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Interesting Clarity On The Baldwin Case As Criminal Charges Are Not Ruled Out
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Oct 26, 2021 19:27:53   #
woodguru
 
I caught this headline that criminal charges are not being ruled out, but they absolutely will not have anything to do with Alec Baldwin...

At first I was wondering why he was even pointing a gun at the cinematographer...it turns out that this what exactly what he was practicing. He was supposed to be drawing the gun and shooting it directly at the camera.

There was a person who was in charge of handling guns, loading them with blanks or the fake bullets that look like bullets but have no powder charge, they are dead fakes so that the bullet can be seen in the chamber as a gun is pointed at the camera.

This assistant director has a history of negligence and was fired from a recent movie set.

Look there for criminal charges, because it was the responsibility of the person who announced that the set had a cold gun, meaning no blanks or anything.

https://www.rawstory.com/alec-baldwin-rust-shooting/?utm_source=push_notifications

Reply
Oct 26, 2021 19:46:15   #
Gatsby
 
woodguru wrote:
I caught this headline that criminal charges are not being ruled out, but they absolutely will not have anything to do with Alec Baldwin...

At first I was wondering why he was even pointing a gun at the cinematographer...it turns out that this what exactly what he was practicing. He was supposed to be drawing the gun and shooting it directly at the camera.

There was a person who was in charge of handling guns, loading them with blanks or the fake bullets that look like bullets but have no powder charge, they are dead fakes so that the bullet can be seen in the chamber as a gun is pointed at the camera.

This assistant director has a history of negligence and was fired from a recent movie set.

Look there for criminal charges, because it was the responsibility of the person who announced that the set had a cold gun, meaning no blanks or anything.

https://www.rawstory.com/alec-baldwin-rust-shooting/?utm_source=push_notifications
I caught this headline that criminal charges are n... (show quote)


In the end, only the gun will be indicted.

Reply
Oct 26, 2021 19:47:14   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
woodguru wrote:
I caught this headline that criminal charges are not being ruled out, but they absolutely will not have anything to do with Alec Baldwin...

At first I was wondering why he was even pointing a gun at the cinematographer...it turns out that this what exactly what he was practicing. He was supposed to be drawing the gun and shooting it directly at the camera.

There was a person who was in charge of handling guns, loading them with blanks or the fake bullets that look like bullets but have no powder charge, they are dead fakes so that the bullet can be seen in the chamber as a gun is pointed at the camera.

This assistant director has a history of negligence and was fired from a recent movie set.

Look there for criminal charges, because it was the responsibility of the person who announced that the set had a cold gun, meaning no blanks or anything.

https://www.rawstory.com/alec-baldwin-rust-shooting/?utm_source=push_notifications
I caught this headline that criminal charges are n... (show quote)


It looks like the assistant director, David Halls, may be the culprit.


Crew members describe unsafe conditions on previous set before "Rust' assistant director was fired

From CNN’s Julia Vargas Jones

Three crew members who worked alongside “Rust” assistant director David Halls on another movie where a gun “unexpectedly discharged” in 2019 detailed to CNN what they called unsafe conditions before Halls was fired from the project.

The three crew members recalled details of an incident during the filming of “Freedom’s Path” where an 1800’s-style muzzle-loading rifle unexpectedly fired during a scene, resulting in a boom operator suffering inner ear injuries due to the sound of the explosion.

The crew members, who did not wish to be identified for fear of industry reprisal, said they were concerned for the safety of crew and cast members on set even before the gun misfire.

All three said the production did not hold regular safety meetings, contrary to typical industry practice.

“He was a person with enough red flags that his career should have been done with already. Yet he was still out there, putting crew into outrageous situations. It’s tough to think that Halyna could have just as well been one of our crews,” one of them said. “It was just too close for comfort.”

Rocket Soul said in a statement it “cannot comment on any conversations that may or may not have taken place individually between Dave Halls and crew members.” CNN has asked the company about the crew members' statements regarding regular safety meetings.

Halls, as well as Rockhill Studios, another production company for “Freedom’s Path,” did not respond to CNN requests for comment.

According to the three crew members, an armorer was not on set at the time of the 2019 incident, a break from protocol; instead, a background actor in the production was put in charge of handling the firearm for the scene, the crew members said.

