This is a point I never get much chance to elaborate on... While conservatives typically focus on borders and walls to keep them out, I pay attention to the fact that economic factors serve much the same purpose and the walls become unnecessary.

If this nation starts to crush under the weight of it's population it won't be as attractive to immigrants any more and they will find other places. If the jobs are all taken up, immigrants will have no reason to come here anymore. Supply and demand seems to be a concept anti-immigration advocates completely forget.

Actually, I am proving over and over that YOU are uninformed. And I'm not on the far left either... I'm a progressive, which is pretty much a moderate. Far left would be communist. Obama is also a progressive and a moderate. In fact he and I are far more aligned with old-school Republicans like Reagan than Bush and his neoconservatives were and certainly more so than extreme lunatics like Ted Cruz. Meanwhile, the Tea Party is a group of poor innocent but simple-minded people being mislead by oligarchs, like rats following the pied piper.

Actually, I am proving over and over that YOU are uninformed. And I'm not on the far left either... I'm a progressive, which is pretty much a moderate. Far left would be communist. Obama is also a progressive and a moderate. In fact he and I are far more aligned with old-school Republicans like Reagan than Bush and his neoconservatives were and certainly more so than extreme lunatics like Ted Cruz. Meanwhile, the Tea Party is a group of poor innocent but simple-minded people being mislead by oligarchs, like rats following the pied piper.

Your daughter is referring to the Indians on H1 visas that are housed four or five to a corporate apartment. I know, I work with them too. Many of them want to immigrate and bring their families over and when they do they are suddenly faced with the cost of living here and all of a sudden they aren't so cheap anymore.

This is a point I never get much chance to elaborate on... While conservatives typically focus on borders and walls to keep them out, I pay attention to the fact that economic factors serve much the same purpose and the walls become unnecessary.

If this nation starts to crush under the weight of it's population it won't be as attractive to immigrants any more and they will find other places. If the jobs are all taken up, immigrants will have no reason to come here anymore. Supply and demand seems to be a concept anti-immigration advocates completely forget.

First, let's get this question of constitutional legality out of the way. I will do this simply by pointing to the precedence set by every single Republican president since Eisenhower who all used executive orders to grant amnesty to illegal immigrants. Here is a summary of 18 of these executive orders.

Pres. Dwight Eisenhower:

1956
By executive order, circumvented immigration quotas to allow 900 orphans to join their adoptive families in the U.S.
None of those figures comes even close to the millions Obama wants to legalize.
1956-1958
By executive order, allowed 31,000 Hungarian anti-Soviet insurgents to emigrate.

1959-72
By executive order, allowed 600,000 Cubans fleeing Castro to emigrate. [PDF]

Pres. Gerald Ford:

1975
By executive order, allowed 360,000 refugees, mostly from from Vietnam, to emigrate.

1976
By executive order, allowed 14,000 Lebanese nationals to emigrate.

Pres. Ronald Reagan:

1981
By executive order, allowed 7,000 Polish anti-Communists to emigrate.

1982
Allowed 15,000-plus Ethiopians to emigrate.

1987
By executive order, rescinded deportation of 200,000 Nicaraguans.

1987
By executive order, deferred deportation of undocumented children of 100,000 families. [JSTOR]

George H.W. Bush:

1989
By executive order, deferred deportations of Chinese students.

1989
By executive order, reversed visa denials of 7,000 Soviets, Indochinese.

1990
By executive order, deferred deporations of previously amnestied citizens’ 1.5 million spouses and children.

1991
By executive order, deferred deportation of 2,000 Gulf War evacuees.

1992
By executive order, deferred deportations of 190,000 El Salvadorans.

George W. Bush:

2002
By executive order, expedited naturalization for green-card holders who joined military.

2005
By executive order, deferred deportation of students affected by Hurricane Katrina.

2006
By executive order, enabled 1,500 Cuban physicians to seek asylum at US embassies.

2007
By executive order, deferred deportation of 3,600 Liberians.

Now, whether or not you think ALL of these orders are constitutionally illegal is a different, though respectable argument. On the other hand, if you're inclined to pick and choose which of the orders are justified, then you are surrendering the broad claim that President Obama does not have the constitutional authority to issue executive orders. If that's the case, you would have to shift the focus to whether or not his constitutionally valid order is otherwise unreasonable. This is the part I want to focus on here. In other words, constitution aside, what exactly is it that makes Obama's action so horrific?

