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What will our country be like a year from now?
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Aug 20, 2018 15:44:05   #
Sicilianthing
 
eagleye13 wrote:
A progressive income tax is a plank of the Communist Manifesto.

BTW; it is misapplied to 98% of US citizens.
Read 'Cracking the Code' by Hendrickson.


>>>>

Bullseye !

Ok I’ll add it to the reading list...

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 16:29:42   #
buffalo Loc: Texas
 
son of witless wrote:
Consistency. If we must bash the rich out of class envy then also bash the rich who fund the Jack asses.


I am not bashing the rich out of class envy. I am bashing the rich because They exist in both parties, yes. But THEY are problem is in DC and statehouses. They have (with their money) bought control of both houses of Congress and the legislation the is puked from those halls is every bit slanted to help them get richer and maintain their power even if at the expense of the middle and poor classes.

The latest example of this is the repulsive and trumpy's tax cuts for the wealthy and big corporations accompanied by a revised lies of the trickle down myth and increased federal revenue.

Now trumpy is contemplating capitial gains be indexed to inflation. A $10 MILLION dollar stock purchase held for, say, 3 years and inflation is 5% during that period then sold for $12 MILLION instead of a capital gains tax on the $2 MILLION profit there would only be a capital gains tax on $1.5 MILLION. Bingo and automatic bonus of $500,000 TAX FREE!

The same would hold for real estate investments. Trumpy and his kiddos would benefit MILLION from this sham!

The next thing the repulsive are going to do is throw the elderly and poor under the bus by cutting Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid to OFFSET the RISING federal deficit caused by their tax cuts for the wealthy and big corporations.

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 17:38:25   #
son of witless
 
buffalo wrote:
I am not bashing the rich out of class envy. I am bashing the rich because They exist in both parties, yes. But THEY are problem is in DC and statehouses. They have (with their money) bought control of both houses of Congress and the legislation the is puked from those halls is every bit slanted to help them get richer and maintain their power even if at the expense of the middle and poor classes.

The latest example of this is the repulsive and trumpy's tax cuts for the wealthy and big corporations accompanied by a revised lies of the trickle down myth and increased federal revenue.

Now trumpy is contemplating capitial gains be indexed to inflation. A $10 MILLION dollar stock purchase held for, say, 3 years and inflation is 5% during that period then sold for $12 MILLION instead of a capital gains tax on the $2 MILLION profit there would only be a capital gains tax on $1.5 MILLION. Bingo and automatic bonus of $500,000 TAX FREE!

The same would hold for real estate investments. Trumpy and his kiddos would benefit MILLION from this sham!

The next thing the repulsive are going to do is throw the elderly and poor under the bus by cutting Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid to OFFSET the RISING federal deficit caused by their tax cuts for the wealthy and big corporations.
I am not bashing the rich out of class envy. I am ... (show quote)


Of course it is class envy. Someone must be blamed for the ills of the nation. Why not the rich ? I do not say you are wrong in bashing SOME RICH. What I dislike is the blanket approach. The rich are like everyone else, they come in all flavors. What you dislike, I applaud. The rich should pay the same rate as you or I and that does not include capital gains.

To me the best way to control the rich for the greater good is to allow them to be them. Let them compete against one another for my services and yours. They do a far better job than some closet Communist bureaucrat in Washington DC directing the economy. Does it ever occur to you to wonder why so many rich give money to Socialists like Bernie and his young lady side kick Ocasio-Cortez ? Why they are for higher taxes ?

Those rich have made their money. Either they are retired or their money is in tax shelters. Those are the evil, worthless rich I hate. What they do not want is the new rich having the same money as them. In my vast experience in this state called life, class envy is destructive. If some guy bets a lot of his money on a total crap shoot and finds a great new oil patch where everyone else thought he was nuts, why would you punish this guy ? WHY ???? He bet the farm and won. He just found new oil for a needy country, provided well paying jobs for a bunch of people, and made himself and a few others filthy rich. http://www.foxbusiness.com/features/geologist-scores-massive-alaskan-oil-well-on-a-hunch

This is capitalism at its best. To lump this guy in with the rich parasites who bribe our Senators and Congressmen is not right, but that is what you are doing ! ! That is the Venezuelan model of hating the rich. This is the difference between the risk takers of the real world and those whose only risk is that the politicians they bribe will be voted out.

