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Dispelling the myth of a ‘Christian nation’
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Sep 3, 2013 03:01:59   #
OPP Newsletter
 
http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-christian-nation

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Sep 3, 2013 05:16:47   #
severed2009
 
Some of the states had state religions (like Congregationalism) for the first few years of our existence, but they gave them up. The God of most of the Founders was the watchmaker God who started the watch ticking and then just observed it. Their talk of God was mainly boilerplate; the Chinese government talks about c*******m, but it doesnt mean anything.

If we were a christian nation, it was certainly not an Evangelical one any more than it was a Catholic one. It would be conservative mainline Protestant, which believes in science and evolution and the Social Gospel when not pushed to extremes.

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Sep 3, 2013 06:16:02   #
msbets
 
severed............No one has ever said it was a Evangelical or Catholic.......how about any attempt to establish an islam nation, islam is not a religion, it's a cult, it's an attempt to CONTROL, they k**l each other and so called infidels in the name of some moron, this moronic outfit will throw us back to the dark ages and I for one prefer not to go there.

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Sep 3, 2013 06:19:54   #
Lou Loc: Florida
 
Most of the founding fathers were Masons or Deists . They believed in the ONE God , but were mutually accepting of other religions or paths to the same Creator . Their imprint is literally every where in our nations early beginnings , from the very design of the Capitol to the symbols printed on our money . Yes there were Christians but they were NOT predominantly Christian . They were tolerant of all religion and more or less agreed on holding to the ten Commandments as a universally accepted code of behavior . The Puritan's were an exception , and I doubt if they had any influence in the later colonists who rebelled against the King . That r*******n was founded in economic and social e******y , not religion .

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Sep 3, 2013 08:42:45   #
Homestead
 
OPP Newsletter wrote:
http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-christian-nation




A Few Declarations of Founding Fathers and Early Statesmen on Jesus, Christianity, and the Bible

Elias Boudinot

PRESIDENT OF CONGRESS; SIGNED THE PEACE TREATY TO END THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION; FIRST ATTORNEY ADMITTED TO THE U. S. SUPREME COURT BAR; FRAMER OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS; DIRECTOR OF THE U. S. MINT

Let us enter on this important business under the idea that we are Christians on whom the eyes of the world are now turned… [L]et us earnestly call and beseech Him, for Christ’s sake, to preside in our councils. . . . We can only depend on the all powerful influence of the Spirit of God, Whose Divine aid and assistance it becomes us as a Christian people most devoutly to implore. Therefore I move that some minister of the Gospel be requested to attend this Congress every morning . . . in order to open the meeting with prayer.17

A letter to his daughter:

You have been instructed from your childhood in the knowledge of your lost state by nature – the absolute necessity of a change of heart and an entire renovation of soul to the image of Jesus Christ – of salvation through His meritorious righteousness only – and the indispensable necessity of personal holiness without which no man shall see the Lord [Hebrews 12:14]. You are well acquainted that the most perfect and consummate doctrinal knowledge is of no avail without it operates on and sincerely affects the heart, changes the practice, and totally influences the will – and that without the almighty power of the Spirit of God enlightening your mind, subduing your will, and continually drawing you to Himself, you can do nothing. . . . And may the God of your parents (for many generations past) seal instruction to your soul and lead you to Himself through the blood of His too greatly despised Son, Who notwithstanding, is still reclaiming the world to God through that blood, not imputing to them their sins. To Him be glory forever!18

http://www.wallbuilders.com/libissuesarticles.asp?id=8755


From "The Naked C*******t," by Cleon Skousen

CURRENT C*******T GOALS

25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."

27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."

28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."

29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man."

31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the C*******ts took over.

32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.

http://www.uhuh.com/nwo/c*******m/comgoals.htm


Step away from the Coolaid,
easy, put it down,
now walk away.

This nation was founded by Christian men and women, who believed in the natural law of man.

Sooooo, what is Natural law?

Natural Law is God's will derived over time, some of it directly, like through the Ten Commandments, the rest by Revealed God's Law.

http://www.nccs.net/natural-law-the-ultimate-source-of-constitutional-law.php

This is clearly stated in the Declaration of Independence. This is the mission statement for the upcoming Constitution, quit blowing it off!

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these t***hs to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.


To claim that this country is not a Christian nation when the very foundation it rests on is based on God's will and his laws is absolutely insane.
The Constitution does not give us rights, our rights are God given and the Constitution is responsible for protecting those rights.
Who does that.......Atheists?

