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How do military Veterans feel when they return home from combat?
Nov 6, 2019 15:45:41   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom, Sergeant in the United States Marine Corp

It is an experience that is incredibly difficult to understand and describe.

I will try to describe the emotional/psychological process that I and many other fellow Marines (soldiers, sailors, etc.) experienced.

Before you understand what a returning Marine/soldier/sailor/etc. experiences when they come home, you have to know what they really go through when they are over there.

What we all experience, combat or none, is a very, very long period of extended absence from comfort, security, our families, and breaks. The Marines spend seven months on deployment. Army is about twice that, but they don't go as often. That means months where you deal with the same people day, after day, after day. There is no change and no break. You work with them, you eat with them, and you live with them. If you can't stand them, oh well. If your boss is a jerk or psycho, there isn't even the escape of going home at the end of the day or having a weekend. Now you need to consider the war side of things.

In the best case scenario, you are under the constant threat of surprise attack. Car bombs, roadside bombs, suicide bombers, mortars. Looking at people everywhere who you can see absolutely h**e you. In the worst case scenario, you actually fight. You might k**l people. You might lose friends. But I won't get into what it's like for those cases, they are pretty tough to nail down and can vary wildly. But wh**ever picture I drew, don't think about how it sucks for a few short periods of intense violence; imagine it sucking for months and months of a slow drone and a psychological beating.

And then you come home. Everything is fine now right? Not really …

First, we are absolutely elated to come home, see our families, go to our bars, women... This is a high that can't really be expressed very accurately. In a way, you are doing things that you have done many times before, but it has been so long that it feels completely foreign to you. When you see your wife, she is unfamiliar to you. When you first see her, you get the smell of her hair and her embrace, but there are subtle differences that make you feel as if things are different somehow. Her hair has changed or she has new interests. It kind of feels like a first date for a few weeks as you try to remember how you fit together again ... figuratively speaking. This "second first date" is the same with all the things you do, h*****g out with your old friends, going to favorite hangouts. But don't get me wrong. Even if we are quiet about it and act like it is no big deal, these are some of the happiest days we have ever had.

Second, there is residual stress that carries over from a combat deployment. While on deployment, military people deal with each other in ways that are not normal in civilian America. We are harsh with each other and don't often act with kindness and gentleness with one another. Add this to natural combat stress, the constant concern that you may get attacked, the wondering if a vehicle near you is going to blow up, always seeing in the eye of every local that they want to k**l you. You are suspicious, tightly wound, and easily angered. I remember several times waking up in my bed even a few months after deployment and panicking because I couldn't find my weapon. You also don't mesh well with your families. They do things you don't understand. They do things you don't understand, mostly because they have grown very independent of you. Many confuse this for a feeling that you are unwanted or unneeded, and this makes the returning person very irritable. Combine all these, and you have an explanation as to why so many men returning from 'over there' come back angry and beat their wives. It is difficult to t***sition between two worlds and some, especially those who experience combat, don't cope well. It isn't right, but it happens.

Third, there is a long phase where you try to adjust to having your life back. To be honest, it is never the same as before you left. You are changed by the experience of a combat deployment, even after the first. Every time you go, you change. And so does everyone else that you care about. Everyone matures naturally, but independent of each other, and you have to reintegrate into each other's lives again. Young Marines often have a hard time keeping control; husbands fight with wives, and fathers can't communicate with kids (and don't be naive, this is different from those people who think it is the same as having teenagers). It takes time before everything settles down emotionally. Most people make it through this phase OK, but unfortunately, many don't.

These are the parts of coming home most people don't really talk about.

Reply
Nov 6, 2019 16:42:23   #
Lt. Rob Polans ret.
 
slatten49 wrote:
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom, Sergeant in the United States Marine Corp

It is an experience that is incredibly difficult to understand and describe.

I will try to describe the emotional/psychological process that I and many other fellow Marines (soldiers, sailors, etc.) experienced.

Before you understand what a returning Marine/soldier/sailor/etc. experiences when they come home, you have to know what they really go through when they are over there.