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Aug 20, 2018 17:55:15   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
buffalo wrote:
I am not bashing the rich out of class envy. I am bashing the rich because They exist in both parties, yes. But THEY are problem is in DC and statehouses. They have (with their money) bought control of both houses of Congress and the legislation the is puked from those halls is every bit slanted to help them get richer and maintain their power even if at the expense of the middle and poor classes.

The latest example of this is the repulsive and trumpy's tax cuts for the wealthy and big corporations accompanied by a revised lies of the trickle down myth and increased federal revenue.

Now trumpy is contemplating capitial gains be indexed to inflation. A $10 MILLION dollar stock purchase held for, say, 3 years and inflation is 5% during that period then sold for $12 MILLION instead of a capital gains tax on the $2 MILLION profit there would only be a capital gains tax on $1.5 MILLION. Bingo and automatic bonus of $500,000 TAX FREE!

The same would hold for real estate investments. Trumpy and his kiddos would benefit MILLION from this sham!

The next thing the repulsive are going to do is throw the elderly and poor under the bus by cutting Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid to OFFSET the RISING federal deficit caused by their tax cuts for the wealthy and big corporations.
I am not bashing the rich out of class envy. I am ... (show quote)


The message is getting wings.
Fly baby fly.

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 18:00:51   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
son of witless wrote:
Of course it is class envy. Someone must be blamed for the ills of the nation. Why not the rich ? I do not say you are wrong in bashing SOME RICH. What I dislike is the blanket approach. The rich are like everyone else, they come in all flavors. What you dislike, I applaud. The rich should pay the same rate as you or I and that does not include capital gains.

To me the best way to control the rich for the greater good is to allow them to be them. Let them compete against one another for my services and yours. They do a far better job than some closet Communist bureaucrat in Washington DC directing the economy. Does it ever occur to you to wonder why so many rich give money to Socialists like Bernie and his young lady side kick Ocasio-Cortez ? Why they are for higher taxes ?

Those rich have made their money. Either they are retired or their money is in tax shelters. Those are the evil, worthless rich I hate. What they do not want is the new rich having the same money as them. In my vast experience in this state called life, class envy is destructive. If some guy bets a lot of his money on a total crap shoot and finds a great new oil patch where everyone else thought he was nuts, why would you punish this guy ? WHY ???? He bet the farm and won. He just found new oil for a needy country, provided well paying jobs for a bunch of people, and made himself and a few others filthy rich. http://www.foxbusiness.com/features/geologist-scores-massive-alaskan-oil-well-on-a-hunch

This is capitalism at its best. To lump this guy in with the rich parasites who bribe our Senators and Congressmen is not right, but that is what you are doing ! ! That is the Venezuelan model of hating the rich. This is the difference between the risk takers of the real world and those whose only risk is that the politicians they bribe will be voted out.
Of course it is class envy. Someone must be blamed... (show quote)


You picked the wrong topic to show case your view.

Oil companies get to deduct all cost spent in seeking & drilling for the oil.
Then get to write off 27 1/2 % of profits before paying any taxes.

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 18:18:11   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
son of witless wrote:
Why do you lump all of the rich into the same pot ? Why do you assume that all of the wealthy are all Republicans. Democrats have more than matched Republicans in Rich Guy support for at least the last decade.

Why do you assume that Obama and Hillary voters are not just as stupid as Trump voters ?


If we are going to support a system that is fair in having potential for all to have a fair chance to have a fair share in things.
It is only fair to have a system that sees there is some money in the pot for every one.

The more players in the game with a chance to have a winning hand once in a while is better than the house taking out money from every hand,
Leaving smaller pots & less winners the longer you play.

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 18:29:24   #
son of witless
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
You picked the wrong topic to show case your view.

Oil companies get to deduct all cost spent in seeking & drilling for the oil.
Then get to write off 27 1/2 % of profits before paying any taxes.


That is great news.

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Aug 20, 2018 18:32:03   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
son of witless wrote:
That is great news.


It is if you invest in oil.
Rather than just buying it.

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 18:32:44   #
son of witless
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
If we are going to support a system that is fair in having potential for all to have a fair chance to have a fair share in things.
It is only fair to have a system that sees there is some money in the pot for every one.