Quit trying to cherry pick around the history of this country.

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Sep 3, 2013 10:33:59   #
Lou Loc: Florida
 
No one said anything about atheists , Deists and Monotheists are not atheists . I don't care what letters you dig up .The Constitution does not affirm Christianity , it simply confirms and assumes a universal belief in the Creator .
So stop talking like an I***T , and making accusations of c*******m and the rest of your ignorant self righteous rant . The most common faith among Americans was Christian , however that is not true of the founding fathers , neither was it written into the Constitution .
Look it up yourself jack-ass , nothing is cherry picked .

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Sep 3, 2013 10:53:53   #
rumitoid
 
OPP Newsletter wrote:
http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/dispelling-the-myth-of-a-christian-nation


This link below seems a fair-minded reply to the question, which, if you do not want to read, tells us they were mostly Christians of various sects and a few deist, most notably Jefferson and Franklyn. Some other intersting facts in this piece as well.
http://www.jameswatkins.com/foundingfathers.htm

To be a Christian Nation, it is absolutely essential for the founding documents incorporating our country recognize Jesus Christ; just saying God is not enough. Nowhere is Jesus Christ mentioned in those documents.
The "unalienable rights" is a deist belief and is not--repeat, not--biblical.

This is simple history, not a plot. Revisionist left would have it mostly deist, evangelical right mostly Christian. By population at the time, vastly Christian. The separation of church and state was to keep some Christian denomination from gaining power and repeating what happened in Europe.

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Sep 3, 2013 11:00:42   #
Lou Loc: Florida
 
rumitoid wrote:
This link below seems a fair-minded reply to the question, which, if you do not want to read, tells us they were mostly Christians of various sects and a few deist, most notably Jefferson and Franklyn. Some other intersting facts in this piece as well.
http://www.jameswatkins.com/foundingfathers.htm

To be a Christian Nation, it is absolutely essential for the founding documents incorporating our country recognize Jesus Christ; just saying God is not enough. Nowhere is Jesus Christ mentioned in those documents.
The "unalienable rights" is a deist belief and is not--repeat, not--biblical.
This link below seems a fair-minded reply to the q... (show quote)


look out you'll get accused of being a c*******t . It's not enough for some people to recognize that most of the population of the US has been , and is today Christian , they have to attempt to prove that it was specifically written into the Constitution .
Sorry this ain't no theocracy, that has to adopt any Christian religious dogma as law .Because that's what the proponents if such would like to see .

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Sep 3, 2013 11:18:06   #
rumitoid
 
Lou wrote:
look out you'll get accused of being a c*******t . It's not enough for some people to recognize that most of the population of the US has been , and is today Christian , they have to attempt to prove that it was specifically written into the Constitution .
Sorry this ain't no theocracy, that has to adopt any Christian religious dogma as law .Because that's what the proponents if such would like to see .


It seems if one does not turn a blind eye to the mistakes America made in the past, never, ever mentioning or hinting at these egregious errors and policies, one is un-American, which I have been accused of a few times here.
But from their perspective, I see their point: to some of them, being liberal means you are a c****e looking to bring down this country. The motivation, then, for the little history lesson is to weaken belief in our nation. Also, being passionately patriotic and extremely concerned for the fate of the country can understandably produce a, er, passionate response.

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Sep 3, 2013 12:13:49   #
Lou Loc: Florida
 
I think homestead has expressed precisely where he's going with all this . Believe as I do .....or you're a c****e t*****r . So I must accept homestead's revisionist history .
I am a Christian , I have no ax to grind against Christians , but Jesus and Christianity are nowhere mentioned in the Constitution , or Declaration of Independence . And that FACT does not affect my faith adversely in any way./


p.s. rumitoid , I made no mention of egregious errors or policies , that is your addition . I am addressing specifically what homestead claims as historical in the context of the thread's title and subject .

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Sep 3, 2013 12:24:43   #
rumitoid
 
Lou wrote:
I think homestead has expressed precisely where he's going with all this . Believe as I do .....or you're a c****e t*****r . So I must accept homestead's revisionist history .
I am a Christian , I have no ax to grind against Christians , but Jesus and Christianity are nowhere mentioned in the Constitution , or Declaration of Independence . And that FACT does not affect my faith adversely in any way./


p.s. rumitoid , I made no mention of egregious errors or policies , that is your addition . I am addressing specifically what homestead claims as historical in the context of the thread's title and subject .
I think homestead has expressed precisely where he... (show quote)


Never said or suggested you did, I was talking about how I got labeled un-American by simply reporting some historical facts.

