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Where The Constitution Is Like The Bible And Contradicts Itself, Which Rules Prevail?
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Aug 31, 2019 16:53:47   #
son of witless
 
Liberty Tree wrote:
Would you favor a national primary day? Just asking your opinion.


Yes. It would wipe out the power of the states playing games with their early primaries. I can't remember when Pennsylvania mattered to either party in the primaries. For once this is not a Republican verses Democrat issue. I don't think it would take a Constitutional Amendment either, as would getting rid of the Electoral College.

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Aug 31, 2019 19:44:17   #
Divine truth
 
son of witless wrote:
Yes. It would wipe out the power of the states playing games with their early primaries. I can't remember when Pennsylvania mattered to either party in the primaries. For once this is not a Republican verses Democrat issue. I don't think it would take a Constitutional Amendment either, as would getting rid of the Electoral College.


The CIA Democrats is a book recently posted on a website. The book details and exposure of the effective take over of the 2018 Democrats Party Congressional campaign by candidates drawn from the ranks of former Intelligence agents, special forces operatives, veterans (the Omar's potential candidate), of the war in Iraq and Afghanistan and civilian National security operatives from the Pentagon and state department.

Sounds like the Obama administration deep state. No it's not about Democrats vs. Republicans, its about evil verses good, immorality vs. morality. Satan's vs. God and TRUTH verses lies and falsehood.

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Aug 31, 2019 20:53:59   #
PeterS
 
ImLogicallyRight wrote:
Nice try, but still wrong. We are not a Democracy. We are a Republic. The Electoral College reflects that.

If you don't think we are a democracy then next time there is an election DON'T vote--because that's what they do in democracies which you claim we are not...

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Aug 31, 2019 20:58:11   #
PeterS
 
Divine truth wrote:
The CIA Democrats is a book recently posted on a website. The book details and exposure of the effective take over of the 2018 Democrats Party Congressional campaign by candidates drawn from the ranks of former Intelligence agents, special forces operatives, veterans (the Omar's potential candidate), of the war in Iraq and Afghanistan and civilian National security operatives from the Pentagon and state department.

Sounds like the Obama administration deep state. No it's not about Democrats vs. Republicans, its about evil verses good, immorality vs. morality. Satan's vs. God and TRUTH verses lies and falsehood.
The CIA Democrats is a book recently posted on a w... (show quote)

Glad someone finally admits that Conservatives are EVIL, IMMORAL, BACKED BY SATAN, LIES CONSTANTLY, etc, etc, etc. Divine Truth, you are a breath of fresh air...

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Aug 31, 2019 21:21:51   #
Radiance3
 
PeterS wrote:
If you don't think we are a democracy then next time there is an election DON'T vote--because that's what they do in democracies which you claim we are not...

==============
Democracy? None of that is stated in the Declaration of Independence or in the Constitution. The United States is a Constitutional Republic.
Here is why.

Constitutional Republic:
A constitutional republic is a form of government where the rulers are elected, and the rules are set down in a written constitution. It is often simply called a "republic".The head of state and other representatives are elected but they do not have uncontrolled power. What they may do is written in the constitution. If there is dispute about what the constitution means, this is decided by a court which is independent from the politicians.

The constitution describes how the state may be run. The constitution limits the power of each officeholder. Constitutional republics usually have separation of powers. The separation of powers means that no single officeholder gets unlimited power. John Adams, one of the brilliant framers, said that a constitutional republic was "a government of laws and not of people".

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Aug 31, 2019 23:46:20   #
Divine truth
 
Radiance3 wrote:
==============
Democracy? None of that is stated in the Declaration of Independence or in the Constitution. The United States is a Constitutional Republic.
Here is why.

Constitutional Republic:
A constitutional republic is a form of government where the rulers are elected, and the rules are set down in a written constitution. It is often simply called a "republic".The head of state and other representatives are elected but they do not have uncontrolled power. What they may do is written in the constitution. If there is dispute about what the constitution means, this is decided by a court which is independent from the politicians.