In a statement to CNN, Rocket Soul Studios denied that a background actor was hired as an armorer, saying that an armorer was to be on set in every instance a gun was present.

The company said Halls was removed from the set and fired from the production.

“Halls was removed from set immediately after the prop gun discharged. Production did not resume filming until Dave was off site. An incident report was taken and filed at that time,” it said.


“Upon wrapping production for the day, Dave Halls was officially terminated and given the specific reasons for his termination,” The company continued. “Dave was very remorseful for the events, and understood the reasons he was being terminated. A new assistant director as well as a new armorer were hired for the duration of principal photography.”

In the moments before the accidental discharge, one crew member said the gun was announced as a “no fire” or “cold weapon” for the scene. A second crew member said they asked multiple times if the gun was cleared for use in the shot, and did not receive a clear answer.

The two crew members said some rifles used in the making of the movie had been packed with gunpowder but did not contain projectiles. The rifle that misfired was not supposed to be loaded at all, the two crew members said.

The accidental discharge disoriented a boom microphone operator, who suffered injuries to their inner ear and required medical attention after experiencing hearing loss and balance issues, according to the crew members.


When reached by phone Sunday, the boom operator acknowledged the incident but did not comment further on the matter.

The film, “Freedom’s Path” is set to release in 2022, according to the Rocket Soul website.

Reply
 
 
Oct 26, 2021 19:55:36   #
son of witless
 
woodguru wrote:
I caught this headline that criminal charges are not being ruled out, but they absolutely will not have anything to do with Alec Baldwin...

At first I was wondering why he was even pointing a gun at the cinematographer...it turns out that this what exactly what he was practicing. He was supposed to be drawing the gun and shooting it directly at the camera.

There was a person who was in charge of handling guns, loading them with blanks or the fake bullets that look like bullets but have no powder charge, they are dead fakes so that the bullet can be seen in the chamber as a gun is pointed at the camera.

This assistant director has a history of negligence and was fired from a recent movie set.

Look there for criminal charges, because it was the responsibility of the person who announced that the set had a cold gun, meaning no blanks or anything.

https://www.rawstory.com/alec-baldwin-rust-shooting/?utm_source=push_notifications
I caught this headline that criminal charges are n... (show quote)


Isn't this similar to whoever is your stunt coordinator ? Their job is ensuring the safety of everyone on the set. Speaking of ensuring and insuring, wouldn't the insurance company, insuring this movie production, have requirements or standards that have to be met ?

I think a safety audit likely will be done to see if there were violations of the law.

Reply
Oct 26, 2021 21:03:42   #
woodguru
 
Gatsby wrote:
In the end, only the gun will be indicted.


My guess is the assistant director that supposedly cleared the gun has some sleepless nights ahead

Reply
Oct 26, 2021 21:06:02   #
woodguru
 
son of witless wrote:
Isn't this similar to whoever is your stunt coordinator ? Their job is ensuring the safety of everyone on the set. Speaking of ensuring and insuring, wouldn't the insurance company, insuring this movie production, have requirements or standards that have to be met ?

I think a safety audit likely will be done to see if there were violations of the law.


This apparently was a low budget effort with sub standard management...several people had quit hours earlier citing safety concerns.

Reply
Oct 26, 2021 23:04:49   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
son of witless wrote:
Isn't this similar to whoever is your stunt coordinator ? Their job is ensuring the safety of everyone on the set. Speaking of ensuring and insuring, wouldn't the insurance company, insuring this movie production, have requirements or standards that have to be met ?

I think a safety audit likely will be done to see if there were violations of the law.
The assistant director is responsible for safety on the set. A stunt coordinator is involved only when an action requires a stunt expert, not an actor.

The armorer (weapons master) is responsible for the condition and safe status of all guns used in a scene. The assistant director is next, he is the safety net between the armorer and the actor.

Hanna Gutierrez, the armorer, put three guns on a cart. Obviously, she did not check them thoroughly. She is inexperienced and was quite nervous about her responsibilities.

The scene was a rehearsal in which the guns were not supposed be loaded even with blanks.

When Baldwin was given the pistol (a "Cold Gun"), he was to rehearse a cross draw while sitting on a church bench and aim toward the camera for a fake shot.