What we all experience, combat or none, is a very, very long period of extended absence from comfort, security, our families, and breaks. The Marines spend seven months on deployment. Army is about twice that, but they don't go as often. That means months where you deal with the same people day, after day, after day. There is no change and no break. You work with them, you eat with them, and you live with them. If you can't stand them, oh well. If your boss is a jerk or psycho, there isn't even the escape of going home at the end of the day or having a weekend. Now you need to consider the war side of things.

In the best case scenario, you are under the constant threat of surprise attack. Car bombs, roadside bombs, suicide bombers, mortars. Looking at people everywhere who you can see absolutely h**e you. In the worst case scenario, you actually fight. You might k**l people. You might lose friends. But I won't get into what it's like for those cases, they are pretty tough to nail down and can vary wildly. But wh**ever picture I drew, don't think about how it sucks for a few short periods of intense violence; imagine it sucking for months and months of a slow drone and a psychological beating.

And then you come home. Everything is fine now right? Not really …

First, we are absolutely elated to come home, see our families, go to our bars, women... This is a high that can't really be expressed very accurately. In a way, you are doing things that you have done many times before, but it has been so long that it feels completely foreign to you. When you see your wife, she is unfamiliar to you. When you first see her, you get the smell of her hair and her embrace, but there are subtle differences that make you feel as if things are different somehow. Her hair has changed or she has new interests. It kind of feels like a first date for a few weeks as you try to remember how you fit together again ... figuratively speaking. This "second first date" is the same with all the things you do, h*****g out with your old friends, going to favorite hangouts. But don't get me wrong. Even if we are quiet about it and act like it is no big deal, these are some of the happiest days we have ever had.

Second, there is residual stress that carries over from a combat deployment. While on deployment, military people deal with each other in ways that are not normal in civilian America. We are harsh with each other and don't often act with kindness and gentleness with one another. Add this to natural combat stress, the constant concern that you may get attacked, the wondering if a vehicle near you is going to blow up, always seeing in the eye of every local that they want to k**l you. You are suspicious, tightly wound, and easily angered. I remember several times waking up in my bed even a few months after deployment and panicking because I couldn't find my weapon. You also don't mesh well with your families. They do things you don't understand. They do things you don't understand, mostly because they have grown very independent of you. Many confuse this for a feeling that you are unwanted or unneeded, and this makes the returning person very irritable. Combine all these, and you have an explanation as to why so many men returning from 'over there' come back angry and beat their wives. It is difficult to t***sition between two worlds and some, especially those who experience combat, don't cope well. It isn't right, but it happens.

Third, there is a long phase where you try to adjust to having your life back. To be honest, it is never the same as before you left. You are changed by the experience of a combat deployment, even after the first. Every time you go, you change. And so does everyone else that you care about. Everyone matures naturally, but independent of each other, and you have to reintegrate into each other's lives again. Young Marines often have a hard time keeping control; husbands fight with wives, and fathers can't communicate with kids (and don't be naive, this is different from those people who think it is the same as having teenagers). It takes time before everything settles down emotionally. Most people make it through this phase OK, but unfortunately, many don't.

These are the parts of coming home most people don't really talk about.
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Fr... (show quote)


Wow, he nailed it pretty well...

Reply
Nov 6, 2019 16:46:09   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
Lt. Rob Polans ret. wrote:
Wow, he nailed it pretty well...

“For soldiers serving in Afghanistan and Iraq, coming home is more lethal than being in combat. From the invasion of Afghanistan to the summer of 2009, the US military lost 761 soldiers in combat in that country. Compare that to the 817 who took their own lives over the same period, and this number does account for deaths related to violence, high-risk behaviors, and addiction." --- research professor Brene' Brown

Reply
 
 
Nov 6, 2019 17:03:26   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
Lt. Rob Polans ret. wrote:
Wow, he nailed it pretty well...


Yes, Lt. Rob, he did.

Reply
Nov 6, 2019 20:48:00   #
lpnmajor Loc: Arkansas
 
slatten49 wrote:
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom, Sergeant in the United States Marine Corp

It is an experience that is incredibly difficult to understand and describe.

I will try to describe the emotional/psychological process that I and many other fellow Marines (soldiers, sailors, etc.) experienced.

