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Why do conservatives believe liberals want to ban all guns?
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Mar 11, 2018 10:27:03   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
Wm. E. Smith wrote:
Bill 7026 that was just passed into law in florida is an appeasement ruse.
Whats the difference between a 19 year old and a 21 year old nut case ?
They act as if they change the law this wont happen again.
Age has nothing to do with a screwball who gets a gun and goes crazy.
There is already a law that prohibits people under 21 from buying pistols.
But the one area that cannot be controlled here is the criminals who already have guns.
They cant be regulated, taxed, penalized or berated for what they do.
You will never get the guns from the criminals.
So, why does it make sense to some, to regulate and punish the law abiding citizens for what the criminal element does ?
Things have to make sense, good sense, not non sense.
Bill 7026 that was just passed into law in florida... (show quote)


Agree!!

Disarming the citizens that do it legally is not the answer..

I keep posting in different threads the one obvious question~~ why arent we going after the criminals giving the full sentence available under the law instead of giving lighter sentenced in a plea bargin?? Why aren't we going after the gangs whom have more guns than the police and why arent we seeking out the black market, gun runners coming in from Mexico, and why does our government give weapons to terrorist to then use against us~, ( fast and furious, Benghazi, Oliver North selling guns to Iran etcetcetc.,

You want to curtail illegal use of weapons go after the ones doing it, not we citizens, that legally own and folliw the law...

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 10:02:47   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
jack sequim wa wrote:
Why do conservatives think liberals want to ban all firearms?

Because they can think for themselves and do research?

Senator Dianne Feinstein (D – CA) does. “Banning guns addresses a fundamental right of all Americans to feel safe.” – Associated Press, 18 November, 1993. “If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them; “Mr. and Mrs. America, turn ‘em all in,” I would have done it.” – 60 Minutes on CBS, 5 February, 1995. …“The National Guard fulfills the militia mentioned in the Second amendment. Citizens no longer need to protect the states or themselves.”

Senator Frank Launtenberg (D – NJ) did. “We have other legislation that all of you are aware that I have been so active on, with my colleagues here, and that is to shut down the gun shows.”

“I will get the NRA shut down for good if I become president. If we can ban handguns we will do it.”-Hillary Clinton interview with Des Moines Register Aug. 8th, 2015

Fmr. Senator Howard Metzenbaum (D – OH) did. “No, we’re not looking at how to control criminals … we’re talking about banning the AK-47 and semi-automatic guns.” – Constitution Subcommittee, 2 February, 1989

Vice President Joe “Buckshot” Biden (D – DE) does. “Banning guns is an idea whose time has come.” – Associated Press, 11 November, 1993 Representative Jan Schakowski (D – IL) does. “I believe…..this is my final word……I believe that I’m supporting the Constitution of the United States which does not give the right for any individual to own a handgun….” – Recorded 25 June, 2000 by Matt Beauchamp

Fmr. Representative Major Owens (D – NY) did. “We have to start with a ban on the manufacturing and import of handguns. From there we register the guns which are currently owned, and follow that with additional bans and acquisitions of handguns and rifles with no sporting purpose.”

Representative Bobby Rush (D – IL) does. “My staff and I right now are working on a comprehensive gun-control bill. We don’t have all the details, but for instance, regulating the sale and purchase of bullets. Ultimately, I would like to see the manufacture and possession of handguns banned except for military and police use. But that’s the endgame. And in the meantime, there are some specific things that we can do with legislation.”

Vermont State Mary Ann Carlson (D) does. “We must be able to arrest people before they commit crimes. By registering guns and knowing who has them we can do that. If they have guns they are pretty likely to commit a crime.”

New York State Governor Andrew Cuomo (D) does. ” …confiscation could be an option…” Sarah Brady, fmr. Chairman of Handgun Control Inc. (now The Brady Campaign) does. “…I don’t believe gun owners have rights.” – Hearst Newspapers, October 1997 “The House passage of our bill is a victory for this country! Common sense wins out. I’m just so thrilled and excited. The sale of guns must stop. Halfway measures are not enough.” – 1 July, 1988…

“Our main agenda is to have all guns banned. We must use whatever means possible. It doesn’t matter if you have to distort the facts or even lie. Our task of creating a socialist America can only succeed when those who would resist us have been totally disarmed.” – The National Educator, January 1994, pg. 3, to Fmr. Senator Howard Metzenbaum

Fmr. Chancellor of Boston University John Silber did. “I don’t believe anybody has a right to own any kind of a firearm. I believe in order to obtain a permit to own a firearm, that person should undergo an exhaustive criminal background check. In addition, an applicant should give up his right to privacy and submit his medical records for review to see if the person has ever had a problem with alcohol, drugs or mental illness . . . The Constitution doesn’t count!”

