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Two More Female Marines Dropped from Infantry Course
Jan 9, 2015 16:14:53   #
JMHO Loc: Utah
 
Twenty-nine attempts by female officers on the course, with none passing.

Two female Marine officers who volunteered to attempt the Corps’ challenging Infantry Officer Course did not proceed beyond the first day of the course, a Marine Corps spokesperson confirms to the Free Beacon. The two were the only female officers attempting the course in the current cycle, which began Thursday in Quantico, Virginia.

With the two most recent drops, there have been 29 attempts by female officers to pass the course since women have been allowed to volunteer, with none making it to graduation. (At least one woman has attempted the course more than once.) Only three female officers have made it beyond the initial day of training, a grueling evaluation known as the Combat Endurance Test, or CET. Male officers also regularly fail to pass the CET, and the overall course has a substantial attrition rate for males.

The Marine Corps spokesperson, Captain Maureen Krebs, told the Free Beacon that the two officers, “did not meet the standards required of them on day one in order to continue on with the course.” Fifteen male officers also did not meet the standards. Of the 118 officers who began the course, 101 proceeded to the second day.

The Marine Corps, along with the other services, has been evaluating how to comply with the order to g****r-integrate its combat arms specialties by the end of this year, or apply for special exemptions.

The results of the Marine Corps’ experimentation thus far has revealed a pattern: Female enlisted Marines have been able to graduate from the enlisted School of Infantry’s Infantry Training Battalion in Camp Lejeune, North Carolina, though at a lower rate than male enlisted Marines, while female officers have faced great difficulty in graduating from the course in Quantico.

This situation has led some involved with the policy debate in Washington, D.C., to suggest that the standards at the officer’s course in Quantico–which are substantially higher than for the enlisted course–are unrealistically challenging, and need to be lowered.

The Marine Corps is in a tough spot. Marines follow orders, and the order is to integrate the g****rs. But the effort to integrate has revealed something that is uncomfortable for proponents of reform: Keeping the traditionally high standards of the Marine infantry will result in a situation where there are a handful of enlisted female Marines in every infantry battalion, and effectively no female infantry officers.

Pressure will become tremendous to reduce those standards–something that the overwhelming majority of Marines, including those women who currently wish to serve in the infantry, believe would be damaging to the service.

BY: Aaron MacLean

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Jan 9, 2015 16:37:05   #
lpnmajor Loc: Arkansas
 
JMHO wrote:
Twenty-nine attempts by female officers on the course, with none passing.

Two female Marine officers who volunteered to attempt the Corps’ challenging Infantry Officer Course did not proceed beyond the first day of the course, a Marine Corps spokesperson confirms to the Free Beacon. The two were the only female officers attempting the course in the current cycle, which began Thursday in Quantico, Virginia.

With the two most recent drops, there have been 29 attempts by female officers to pass the course since women have been allowed to volunteer, with none making it to graduation. (At least one woman has attempted the course more than once.) Only three female officers have made it beyond the initial day of training, a grueling evaluation known as the Combat Endurance Test, or CET. Male officers also regularly fail to pass the CET, and the overall course has a substantial attrition rate for males.

The Marine Corps spokesperson, Captain Maureen Krebs, told the Free Beacon that the two officers, “did not meet the standards required of them on day one in order to continue on with the course.” Fifteen male officers also did not meet the standards. Of the 118 officers who began the course, 101 proceeded to the second day.

The Marine Corps, along with the other services, has been evaluating how to comply with the order to g****r-integrate its combat arms specialties by the end of this year, or apply for special exemptions.

The results of the Marine Corps’ experimentation thus far has revealed a pattern: Female enlisted Marines have been able to graduate from the enlisted School of Infantry’s Infantry Training Battalion in Camp Lejeune, North Carolina, though at a lower rate than male enlisted Marines, while female officers have faced great difficulty in graduating from the course in Quantico.

This situation has led some involved with the policy debate in Washington, D.C., to suggest that the standards at the officer’s course in Quantico–which are substantially higher than for the enlisted course–are unrealistically challenging, and need to be lowered.