The constitution describes how the state may be run. The constitution limits the power of each officeholder. Constitutional republics usually have separation of powers. The separation of powers means that no single officeholder gets unlimited power. John Adams, one of the brilliant framers, said that a constitutional republic was "a government of laws and not of people".
============== br i Democracy? None of that is st... (show quote)


The Constitution have been hijacked by Communist, sexual predators, and foreign forces, which I identify as the forces of darkness.

Thomas Jefferson on Judicial tyranny said; make the Constitution of wax.

Thomas Jefferson was a stanuch advocate of decentralized power, and recognized that a federal government empowered to judge the extent of its own authority was one that would never remain limited.

The case of the missing 13th Amendment to the Constitution. A few years ago a group of lowa Republicans claimed the legitimate 13th Amendment to the Constitution was missing.

The lowa Republicans didn't want the current 13th Amendment banned, they wanted the original one reintroduced for approval.

That missing proposal was called the Titles of Nobility Amendment (TONA). It sought to ban any American citizen from receiving any foreign (Zionsim) title of Nobility or receiving foreign favor, such as a pension, without congressional approval.

Most Americans Judicial Officers pay their allegiance to Isreal, Zionsim and the homosexual cult, and their black robes mirrors, who control them, the prince of darkness 🤘👹.

In the past I have challenged many of them, to produce proof of jurisdiction and their Delegation of Authority (DOA), they're wasn't able to produce proof, because they aren't constitutional mandated judicial Officers.

I can go into the hidden sercrets of the criminal Enterprise, which violates the U S. Constitution clause of separation of powers.

Attorneys aren't license to practice law, they have Bar Cards, and pay union dues to the Bar Association, they are wards of the state, and a criminal system and Enterprise.

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Sep 1, 2019 00:20:53   #
Radiance3
 
Divine truth wrote:
The Constitution have been hijacked by Communist, sexual predators, and foreign forces, which I identify as the forces of darkness.

Thomas Jefferson on Judicial tyranny said; make the Constitution of wax.

Thomas Jefferson was a stanuch advocate of decentralized power, and recognized that a federal government empowered to judge the extent of its own authority was one that would never remain limited.

The case of the missing 13th Amendment to the Constitution. A few years ago a group of lowa Republicans claimed the legitimate 13th Amendment to the Constitution was missing.

The lowa Republicans didn't want the current 13th Amendment banned, they wanted the original one reintroduced for approval.

That missing proposal was called the Titles of Nobility Amendment (TONA). It sought to ban any American citizen from receiving any foreign (Zionsim) title of Nobility or receiving foreign favor, such as a pension, without congressional approval.

Most Americans Judicial Officers pay their allegiance to Isreal, Zionsim and the homosexual cult, and their black robes mirrors, who control them, the prince of darkness 🤘👹.

In the past I have challenged many of them, to produce proof of jurisdiction and their Delegation of Authority (DOA), they're wasn't able to produce proof, because they aren't constitutional mandated judicial Officers.

I can go into the hidden sercrets of the criminal Enterprise, which violates the U S. Constitution clause of separation of powers.

Attorneys aren't license to practice law, they have Bar Cards, and pay union dues to the Bar Association, they are wards of the state, and a criminal system and Enterprise.
The Constitution have been hijacked by Communist, ... (show quote)

=================
I am confused.
Why was the 13th Amendment missing? I thought that was about the abolition of slavery.


Section 1 Provision
Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

Section 2
Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
End of 13th Amendment

--------------
Title of Nobility Clause:
Also known as the Title of Nobility Clause, Article I, Section 9, Clause 8 of the U.S. Constitution prohibits any person holding a government office from accepting any present, emolument, office, or title from any "King, Prince, or foreign State," without congressional consent.