The first such argument that appears most obvious is the extent of the order. Clearly, Obama's order involves a far greater number of immigrants than any of the orders before him. Perhaps that's worthy of concern, although personally I don't see it. Maybe someone needs to point it out to me. If these illegal immigrants were being granted citizenship then I would say it would be helping to dilute the democracy by decreasing the ratio of representatives to citizens, but Obama isn't granting them citizenship. That leaves us with the sociological and economic concerns of accepting 5 million immigrants into our system and this is where my opinion might grate on some nerves. I personally don't see any difference between native-born Americans and immigrants when it comes to basic human rights. Nor do I see any difference between them when it comes to their work ethic, criminal inclination or any other form of stereotyping. I don't have much tolerance for the whining about immigrants "taking" jobs from Americans either. As far as I am concerned, the only reason why an immigrant will take "your" job is that they're better at it than you are and if that's the case then good, because as a consumer, I would rather pay for goods and services provided by the best workers, than those provided by "privileged" workers and this is coming from a professional in a field that is saturated by foreign workers. I've been surviving by working hard and competing not by relying on the government to force employees to give the job to me just because I was born here.

The other response I have to this protectionist view is that immigrants are also consumers which means they will not only be taking jobs, they will be creating jobs too by virtue of increased demand. These five million immigrants are going to be shopping at Walmart, buying lunches at Taco Bell and if Obama gets his way they will also be buying insurance and paying for services, just like everyone else. I don't hear Republicans complain about the fact that there are already over 300 million people in what they take pride in saying is the largest and strongest economy in the world. So I don't understand how 5 million more is going to make any difference.

What does that leave us with? Not much. Of course there is the prejudice, racism and general bigotry which has always characterized the right, from the quiet undercurrents of conservative policy to the most outrageous antics of extreme fascism but Republicans know they can't win over the moderates on racism and bigotry alone. They HAVE to come up with something that at least sounds legitimate. So far they have a big fat ZERO, and apparently they are choosing to continue with a campaign of emotionally changed fallacy in hopes that enough voters will remain ignorant and infuriated to carry the bullshit movement.

I'd have more respect for them if they just said we hate Mexicans at least then they wouldn't be lying.

****************************
I never said I hated Mexicans, in fact I have several Friends on the other side of the Border (Doctor, Nurse, Store Owners). Other friends doing the right thing by going out getting here the Right way.

I use to go to Palomas MX to have my dental work done, until the Cartel beheaded my Dentist. The owner of the Pink Store is all looking over his shoulder when my friends would come to eat. I understand why these people want to come. There is no school in Palomas, so kids are sent across the border to Deming, NM to go to school.

The cartels are already here, with their human trafficing routes well established and run to the Canadian Border. Obama want to bring out all the ones that are in hiding in the shadows. Well if the were all stepping out into the light, there will be more than a mere 5 Million.

FIRST OF ALL LET'S GET THIS STRAIGHT!!!

AN "EXECUTIVE ORDER" TO "ALLOW" PEOPLE TO EMIGRATE IS TOTALLY
DIFFERENT THAN AN "EXECUTIVE ODER" GRANTING ILLEGALS AMNESTY
AFTER THEY HAVE BROKEN THE LAW BY ENTERING THE UNITED STATES
ILLEGALLY!

SECOND!

THE PRESIDENTS AND EXECUTIVE ORDERS WERE ALL MADE
BY A "LEGALLY ELECTED" PRESIDENT UNDER TOTALLY DIFFERENT
CIRCUMSTANCES AND WERE APPROVED BY CONGRESS! WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT WITH (IT)!!! (IT) THAT THING IN THE WHITE HOUSE
DID THIS TOTALLY ON (ITS) OWN, WITHOUT ASKING CONGRESS FOR APPROVAL.
GRANTING ILLEGALS AMNESTY IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT BUCKET OF WORMS!!!
GRANTING EMIGRATION, A LEGAL ACTION IS FINE, AND IS
COVERED IN THE CONSTITUTION!!!
I TAUGHT HISTORY AND GOVERNMENT FOR 43 YEARS, AND KNOW HOW THIS BEAST BEHAVES!!!
true patriot