The Marine Corps is in a tough spot. Marines follow orders, and the order is to integrate the g****rs. But the effort to integrate has revealed something that is uncomfortable for proponents of reform: Keeping the traditionally high standards of the Marine infantry will result in a situation where there are a handful of enlisted female Marines in every infantry battalion, and effectively no female infantry officers.

Pressure will become tremendous to reduce those standards–something that the overwhelming majority of Marines, including those women who currently wish to serve in the infantry, believe would be damaging to the service.

BY: Aaron MacLean
b Twenty-nine attempts by female officers on the ... (show quote)


Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to join the Army. Nannying up the qualifications isn't the answer, unless the powers that be are comfortable with a Corp being lead from the rear. We don't need officers who can "keep up" with their Marines, we need officers who's Marines have to keep up with THEM.

There are, undoubtedly, females who CAN pass the course and perhaps makes good infantry officers, they just need to be recruited. Mere strength is not the primary requirement for a good officer, it is merely an asset and it has been proven that women CAN carry a full grown man to safety. There are plenty of female firefighters now, who are the living proof. Perhaps that's where they need to recruit from, instead of college.

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Jan 9, 2015 19:12:16   #
Loki Loc: Georgia
 
lpnmajor wrote:
Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to join the Army. Nannying up the qualifications isn't the answer, unless the powers that be are comfortable with a Corp being lead from the rear. We don't need officers who can "keep up" with their Marines, we need officers who's Marines have to keep up with THEM.

There are, undoubtedly, females who CAN pass the course and perhaps makes good infantry officers, they just need to be recruited. Mere strength is not the primary requirement for a good officer, it is merely an asset and it has been proven that women CAN carry a full grown man to safety. There are plenty of female firefighters now, who are the living proof. Perhaps that's where they need to recruit from, instead of college.
Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to jo... (show quote)


I remember a llittle 17 mile hike we took. Every man in the company made the march carrying full gear. By this I mean a ruck that weighed about 45 or 50 pounds in addition to weapons and web gear.
There were 8 women in the company. Not a single one was able to complete the march, in spite of the fact that they were NOT required to carry rucks. It is more than strength. It requires the endurance to exert that strength over a period of time.

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Jan 9, 2015 20:30:54   #
no propaganda please Loc: moon orbiting the third rock from the sun
 
lpnmajor wrote:
Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to join the Army. Nannying up the qualifications isn't the answer, unless the powers that be are comfortable with a Corp being lead from the rear. We don't need officers who can "keep up" with their Marines, we need officers who's Marines have to keep up with THEM.

There are, undoubtedly, females who CAN pass the course and perhaps makes good infantry officers, they just need to be recruited. Mere strength is not the primary requirement for a good officer, it is merely an asset and it has been proven that women CAN carry a full grown man to safety. There are plenty of female firefighters now, who are the living proof. Perhaps that's where they need to recruit from, instead of college.
Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to jo... (show quote)


:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Reply
Jan 10, 2015 10:47:39   #
Pulfnick Loc: Knoxville, TN
 
lpnmajor wrote:
Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to join the Army. Nannying up the qualifications isn't the answer, unless the powers that be are comfortable with a Corp being lead from the rear. We don't need officers who can "keep up" with their Marines, we need officers who's Marines have to keep up with THEM.

There are, undoubtedly, females who CAN pass the course and perhaps makes good infantry officers, they just need to be recruited. Mere strength is not the primary requirement for a good officer, it is merely an asset and it has been proven that women CAN carry a full grown man to safety. There are plenty of female firefighters now, who are the living proof. Perhaps that's where they need to recruit from, instead of college.
Those fail the Marine OIC, should be invited to jo... (show quote)


I hope you are just joking and aren't so ignorant to think the Army is even a little bit less difficult than the Marines! (But I admit the Marines do have prettier uniforms so they can be the Palace Guards)

Infantry, whether in the Marines or Army, has no place for women period. Infantry is where the rubber meets the road in actual physical combat. Unlike what you see in goofy Hollywood movies, actual infantry combat requires extended brute strength and endurance. I've personally been there and done that.

Lives do really depend on being able to perform, on pulling your own weight plus that of heavy loads under circumstances more adverse than you can possibly imagine. Believe it or not, women are in fact different from men! Even Time magazine reported that amazing fact some years ago.

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