Titles of Nobility Amendment
The Titles of Nobility Amendment is a proposed amendment to the United States Constitution. The 11th Congress passed it on May 1, 1810, and submitted to the state legislatures for ratification. It would strip United States citizenship from any citizen who accepted a title of nobility from an "emperor, king, prince or foreign power." On two occasions between 1812 and 1816, it was within two states of the number needed to become part of the Constitution. Congress did not set a time limit for its ratification, so the amendment is still pending before the states. Ratification by an additional 26 states is now needed for its adoption.


What has that Zionism to do with the Title of Nobility? Please elaborate.

Reply
 
 
Sep 1, 2019 03:40:42   #
PeterS
 
Radiance3 wrote:
==============
Democracy? None of that is stated in the Declaration of Independence or in the Constitution. The United States is a Constitutional Republic.
Here is why.

Constitutional Republic:
A constitutional republic is a form of government where the rulers are elected, and the rules are set down in a written constitution. It is often simply called a "republic".The head of state and other representatives are elected but they do not have uncontrolled power. What they may do is written in the constitution. If there is dispute about what the constitution means, this is decided by a court which is independent from the politicians.

The constitution describes how the state may be run. The constitution limits the power of each officeholder. Constitutional republics usually have separation of powers. The separation of powers means that no single officeholder gets unlimited power. John Adams, one of the brilliant framers, said that a constitutional republic was "a government of laws and not of people".
============== br i Democracy? None of that is st... (show quote)


Snip>>No determinations are carried, it is true, in a simple representative democracy, but by consent of the majority or their representatives. John Adams (1784)

And the same two meanings of "democracy" (sometimes direct democracy, sometimes popular self-government more generally) existed at the founding of the republic as well. Some framing-era commentators made arguments that distinguished "democracy" and "republic"; see, for instance, the Federalist (No. 10), as well as other numbers of the Federalist papers. But even in that era, "representative democracy" was understood as a form of democracy, alongside "pure democracy": John Adams used the term "representative democracy" in 1794; so did Noah Webster in 1785; so did St. George Tucker in his 1803 edition of Blackstone; so did Thomas Jefferson in 1815. Tucker's Blackstone likewise uses "democracy" to describe a representative democracy, even when the qualifier "representative" is omitted.


Is that enough of the founders for you? If the founders saw us as a representative democracy how is it you have decided that we are not...because somehow being of the people is offensive to you?

And I find it 'cute' that you would bring up the emoluments clause since your king panders for money left and right without any objection from you cons...

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Sep 1, 2019 03:58:45   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
PeterS wrote:
Snip>>No determinations are carried, it is true, in a simple representative democracy, but by consent of the majority or their representatives. John Adams (1784)

And the same two meanings of "democracy" (sometimes direct democracy, sometimes popular self-government more generally) existed at the founding of the republic as well. Some framing-era commentators made arguments that distinguished "democracy" and "republic"; see, for instance, the Federalist (No. 10), as well as other numbers of the Federalist papers. But even in that era, "representative democracy" was understood as a form of democracy, alongside "pure democracy": John Adams used the term "representative democracy" in 1794; so did Noah Webster in 1785; so did St. George Tucker in his 1803 edition of Blackstone; so did Thomas Jefferson in 1815. Tucker's Blackstone likewise uses "democracy" to describe a representative democracy, even when the qualifier "representative" is omitted.


Is that enough of the founders for you? If the founders saw us as a representative democracy how is it you have decided that we are not...because somehow being of the people is offensive to you?

And I find it 'cute' that you would bring up the emoluments clause since your king panders for money left and right without any objection from you cons...
Snip>> b i No determinations are carried, i... (show quote)
Been picking cherries again, hey pete?

Republic vs Democracy

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Sep 1, 2019 05:54:33   #
PeterS
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
Been picking cherries again, hey pete?

Republic vs Democracy

Yes, full definitions with references. You know, the usual...

What's funny Blade is that I can tell that you didn't even read what I wrote. To the founders, a Republic and a representative democracy were one and the same. But hey, cherry-pick away, how else could you believe anything...