Fmr. United States Attorney General Janet “Waco” Reno does. “The most effective means of fighting crime in the United States is to outlaw the possession of any type of firearm by the civilian populace.”-- Written affidavit by Fred Diamond, 1984 B’nai B’rith meeting in Coral Gables, Florida

Deborah Prothrow-Stith, of the Office of Government and Community Programs and the Community Violence Prevention Project at the Harvard School of Public Health, does. “My own view on gun control is simple: I hate guns and I cannot imagine why anybody would want to own one. If I had my way, guns for sport would be registered, and all other guns would be banned.” The ACLU does. “We urge passage of federal legislation … to prohibit … the private ownership and possession of handguns.” ACLU #47.

“I now think the only way to control handgun use is to prohibit the guns. And the only way to do that is to change the Constitution. — M. Gartner, then President of NBC News, USA Today, January 16, 1992, pg. A9.

Now read the Democrat H.R.4269 - Assault Weapons Ban of 2015 pay particular attention to the SINGLE-SHOTS and BOLT ACTIONS "Assault Weapons"!


Why do liberals think conservatives are angered by this?

Because every single liberal argument twisting the 2nd amendment that is does not mean that every citizen has the rights to own and carry arms, uninfringed.
And because historical evidence by hundreds of our founding fathers speeches and quotes, give empirical evidence to irrefutable facts they wanted every citizen armed.

Because every single argument liberals have for banning guns for a safer America is factually false and can be backed by empirical evidence.
Why do conservatives think liberals want to ban al... (show quote)


Why do conservatives think liberals want to ban all firearms?
History!!!!

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 10:17:26   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
eagleye13 wrote:
Why do conservatives think liberals want to ban all firearms?
History!!!!





History??? Such as what???

Reply
 
 
Mar 12, 2018 11:48:20   #
cold iron Loc: White House
 
permafrost wrote:
History??? Such as what???


Such as the leftie Mayor of New Orleans taking all the guns after the hurricane Katrina. Totally unconstitutional. Just goes to show how the Democrats have no regard for the constitution.
Your constant babble shows what you are, a commie.

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 15:29:18   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
cold iron wrote:
Such as the leftie Mayor of New Orleans taking all the guns after the hurricane Katrina. Totally unconstitutional. Just goes to show how the Democrats have no regard for the constitution.
Your constant babble shows what you are, a commie.



Iron,'

That in New Orleans, I have never heard of... got a link?

I was sure someone would toss out the actions in Boston after the bombing of the marathon..

But this i have no background yet..

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 15:38:56   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
permafrost wrote:
History??? Such as what???


The history of people not realizing how incremental disarming in Germany and Communist countries led to massive slaughter of law abiding citizens that opposed the governments in power.

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 15:45:13   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
permafrost wrote:
Iron,'

That in New Orleans, I have never heard of... got a link?

I was sure someone would toss out the actions in Boston after the bombing of the marathon..

But this i have no background yet..




Yes, now I do...Lots was written about this..

This is not what we, or at least I, consider when talking about gun regulation or even confiscation.

This was action after a natural disaster and many exceptions were made..

The NRA misrepresented it and the even was worsened by other people then the mayor..

These things( has anything simaler ever happened?).. are short term emergency measures and not regulations which are what I address in my posts..

Reply
 
 
Mar 12, 2018 15:50:38   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
eagleye13 wrote:
The history of people not realizing how incremental disarming in Germany and Communist countries led to massive slaughter of law abiding citizens that opposed the governments in power.



This was not as simple as the gun lovers try to make it...

http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2018/mar/06/david-simmons/florida-lawmaker-mangles-nazis-gun-control-history/

During a key vote in the Florida Senate to reject an assault weapons ban, Republican Sen. David Simmons argued that the original reason for the Second Amendment was so people could protect themselves from a tyrannical government. Simmons invoked the Nazis to drive home his point.

"Adolf Hitler confiscated all the weapons -- took all the weapons, had a registry of everybody -- and then on the night of June 30, 1934, sent out his secret police and murdered all of his political opponents," Simmons said March 3. "You think it doesn't happen in a free society? It does."