Before you understand what a returning Marine/soldier/sailor/etc. experiences when they come home, you have to know what they really go through when they are over there.

What we all experience, combat or none, is a very, very long period of extended absence from comfort, security, our families, and breaks. The Marines spend seven months on deployment. Army is about twice that, but they don't go as often. That means months where you deal with the same people day, after day, after day. There is no change and no break. You work with them, you eat with them, and you live with them. If you can't stand them, oh well. If your boss is a jerk or psycho, there isn't even the escape of going home at the end of the day or having a weekend. Now you need to consider the war side of things.

In the best case scenario, you are under the constant threat of surprise attack. Car bombs, roadside bombs, suicide bombers, mortars. Looking at people everywhere who you can see absolutely h**e you. In the worst case scenario, you actually fight. You might k**l people. You might lose friends. But I won't get into what it's like for those cases, they are pretty tough to nail down and can vary wildly. But wh**ever picture I drew, don't think about how it sucks for a few short periods of intense violence; imagine it sucking for months and months of a slow drone and a psychological beating.

And then you come home. Everything is fine now right? Not really …

First, we are absolutely elated to come home, see our families, go to our bars, women... This is a high that can't really be expressed very accurately. In a way, you are doing things that you have done many times before, but it has been so long that it feels completely foreign to you. When you see your wife, she is unfamiliar to you. When you first see her, you get the smell of her hair and her embrace, but there are subtle differences that make you feel as if things are different somehow. Her hair has changed or she has new interests. It kind of feels like a first date for a few weeks as you try to remember how you fit together again ... figuratively speaking. This "second first date" is the same with all the things you do, h*****g out with your old friends, going to favorite hangouts. But don't get me wrong. Even if we are quiet about it and act like it is no big deal, these are some of the happiest days we have ever had.

Second, there is residual stress that carries over from a combat deployment. While on deployment, military people deal with each other in ways that are not normal in civilian America. We are harsh with each other and don't often act with kindness and gentleness with one another. Add this to natural combat stress, the constant concern that you may get attacked, the wondering if a vehicle near you is going to blow up, always seeing in the eye of every local that they want to k**l you. You are suspicious, tightly wound, and easily angered. I remember several times waking up in my bed even a few months after deployment and panicking because I couldn't find my weapon. You also don't mesh well with your families. They do things you don't understand. They do things you don't understand, mostly because they have grown very independent of you. Many confuse this for a feeling that you are unwanted or unneeded, and this makes the returning person very irritable. Combine all these, and you have an explanation as to why so many men returning from 'over there' come back angry and beat their wives. It is difficult to t***sition between two worlds and some, especially those who experience combat, don't cope well. It isn't right, but it happens.

Third, there is a long phase where you try to adjust to having your life back. To be honest, it is never the same as before you left. You are changed by the experience of a combat deployment, even after the first. Every time you go, you change. And so does everyone else that you care about. Everyone matures naturally, but independent of each other, and you have to reintegrate into each other's lives again. Young Marines often have a hard time keeping control; husbands fight with wives, and fathers can't communicate with kids (and don't be naive, this is different from those people who think it is the same as having teenagers). It takes time before everything settles down emotionally. Most people make it through this phase OK, but unfortunately, many don't.

These are the parts of coming home most people don't really talk about.
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Fr... (show quote)


It is scientific fact that combat, as well as the daily stress of not knowing when the next firefight will happen, causes measurable changes in the brain and the endocrine ( hormone ) system, and that a return to "normal" takes a long time................if it happens at all. The same physiological changes have been measured in first responder's who have never seen combat.

This information has been available for years, decades even, yet few actions have ever been taken to ameliorate the symptoms and help those who suffer. I would challenge anyone's claim of "I'm fine", who has served in theater during war, as I've yet to meet anyone for whom that claim was valid. PTSD has gotten a lot of attention lately, but that is not the extent of post combat stress.

I have advocated for years to have a 6 month post deployment period, still in uniform and still being paid, to decompress in a safe environment, during which the members emotional state can be evaluated. The Service members won't just be sitting on their ass waiting for the 6 months to go by, they'll be learning civilian life sk**ls, job training, learning safe coping sk**ls, and wh**ever else they need to be successful when they muster out.