Here's my question to you Blade how do we elect our representatives if not by individual vote for a individual person with the one who holds the majority the winner? Is that not what we do in a democracy? Even the electoral college is set up for a majority. Our house and senate vote by majority and even SCOTUS is predicated by majority. These are all principles of democracy Blade and if you do not think so then don't vote and that will settle that, problem solved...

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Sep 1, 2019 06:06:54   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
PeterS wrote:
Yes, full definitions with references. You know, the usual...

What's funny Blade is that I can tell that you didn't even read what I wrote. To the founders, a Republic and a representative democracy were one and the same. But hey, cherry-pick away, how else could you believe anything...
OK. a representative democracy. Got it. Now, see if you can find what our founders thought about Democratic Socialism, or more accurately a progressive socialist oligarchy, you know, that ungodly thing your "representatives" are trying to foist upon us.

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Sep 1, 2019 06:45:02   #
rebob14
 
woodguru wrote:
The constitution doesn't generally contradict itself very much, the bible a bit more. So those who believe in god, what do they believe when the bible sends mixed messages, which ones do people go by? Many go by the message that is what they want to believe, that fits their personal beliefs. One christian adheres to tenets of loving their fellow man and they have a tolerance for gays, others flip out about gays and latch onto words that are harsher about gays.

My point being the basic fundamental premise of a democracy is one person one vote, all votes being equal whether they be a black, white, hispanic, or muslim.

The concept of taking the power of their one vote away from people is anti constitutional to the core. Given the one person one vote basis there is a conflict of interest that needs to be sorted. Either say we are not a democracy by the people for the people or take a hard look at the very concept of what an electoral college is and what it's for, and determine whether that is more important than the core premise. The united states is the only country in the world that deviates from one person one vote, and it is an idiotic concept.

States have their sovereignty in singular state issues that the rest of the country can't dictate to them that their state government can set the rules on, the united states has an obligation to provide the same basic rights to everyone in the country concerning civil rights. Election rules need to be adopted that standardize rules and procedures that work so that states can't monkey with people's ability to vote the way several states are.

As pointed out by Hayes, since 1992 republicans have won the popular one time but had three presidents, if it were the other way the electoral would have been eliminated a long time ago. Republicans can keep their red states and do whatever they want for those states, but America is unfortunately a dem majority country and the rules need to favor that majority. This minority controlled country is destroying democracy to keep control.

https://dennismichaellynch.com/video-msnbcs-chris-hayes-if-the-electoral-college-wasnt-in-the-constitution-it-would-be-unconstitutional/
The constitution doesn't generally contradict itse... (show quote)


The Constitution guarantees to every State a Republican form of government. That’s a quote.......that’s what it says.........it needs no “interpretation “!!

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Sep 1, 2019 06:47:04   #
rebob14
 
PeterS wrote:
Yes, full definitions with references. You know, the usual...

What's funny Blade is that I can tell that you didn't even read what I wrote. To the founders, a Republic and a representative democracy were one and the same. But hey, cherry-pick away, how else could you believe anything...

Here's my question to you Blade how do we elect our representatives if not by individual vote for a individual person with the one who holds the majority the winner? Is that not what we do in a democracy? Even the electoral college is set up for a majority. Our house and senate vote by majority and even SCOTUS is predicated by majority. These are all principles of democracy Blade and if you do not think so then don't vote and that will settle that, problem solved...
Yes, full definitions with references. You know, t... (show quote)


It may help to read the Federalist Papers.

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Sep 1, 2019 07:20:19   #
Radiance3
 
PeterS wrote:
Snip>>No determinations are carried, it is true, in a simple representative democracy, but by consent of the majority or their representatives. John Adams (1784)

And the same two meanings of "democracy" (sometimes direct democracy, sometimes popular self-government more generally) existed at the founding of the republic as well. Some framing-era commentators made arguments that distinguished "democracy" and "republic"; see, for instance, the Federalist (No. 10), as well as other numbers of the Federalist papers. But even in that era, "representative democracy" was understood as a form of democracy, alongside "pure democracy": John Adams used the term "representative democracy" in 1794; so did Noah Webster in 1785; so did St. George Tucker in his 1803 edition of Blackstone; so did Thomas Jefferson in 1815. Tucker's Blackstone likewise uses "democracy" to describe a representative democracy, even when the qualifier "representative" is omitted.


