used the same blend, right?? We now have the answer to that question. For about two months after Katrina all gasoline sold in the United States was essentially the same blend. There was no detectable difference in air quality during this time. No detectable benefit for the incredible expense incurred in brewing up 165 different blends of gasoline!!! Yet as soon as refineries came back online these ridiculous blend requirements were put back in place.
And that is where we stand today. This post has been quite lengthy, both for you to read and for me to write. I hope the payoff for those of you patient enough to slog your way through it has been a better understanding of the economics involved, fuel production and its current price, and the real problem and its solution.
May 22, 2014 11:30:11 #
May 22, 2014 11:43:58 #
Thanks for the explanation. I find it very informative.
What about the ethanol additive. I understand there is no environmental advantage to this very expensive additive.
Not to mention all the changes that have been made to accommodate it by other industries.
What about the ethanol additive. I understand there is no environmental advantage to this very expensive additive.
Not to mention all the changes that have been made to accommodate it by other industries.
May 22, 2014 11:55:40 #
The simple reason for these prices is the 'centralized' government and one party state, the prices along with a "redefined" economy, also provides a control of movement and industry, it paralyzes the free market economy we had before 2009, there is reason other than the dishonesty of this Jihadist Racist, collectivist state, to bring in the numbers is a commendable effort, however it "justifies" the broken economy, under Husseyn-Obama all is explained, without the details like the Al'Qaeda connection, the Moslem-Brotherhood that decides U.S. policy safely away in Qatar and Turkey; Pakistan's operations against the free world are instead confused with religious freedom and the fairy tale of tolerance, diversity and racism. There is excuse for this country's decline other than for Husseyn-Obama's oversight dictatorial tyranny, if the country's concern would stay with the Constitutional violations, this regime of racist religiosity would have been long gone and this conversation would not need to take place.
Libertarians are good at justifying not correcting those numbers mean nothing unless you are interested in how or why it is happening. Libertarians in Government in their Progressive mindset use the elitist illiteracy that has gotten us here. There has been no outrage, except to criticize the safe issues, not to make waves or appear 'Conservative" the solutions are obvious they are in the Constitution, this has no connection to the Progressive Libertarian, to command authority first address the source of prices that are "inflated" on purpose, if that were the case your statistics could use incentive let me propose the one party system's effect on not just the gas prices but overall costs, explain by the numbers why climate change matters, they are also put into numbers. Complicating the issues by throwing numbers, has made it possible to accept Carbon Dioxide as a pollutant, every tyranny must depend on real or imagined enemies, in this case it is those who are Judeo-Christian, the real reason for high prices is the exorbitant taxes the Federal Government has added since Husseyn-Obama's Sultanate began, the enemy is living in the White House, but nobody cares. Take your numbers and submit to the ignorant, every dictatorship must control the oppressed economically.
Libertarians are good at justifying not correcting those numbers mean nothing unless you are interested in how or why it is happening. Libertarians in Government in their Progressive mindset use the elitist illiteracy that has gotten us here. There has been no outrage, except to criticize the safe issues, not to make waves or appear 'Conservative" the solutions are obvious they are in the Constitution, this has no connection to the Progressive Libertarian, to command authority first address the source of prices that are "inflated" on purpose, if that were the case your statistics could use incentive let me propose the one party system's effect on not just the gas prices but overall costs, explain by the numbers why climate change matters, they are also put into numbers. Complicating the issues by throwing numbers, has made it possible to accept Carbon Dioxide as a pollutant, every tyranny must depend on real or imagined enemies, in this case it is those who are Judeo-Christian, the real reason for high prices is the exorbitant taxes the Federal Government has added since Husseyn-Obama's Sultanate began, the enemy is living in the White House, but nobody cares. Take your numbers and submit to the ignorant, every dictatorship must control the oppressed economically.
May 22, 2014 12:00:40 #
rcksha wrote:
Thanks for the explanation. I find it very informative.
What about the ethanol additive. I understand there is no environmental advantage to this very expensive additive.
Not to mention all the changes that have been made to accommodate it by other industries.
What about the ethanol additive. I understand there is no environmental advantage to this very expensive additive.
Not to mention all the changes that have been made to accommodate it by other industries.
That is another massive subject with a lot of miss information being spread by the MSM. I do not wish to give only my own opinion on it without real facts supporting it. The one good thing I can say about it is it reduces our dependence on foreign oil.
May 22, 2014 12:32:54 #
1st. Amendment, free speech allows you to speak without numbers or sharia approved group-speak. Just remember that thing called opinion based on the obvious.
May 23, 2014 09:29:01 #
[quote-Cost Lib- Ahhh, I'm sure there's a big environmental payoff for all of the economic pain that these blend requirements have imposed upon us right?? The air is certainly much cleaner than it would be if we all used the same blend, right?? We now have the answer to that question. For about two months after Katrina all gasoline sold in the United States was essentially the same blend. There was no detectable difference in air quality during this time. No detectable benefit for the incredible expense incurred in brewing up 165 different blends of gasoline!!! Yet as soon as refineries came back online these ridiculous blend requirements were put back in place.[/quote]
OK, now how do we get these special blends out of the way since they are not effective, and just cause economic hardship for everyone, What nincompoop thought up this stupid idea anyway. Environmentalists? Have they ever been able to prove anything, or is it just $$ talks, and BS walks.