We reached out to Simmons and did not hear back, but Hitler’s gun policies are a familiar talking point among opponents of gun control, and one that we explored during the 2016 presidential campaign.

Simmons’ statement misses several historical facts.

Hitler was both a giver and a taker
By the time Hitler took power in 1933, Germany had been operating under the 1928 Law on Firearms and Ammunition. The measure relaxed strict controls imposed after World War I that banned all gun ownership, and created a system to register and sell firearms.

Columbia University law professor Bernard Harcourt translated a couple of key provisions in the law that exempted "officials of the central government, the states, as well as the German Railways Company" and "community officials to whom the highest government authority has permitted acquisition without an acquisition permit."

Dagmar Ellerbrock, an expert on German gun policies at the Dresden Technical University, told us in 2015 that the Nazis introduced a collective gun license for members of Nazi organizations. One of the main beneficiaries was the paramilitary Sturmabteilung, or brownshirts.

After the German parliament, the Reichstag, granted Hitler emergency powers in March 1933, he had a free hand.

"Under totalitarian rule, it took just a few weeks to drastically increase the number of Germans who held private weapons," Ellerbock said.


At the same time, the German state confiscated weapons from Jews, Communists, Social Democrats and unions that refused to affiliate with the Nazi Party. Did the 1928 registration law make this easier?

Perhaps, but Ellerbock’s research showed many holes in the system. For the most part, it recorded only new sales, while many people had unregistered weapons dating from World War I.

When they came to power, the Nazis used whatever gun records they had to seize weapons from their enemies, but Ellerbock told us the files included very few of the firearms in circulation.

"In my records, I found many Jews who well into the late 1930s possessed guns," Ellerbock told us.

So registration was spotty, confiscation was selective and Nazi allies found it easier, not harder to get weapons.

Much later, in 1938, the Nazis passed a new law that liberalized gun ownership in many respects, while simultaneously banning ownership and manufacture by Jews

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 15:57:04   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
permafrost wrote:
This was not as simple as the gun lovers try to make it...

http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2018/mar/06/david-simmons/florida-lawmaker-mangles-nazis-gun-control-history/

During a key vote in the Florida Senate to reject an assault weapons ban, Republican Sen. David Simmons argued that the original reason for the Second Amendment was so people could protect themselves from a tyrannical government. Simmons invoked the Nazis to drive home his point.

"Adolf Hitler confiscated all the weapons -- took all the weapons, had a registry of everybody -- and then on the night of June 30, 1934, sent out his secret police and murdered all of his political opponents," Simmons said March 3. "You think it doesn't happen in a free society? It does."

We reached out to Simmons and did not hear back, but Hitler’s gun policies are a familiar talking point among opponents of gun control, and one that we explored during the 2016 presidential campaign.

Simmons’ statement misses several historical facts.

Hitler was both a giver and a taker
By the time Hitler took power in 1933, Germany had been operating under the 1928 Law on Firearms and Ammunition. The measure relaxed strict controls imposed after World War I that banned all gun ownership, and created a system to register and sell firearms.

Columbia University law professor Bernard Harcourt translated a couple of key provisions in the law that exempted "officials of the central government, the states, as well as the German Railways Company" and "community officials to whom the highest government authority has permitted acquisition without an acquisition permit."

Dagmar Ellerbrock, an expert on German gun policies at the Dresden Technical University, told us in 2015 that the Nazis introduced a collective gun license for members of Nazi organizations. One of the main beneficiaries was the paramilitary Sturmabteilung, or brownshirts.

After the German parliament, the Reichstag, granted Hitler emergency powers in March 1933, he had a free hand.

"Under totalitarian rule, it took just a few weeks to drastically increase the number of Germans who held private weapons," Ellerbock said.


At the same time, the German state confiscated weapons from Jews, Communists, Social Democrats and unions that refused to affiliate with the Nazi Party. Did the 1928 registration law make this easier?

Perhaps, but Ellerbock’s research showed many holes in the system. For the most part, it recorded only new sales, while many people had unregistered weapons dating from World War I.

When they came to power, the Nazis used whatever gun records they had to seize weapons from their enemies, but Ellerbock told us the files included very few of the firearms in circulation.

"In my records, I found many Jews who well into the late 1930s possessed guns," Ellerbock told us.

So registration was spotty, confiscation was selective and Nazi allies found it easier, not harder to get weapons.