Is that enough of the founders for you? If the founders saw us as a representative democracy how is it you have decided that we are not...because somehow being of the people is offensive to you?

And I find it 'cute' that you would bring up the emoluments clause since your king panders for money left and right without any objection from you cons...
Snip>> b i No determinations are carried, i... (show quote)

================
I would defy your interpretation for the sake of trying to find the closest term for our form of government, a democracy or a constitutional republic. The closest description of our government is a constitutional republic because though the people are elected to represent us, their powers are guided and driven by the constitution.

The Cross-Partisan Action Network
| 1.28.19

Article Hero Image
Is America a Democracy or a Republic?
Do you think America is a democracy?
Yes
or
No
In Rob Stein's recent conversation on the American ideals of E Pluribus Unum and cross-partisanship, you—the readers—shared provocative questions and opinions. Now, we're continuing the conversation with some of the top themes that emerged. Check out the original piece here, and click above to take action!
Is America a Democracy or a Republic?

By Rob Stein
First, thanks to each of you who commented that I used the word “democracy” throughout the essay to describe America's form of government. In doing so, I was imprecise. In order to adequately consider the virtues and values of cross-partisanship, we need consensus about constitutional intent regarding our form of government.

In discussing this topic, I would caution that semantics can get in the way of intelligent resolution and agreement. The words “democracy” and “republic” are frequently interchanged and confused and we need to be careful not to micro-analyze these terms.

Here are the Miriam-Webster definitions:
“A republic is a government in which the extreme power resides in a body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by elected officers and representatives responsible to them and governing according to law.


“A “democracy” is a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and is exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections”

When asked what sort of government the constitutional convention had created, Benjamin Franklin famously said, “A republic, if you can keep it.”

Some dream of a “direct democracy” – a form of government in which citizens vote not just for “representatives”, but vote directly on policies and governing matters (e.g., budgets, revenue, expenditures, etc.). While many states have ballot initiatives and referenda which empower citizens to vote on substantive issues, this is not the Constitutional role of citizens in the operations of the federal government.

Therefore, I agree with those of you who made the correct observation that we are closest to the Founder’s intent when we refer to the form of federal government envisioned and embedded in our Constitution as a “representative republic”. This clarifies two critical elements of our federal system – it emphasizes that (1) the role of citizens is to vote for representatives and hold them accountable; and (2) the roles of our elected representatives – Congress and the Executive - are to legislate and govern.

Thanks again for helping to clarify this vitally important distinction between a democracy and a republic. Henceforth, I generally will use “representative republic”, or “representative form of government”, when referring to our federal system. And occasionally, when I need a synonym, I may refer to the federal government as a “representative democracy”.


Rob Stein is a former Senior Strategist, Democratic National Committee (1989-1992); Founder, Democracy Alliance (2005); Co-founder, Committee On States (2007); and currently committed to building an enduring cross-partisan constituency to chart the track back to the ideals of E Pluribus Unum.

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Sep 1, 2019 09:47:00   #
padremike Loc: Phenix City, Al
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
The Bible does not contradict itself..
The Constitution does not contradict itself.
People interpret what they read in different ways.
No one's vote is "taken away".
America is neither a secular nation nor is it a democracy.
America is a Republic founded on the moral principles of Christianity.
Our government is not America, and it is not a theocracy.
40% of Americans are conservative,
35% of Americans are moderate,
21% of Americans are liberal,
70% of Americans are religious.
21% of Americans have no religion,
3% of Americans are atheists,
5% of Americans are agnostic.
The 17th Amendment should be repealed.
The Bible does not contradict itself.. br The Con... (show quote)


A great synopsis Blade. You always provide good information.

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