When David Halls picked it up the pistol, he did not check to insure the pistol was not loaded. This was not just a brain fart, it follows a pattern of his past performances as an assistant director.

Whether the pistol was a prop gun or a real gun is irrelevant, it wasn't supposed to be loaded with any ammo.

Somebody really fkd up, and it wasn't Alec Baldwin.

Regarding safety standards on movie sets, they have set the bar quite high. Firearms instructors are hired to train actors in need of training, and the use of any type of weapon capable of injuring or killing is subject to to all kinds of scrutiny and safety regimens, not to mention choreographing and rehearsing a scene in which weapons are used.

About a month ago, at the library, I came across Charlton Heston's autobiography, In the Arena
It is a wonderful and quite educational story of an actor's life, one whom we all know had considerable experience with guns, both on and off screen.

Heston's discussion of the chariot race in Ben Hur, is truly fascinating.

Reply
 
 
Oct 27, 2021 01:35:33   #
Milosia2 Loc: Cleveland Ohio
 
Blade_Runner wrote:
The assistant director is responsible for safety on the set. A stunt coordinator is involved only when an action requires a stunt expert, not an actor.

The armorer (weapons master) is responsible for the condition and safe status of all guns used in a scene. The assistant director is next, he is the safety net between the armorer and the actor.

Hanna Gutierrez, the armorer, put three guns on a cart. Obviously, she did not check them thoroughly. She is inexperienced and was quite nervous about her responsibilities.

The scene was a rehearsal in which the guns were not supposed be loaded even with blanks.

When Baldwin was given the pistol (a "Cold Gun"), he was to rehearse a cross draw while sitting on a church bench and aim toward the camera for a fake shot.

When David Halls picked it up the pistol, he did not check to insure the pistol was not loaded. This was not just a brain fart, it follows a pattern of his past performances as an assistant director.

Whether the pistol was a prop gun or a real gun is irrelevant, it wasn't supposed to be loaded with any ammo.

Somebody really fkd up, and it wasn't Alec Baldwin.

Regarding safety standards on movie sets, they have set the bar quite high. Firearms instructors are hired to train actors in need of training, and the use of any type of weapon capable of injuring or killing is subject to to all kinds of scrutiny and safety regimens, not to mention choreographing and rehearsing a scene in which weapons are used.

About a month ago, at the library, I came across Charlton Heston's autobiography, In the Arena
It is a wonderful and quite educational story of an actor's life, one whom we all know had considerable experience with guns, both on and off screen.

Heston's discussion of the chariot race in Ben Hur, is truly fascinating.
The assistant director is responsible for safety o... (show quote)


I heard they found be gun in a nearby pond
Tied to a rock.
I guess to make sure it would …sink.

Reply
Oct 27, 2021 02:06:00   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
Milosia2 wrote:
I heard they found be gun in a nearby pond
Tied to a rock.
I guess to make sure it would …sink.
Do you believe everything you hear?

Reply
Oct 27, 2021 08:21:45   #
Ronald Hatt Loc: Lansing, Mich
 
woodguru wrote:
I caught this headline that criminal charges are not being ruled out, but they absolutely will not have anything to do with Alec Baldwin...

At first I was wondering why he was even pointing a gun at the cinematographer...it turns out that this what exactly what he was practicing. He was supposed to be drawing the gun and shooting it directly at the camera.

There was a person who was in charge of handling guns, loading them with blanks or the fake bullets that look like bullets but have no powder charge, they are dead fakes so that the bullet can be seen in the chamber as a gun is pointed at the camera.

This assistant director has a history of negligence and was fired from a recent movie set.

Look there for criminal charges, because it was the responsibility of the person who announced that the set had a cold gun, meaning no blanks or anything.

https://www.rawstory.com/alec-baldwin-rust-shooting/?utm_source=push_notifications
I caught this headline that criminal charges are n... (show quote)


I wonder how long it will be...before Baldwin, returns to SNL...to rag on the Conservatives, & Trump? { Perhaps he will have his "hands full" trying to defend his "Hollyweed mentality" of *narcissism, & * self-appointed aggrandisement?}....