Much later, in 1938, the Nazis passed a new law that liberalized gun ownership in many respects, while simultaneously banning ownership and manufacture by Jews
This was not as simple as the gun lovers try to ma... (show quote)


Permafrost; You took all that to agree with my position? That is my take on what you just posted.
Incremental gun registration and incremental severity for disobeying the "law", led to imprisoning those that broke the "law".
People were rounded up.

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 16:03:49   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
eagleye13 wrote:
Permafrost; You took all that to agree with my position? That is my take on what you just posted.
Incremental gun registration and incremental severity for disobeying the "law", led to imprisoning those that broke the "law".
People were rounded up.




Selective people...

The general population found it easier to buy guns..

Per haps you should read it again.. follow the link and read it all..

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 16:08:22   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
permafrost wrote:
Selective people...

The general population found it easier to buy guns..

Per haps you should read it again.. follow the link and read it all..


"Selective people...

The general population found it easier to buy guns.." - permafrost


EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!
Government opposition was disarmed!
The reason for our 2'nd amendment is to protect the citizenry from that!!!
Perma; How is it that you can't figure that out????

Reply
 
 
Mar 12, 2018 20:19:13   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
eagleye13 wrote:
"Selective people...

The general population found it easier to buy guns.." - permafrost


EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!
Government opposition was disarmed!
The reason for our 2'nd amendment is to protect the citizenry from that!!!
Perma; How is it that you can't figure that out????




Why do you have such a hard time with reading comprehension???

"the general population found it easier to buy guns" what does that mean to you??

Does that sound as if the government was removing guns???

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 20:29:11   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
permafrost wrote:
Why do you have such a hard time with reading comprehension???

"the general population found it easier to buy guns" what does that mean to you??

Does that sound as if the government was removing guns???


Yes!!!
From the opposition!!!

You ask me about reading comprehension?
Are you kidding me!???

Right from this article;

""Under totalitarian rule, it took just a few weeks to drastically increase the number of Germans who held private weapons," Ellerbock said.


At the same time, the German state confiscated weapons from Jews, Communists, Social Democrats and unions that refused to affiliate with the Nazi Party. Did the 1928 registration law make this easier?

Perhaps, but Ellerbock’s research showed many holes in the system. For the most part, it recorded only new sales, while many people had unregistered weapons dating from World War I.

When they came to power, the Nazis used whatever gun records they had to seize weapons from their enemies, but Ellerbock told us the files included very few of the firearms in circulation.""

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 21:10:44   #
permafrost Loc: Minnesota
 
eagleye13 wrote:
Yes!!!
From the opposition!!!

You ask me about reading comprehension?
Are you kidding me!???

Right from this article;

""Under totalitarian rule, it took just a few weeks to drastically increase the number of Germans who held private weapons," Ellerbock said.


At the same time, the German state confiscated weapons from Jews, Communists, Social Democrats and unions that refused to affiliate with the Nazi Party. Did the 1928 registration law make this easier?

Perhaps, but Ellerbock’s research showed many holes in the system. For the most part, it recorded only new sales, while many people had unregistered weapons dating from World War I.

When they came to power, the Nazis used whatever gun records they had to seize weapons from their enemies, but Ellerbock told us the files included very few of the firearms in circulation.""
Yes!!! br From the opposition!!! br br You ask me... (show quote)




My point was that the guns were not removed from the German general population as claimed..

Without the entire article you would have missed that.. Should I be posting the complete articles rather then a link?

Also another point was that it was not effective.. as often claimed by the gun lovers who are so afraid..

So, I suppose I insulted you without merit.. Unless you had the same viewpoint and read all the article..

I can understand the point you made, but that was not my intended point..

Sorrry, my bad... have a good night..

Reply
Mar 12, 2018 21:53:58   #
eagleye13 Loc: Fl
 
permafrost wrote:
My point was that the guns were not removed from the German general population as claimed..

Without the entire article you would have missed that.. Should I be posting the complete articles rather then a link?

Also another point was that it was not effective.. as often claimed by the gun lovers who are so afraid..

So, I suppose I insulted you without merit.. Unless you had the same viewpoint and read all the article..

I can understand the point you made, but that was not my intended point..

Sorrry, my bad... have a good night..
My point was that the guns were not removed from t... (show quote)


Can you see the forest from the trees, perma?

Hitler went after the opposition in the middle of the night, hauling people off to the camps; AFTER a sequential disarming of the opposition AND the general population!!!
AND you still promote gun control.
Same goes for other Communist governments of the past and now.

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