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Sep 3, 2013 13:36:25   #
Lou Loc: Florida
 
rumitoid wrote:
Never said or suggested you did, I was talking about how I got labeled un-American by simply reporting some historical facts.


Deviate from any teabag narrative , and that makes you a t*****r . Just watch what happens to Cruz after he approved Obama's decision to get approval from Congress on Syria .
And then you have the Neo-Con warmongers who will complain , he didn't need congressional approval .

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Sep 3, 2013 17:42:02   #
Homestead
 
Lou wrote:
No one said anything about atheists , Deists and Monotheists are not atheists . I don't care what letters you dig up .The Constitution does not affirm Christianity , it simply confirms and assumes a universal belief in the Creator .
So stop talking like an I***T , and making accusations of c*******m and the rest of your ignorant self righteous rant . The most common faith among Americans was Christian , however that is not true of the founding fathers , neither was it written into the Constitution .
Look it up yourself jack-ass , nothing is cherry picked .
No one said anything about atheists , Deists and ... (show quote)


"I don't care what letters you dig up."

I can believe that, most ignorant people are so by choice and it's obvious that you made yours.

Tell me something Jackass,
Is the Christian bible Christian?
Because, I've read Jesus teachings, but, no where does the bible say it's a Christian document.


The Declaration of Independence is the mission statement of the Constitution and the Federalist Papers form the instruction manual.

Cherry picking also includes avoiding the t***h, not just picking out individual facts out of context.

PUT THE COOLAID DOWN,
Step away from the coolaid,

You have been indoctrinated, but, it's OK, a good healthy does of real American History can cure you, you just have to get off your butt.

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Sep 3, 2013 17:59:34   #
Lou Loc: Florida
 
Homestead wrote:
"I don't care what letters you dig up."

I can believe that, most ignorant people are so by choice and it's obvious that you made yours.

Tell me something Jackass,
Is the Christian bible Christian?
Because, I've read Jesus teachings, but, no where does the bible say it's a Christian document.


The Declaration of Independence is the mission statement of the Constitution and the Federalist Papers form the instruction manual.

Cherry picking also includes avoiding the t***h, not just picking out individual facts out of context.

PUT THE COOLAID DOWN,
Step away from the coolaid,

You have been indoctrinated, but, it's OK, a good healthy does of real American History can cure you, you just have to get off your butt.
"I don't care what letters you dig up." ... (show quote)


Is it in the Constitution ? Find the word Christian in the Constitution . Is it in the Declaration of Independence ? Find the word Christian or Jesus in the Declaration of Independence .
I DON'T DRINK KOOL-AID , THAT IS FOR RELIGIONIST I***TS LIKE YOURSELF .

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Sep 3, 2013 18:22:32   #
Homestead
 
Lou wrote:
Is it in the Constitution ? Find the word Christian in the Constitution . Is it in the Declaration of Independence ? Find the word Christian or Jesus in the Declaration of Independence .
I DON'T DRINK KOOL-AID , THAT IS FOR RELIGIONIST I***TS LIKE YOURSELF .


Find the word Christian in the bible!

Just what creator do you think they were talking about,

The Mayan God, you know the one that demanded that a beating
heart be ripped out of a sacrifices chest in order for the sun to
rise????

Maybe one of the tribal God's that required virgins to be thrown
into the volcano???

Maybe they were talking about the witches god, which will come
as a great surprise to some people in Salem, Massachusetts.

Do you think they were talking about the God of Islam, that says
Allah is the only God and that Muslims are not only superior, but,
that anyone else is an infidel and has no right to live. Not only that
but that there is no separation of church and state because the
church is the state.

When our forefathers said "God given inalienable rights," what God do you think they were talking about.

You don't even want to look at letters that would inform you, so I won't bother recommending a book, such as the "5000 Year Leap" which can be easily understood by an eight year old. I think that it is well above your pay grade. Which means I won't even suggest that you read the Federalist Papers which was written to explain the Constitution, by the writers of the Constitution, when if was v**ed on unanimously in all of the existing states at that time.

PUT THE COOLAID DOWN,
Step away from the coolaid
It's not good for you.

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