OK, now how do we get these special blends out of the way since they are not effective, and just cause economic hardship for everyone, What nincompoop thought up this stupid idea anyway. Environmentalists? Have they ever been able to prove anything, or is it just $$ talks, and BS walks.
May 23, 2014 09:41:30 #
Constitutional libertarian wrote:
That is another massive subject with a lot of miss information being spread by the MSM. I do not wish to give only my own opinion on it without real facts supporting it. The one good thing I can say about it is it reduces our dependence on foreign oil.
No, it doesn't reduce our dependence on foreign oil, because it takes more fuel to produce and transport it, than the calories it produces, there is no net decrease in total oil imported! You could also comment on the "futures market" there the prices are constantly raised, no value is added, only enrichment of those who havn't invested any effort or capital (bought on margin means credit) AND a comment in our local paper about 4 years ago: "In saturday private trading crude oil futures spiked another $11.00" (what religion has private business done on saturdays?) And just who are the 27 hedge market investors controlling the fuel futures market?
May 23, 2014 09:57:11 #
astrolite wrote:
No, it doesn't reduce our dependence on foreign oi... (show quote)
Like I said huge topic, and I didn't want to commend without real numbers to back up anything I might say. But yes ethanol is a massive fraud.
My posting was directed towards the price of gas at the pump, there are other variables that add middleman costs of the crude. Thank you I think I will look up just who the hedge market and fuel futures managers are.
May 23, 2014 10:08:20 #
astrolite wrote:
No, it doesn't reduce our dependence on foreign oi... (show quote)
Like I said huge topic, and I didn't want to commend without real numbers to back up anything I might say. But yes ethanol is a massive fraud.
My posting was directed towards the price of gas at the pump, there are other variables that add middleman costs of the crude. Thank you I think I will look up just who the hedge market and fuel futures managers are.
Just for inquiring minds want to know today's price of crude is $103.74 per barrel and a barrel is 42 gallons or $2.47 a gallon.
May 23, 2014 12:46:00 #
It takes three (3) gallons of gasoline to produce four (4) gallons of ethanol, aside from which cannot be shipped as a mixed product but needs to be mixed at the point of delivery, due to its corrosive and explosive potential, this together with a lowered mileage approximately 30% less M.P.G., the only advantage is a 30% increase in revenues (taxes) not to mention how to "idle" means a further 5-8% increase in consumption, another advantage of ethanol is the predisposed failure of older vehicles, but then again consider that it takes approximately 59 Gallons of fuel to produce one kilogram of Cocaine, in powder form so conceivably it is a fuel alternative to drug production in the great scheme of life, to cut your fuel with water (ethanol mostly is water) in an illegal venture does not seem so bad, however there are people who went to jail and paid stiff fines for adding water to gasoline during the 1970's oil and gasoline shortages, does this mean the criminal state can do no wrong? Carbon Dioxide is a 'pollutant' so the environmentalists say, to go against science is another form of "Social Hygiene" and deceit, do not forget the results of the last time this 'hygiene' was used, it resulted in the "Final Solution" later called the Holocaust.
May 23, 2014 13:13:39 #
rodulfo-tardo wrote:
It takes three (3) gallons of gasoline to produce ... (show quote)
Again we are faced with gov regulations that contradict one other. In 2011 all on road diesels engines needed to meet very stringent emissions levels. These were met by the implementation of DEF diesel exhaust fluid being added into the exhaust systems if all vehicles being manufactured since then. In 2016 there are new fuel efficiency regulations going into effect. All fine and dandy more efficient the more competitive we can be in global market place. Except for the ethanol requirements decreasing the efficiency by 30% as well as creating significantly higher maintenance costs do to things like bacterial growth in the fuel. One of the answers is synthetic lubricants that reduce the friction thus raising efficiency, but like all things there is cost to that too, as I am sure many of you may already be aware of if you have a newer gas vehicle that requires special oil.
We are making great progress buts let's not do it by trying to use false propaganda like the benefits of ethanol.
May 23, 2014 16:44:50 #
Nice try, you are still legitimizing the 'environmental' sharia, by hiding behind the politically-correct language of propriety not reality, next you'll claim that Carbon Dioxide is a pollutant gas, next could be to justify sharia and ritual honor murders as a freedom of religion act.
May 23, 2014 16:49:31 #
rodulfo-tardo wrote:
Nice try, you are still legitimizing the 'environmental' sharia, by hiding behind the politically-correct language of propriety not reality, next you'll claim that Carbon Dioxide is a pollutant gas, next could be to justify sharia and ritual honor murders as a freedom of religion act.
You must be thinking of environmental terrorists when referring to CO2 as a pollutant.
What has sharia law and ritual honor murders have to do with the price of gas?
May 23, 2014 17:04:19 #
Constitutional libertarian wrote:
You must be thinking of environmental terrorists when referring to CO2 as a pollutant.
What has sharia law and ritual honor murders have to do with the price of gas?
What has sharia law and ritual honor murders have to do with the price of gas?
Wouldn't it be nice if everyone could stick to the subject at hand and through logical conversation try to come to consensus, or even suggest a plan of action to resolve.
All these name calling and abusive sessions are not only tiring and unproductive, but serve no purpose except to satisfy ones own ego that they have gained in upmanship at the expense of another. Give it up guys and join the mature.
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