Reply
Oct 27, 2021 14:49:41   #
son of witless
 
woodguru wrote:
This apparently was a low budget effort with sub standard management...several people had quit hours earlier citing safety concerns.


If they were doing car crash stunts or pyrotechnics they would likely be required to have coordinators with credentials. Either legally or from their insurance carrier. A gun has the same destructive potential as a car or pyro device. As you pointed out, low budget can be a problem. Safety first.

Reply
 
 
Oct 27, 2021 14:54:47   #
Blade_Runner Loc: DARK SIDE OF THE MOON
 
Ronald Hatt wrote:
I wonder how long it will be...before Baldwin, returns to SNL...to rag on the Conservatives, & Trump? { Perhaps he will have his "hands full" trying to defend his "Hollyweed mentality" of *narcissism, & * self-appointed aggrandisement?}....
I wonder how long it will be...before Baldwin, ret... (show quote)
I don't think Alec Baldwin will be doing any skits on SNL any time soon. In fact, this may be the end of his career.

This is not the first time an accident occurred on a movie set. Over the past 30 years, there have been 194 documented movie set accidents resulting in 43 deaths, including two actors who were killed with prop guns.

Reply
Oct 27, 2021 16:35:56   #
woodguru
 
Blade_Runner wrote:

Somebody really fkd up, and it wasn't Alec Baldwin.

That's my take on it, they set the guns up so that a single bullet goes bang and the rest of a cylinder is loaded with dud bullets that look right from the front facing camera angle...it is not the actor's job to check the gun.

Here's new information on thinking it was a real bullet, not a blank.
https://www.rawstory.com/investigators-suspect-it-was-a-metal-bullet-not-a-blank-that-killed-cinematographer-halyna-hutchins/?utm_source=push_notifications

Reply
Oct 27, 2021 17:23:15   #
EmilyD
 
woodguru wrote:
That's my take on it, they set the guns up so that a single bullet goes bang and the rest of a cylinder is loaded with dud bullets that look right from the front facing camera angle...it is not the actor's job to check the gun.

Here's new information on thinking it was a real bullet, not a blank.
https://www.rawstory.com/investigators-suspect-it-was-a-metal-bullet-not-a-blank-that-killed-cinematographer-halyna-hutchins/?utm_source=push_notifications


It IS the actor's job to check the gun. It is the responsibility and the obligation of the person who is holding the gun in their own hands, no matter WHO they are, to check it. No one, is exempt from gun safety rules because they are famous or loved...even clueless actors who don't think it's their "job". Even though some people want to believe it, guns do NOT fire themselves...it takes a human finger to pull the trigger!

If someone walked up to you and handed you a gun and said it was not loaded, it is still YOUR responsibility for not pointing it at anyone. It is YOUR responsibility to make sure it is not loaded. That is why Baldwin is (and should be) investigated for involuntary manslaughter (accidentally shooting and killing someone), which is a felony in New Mexico where the incident occurred.

Reply
Oct 27, 2021 21:09:42   #
woodguru
 
EmilyD wrote:
It IS the actor's job to check the gun. It is the responsibility and the obligation of the person who is holding the gun in their own hands, no matter WHO they are, to check it.

I've subscribed to that all my life...but in this case there is a lot more to gun safety on a movie set than it being the actor's job.

They are using different loads and combinations, they might need one blank round that goes boom, and five dummy loads that look like the real thing but are completely dead. This is so that from the direct camera angle the gun looks like it has real bullets that you can see the ends of from the front.

I was reading up on the protocols involved, and they do not want an actor trying to "check" the loads and messing up the sequence they carefully set up. An actor has no way to check for blanks, dummies, or real bullets.

The gun gets checked and handled by those who's responsibility it is to do that, and when the person checking and setting up the gun yells cold gun, or hot gun, the actors have to trust that they know what they are doing.

Cold gun was the call to the set as Baldwin practiced exactly what he was supposed to do.

There are a lot of armchair warriors bringing their lack of knowledge to the judgement table here. I was ready to think Baldwin had a part, but when I saw that he was supposed to be practicing a quick draw and shooting right at the camera, he had experts who were supposed to know what a cold gun is.

They can try to get him for this, but there was real responsibility here, like who the hell brought a live round to the set?

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