The more players in the game with a chance to have a winning hand once in a while is better than the house taking out money from every hand,
Leaving smaller pots & less winners the longer you play.


That is great theory. Every time what you propose gets put into action it is disaster. Capitalism is not perfect. You want perfect. Socialism fails. Cuba, the Soviet Union, and Venezuela are failures of what you believe. Give me examples of your successes.

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Aug 20, 2018 18:38:53   #
son of witless
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
It is if you invest in oil.
Rather than just buying it.


So what is the problem ?

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Aug 20, 2018 18:48:33   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
son of witless wrote:
That is great theory. Every time what you propose gets put into action it is disaster. Capitalism is not perfect. You want perfect. Socialism fails. Cuba, the Soviet Union, and Venezuela are failures of what you believe. Give me examples of your successes.


Capitalism was great in this nation for a while.
But the wealthy have used their gains to buy out government.
I say that was taking capitalism to an extreme.
It leaves us no longer being any thing like a democracy.

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Aug 20, 2018 18:55:08   #
son of witless
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
Capitalism was great in this nation for a while.
But the wealthy have used their gains to buy out government.
I say that was taking capitalism to an extreme.
It leaves us no longer being any thing like a democracy.


Just when was it different ? I say it is pretty much what it has always been.

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Aug 20, 2018 19:01:07   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
son of witless wrote:
So what is the problem ?


It has helped Big Money to get Bigger & allows them to buy more of the country.

It is good old capitalizm allowing some to get back more than they put in.(Much More)

I have some oil stocks. & get a decent diividen.

I wish that people would get it that I am not looking for what is good for me.
I say that there needs to be more peole that are as well off as I am.

It has to do with having assects.
Having no assets leaves a person in bad shape.
More people are having this problem every day.

I would say that there are many who lean to the right think just because they become self emplyed they are intitiled to have the tax laws favor their situation.
Not stoping to realize that it is the general public that needs more money. Money to spend to at small buisnesses to make them a better profit. (Not some bankers.d

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Aug 20, 2018 19:20:45   #
Floyd Brown Loc: Milwaukee WI
 
son of witless wrote:
Just when was it different ? I say it is pretty much what it has always been.


I would say that you are nearing the end of your dream of what is truly going on around you.

Reply
Aug 20, 2018 19:42:57   #
son of witless
 
Floyd Brown wrote:
It has helped Big Money to get Bigger & allows them to buy more of the country.

It is good old capitalizm allowing some to get back more than they put in.(Much More)
I have some oil stocks. & get a decent diividen.

I wish that people would get it that I am not looking for what is goos foe me.
I say that there needs to be more peole that are as well off as I am.

It has to do with having assects.
Having no assets leaves a person in bad shape.
More people are having this problem every day.

I would say that there are many who lean to the right think just because they become self emplyed they are intitiled to have the tqax laws gfavor their situation.
Not stoping to realize that it is the general public that needs more money. Money to spend to at small buisnesses to make them a better profit. (Not some bankers.)
It has helped Big Money to get Bigger & allows... (show quote)


Your concern for those who have less than you is duly noted. I am sure that when you can, you share your good fortune through charity giving as you can afford, as I do. The problem with that is, the more you give, the more they want.

Where we disagree is with taxes. To me, taxes are a necessary evil. As such they should not be one penny above the absolute minimum to get the job done. Redistributing the wealth is in my opinion always a horrible idea.

I agree that having assets is good and that many do not. Of average working Americans there are three types. Spenders, savers, and investors. Spenders believe in spending every cent they make as fast or faster than they make it, because "you could be dead tomorrow and wouldn't you feel stupid if you did not have that extra ice cream cone, beer, or buy that brand new car before you died ". You cannot argue with that statement and win. I tried.

Then you have your savers. They are afraid they will never die, which is bad because it means they might run out of money if they lose their job. That fear in moderation is good. Lastly you have your investors. Those are savers who have mastered their fear of losing even a penny in order that they can make some real money at investing. They are not the ones who get suckered into get rich schemes. Those tend to be spenders who come into an unexpected windfall.

Except when the bottom drops out, none of those three groups does better when the government takes from the rich and gives to them.

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