Reply
Nov 6, 2019 20:50:29   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
lpnmajor wrote:
It is scientific fact that combat, as well as the daily stress of not knowing when the next firefight will happen, causes measurable changes in the brain and the endocrine ( hormone ) system, and that a return to "normal" takes a long time................if it happens at all. The same physiological changes have been measured in first responder's who have never seen combat.

This information has been available for years, decades even, yet few actions have ever been taken to ameliorate the symptoms and help those who suffer. I would challenge anyone's claim of "I'm fine", who has served in theater during war, as I've yet to meet anyone for whom that claim was valid. PTSD has gotten a lot of attention lately, but that is not the extent of post combat stress.

I have advocated for years to have a 6 month post deployment period, still in uniform and still being paid, to decompress in a safe environment, during which the members emotional state can be evaluated. The Service members won't just be sitting on their ass waiting for the 6 months to go by, they'll be learning civilian life sk**ls, job training, learning safe coping sk**ls, and wh**ever else they need to be successful when they muster out.
It is scientific fact that combat, as well as the ... (show quote)

I vividly remember your previously advocating that type of program.

Reply
Nov 6, 2019 21:16:33   #
PLT Sarge Loc: Alabama
 
slatten49 wrote:
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom, Sergeant in the United States Marine Corp

It is an experience that is incredibly difficult to understand and describe.

I will try to describe the emotional/psychological process that I and many other fellow Marines (soldiers, sailors, etc.) experienced.

Before you understand what a returning Marine/soldier/sailor/etc. experiences when they come home, you have to know what they really go through when they are over there.

What we all experience, combat or none, is a very, very long period of extended absence from comfort, security, our families, and breaks. The Marines spend seven months on deployment. Army is about twice that, but they don't go as often. That means months where you deal with the same people day, after day, after day. There is no change and no break. You work with them, you eat with them, and you live with them. If you can't stand them, oh well. If your boss is a jerk or psycho, there isn't even the escape of going home at the end of the day or having a weekend. Now you need to consider the war side of things.

In the best case scenario, you are under the constant threat of surprise attack. Car bombs, roadside bombs, suicide bombers, mortars. Looking at people everywhere who you can see absolutely h**e you. In the worst case scenario, you actually fight. You might k**l people. You might lose friends. But I won't get into what it's like for those cases, they are pretty tough to nail down and can vary wildly. But wh**ever picture I drew, don't think about how it sucks for a few short periods of intense violence; imagine it sucking for months and months of a slow drone and a psychological beating.

And then you come home. Everything is fine now right? Not really …

First, we are absolutely elated to come home, see our families, go to our bars, women... This is a high that can't really be expressed very accurately. In a way, you are doing things that you have done many times before, but it has been so long that it feels completely foreign to you. When you see your wife, she is unfamiliar to you. When you first see her, you get the smell of her hair and her embrace, but there are subtle differences that make you feel as if things are different somehow. Her hair has changed or she has new interests. It kind of feels like a first date for a few weeks as you try to remember how you fit together again ... figuratively speaking. This "second first date" is the same with all the things you do, h*****g out with your old friends, going to favorite hangouts. But don't get me wrong. Even if we are quiet about it and act like it is no big deal, these are some of the happiest days we have ever had.

Second, there is residual stress that carries over from a combat deployment. While on deployment, military people deal with each other in ways that are not normal in civilian America. We are harsh with each other and don't often act with kindness and gentleness with one another. Add this to natural combat stress, the constant concern that you may get attacked, the wondering if a vehicle near you is going to blow up, always seeing in the eye of every local that they want to k**l you. You are suspicious, tightly wound, and easily angered. I remember several times waking up in my bed even a few months after deployment and panicking because I couldn't find my weapon. You also don't mesh well with your families. They do things you don't understand. They do things you don't understand, mostly because they have grown very independent of you. Many confuse this for a feeling that you are unwanted or unneeded, and this makes the returning person very irritable. Combine all these, and you have an explanation as to why so many men returning from 'over there' come back angry and beat their wives. It is difficult to t***sition between two worlds and some, especially those who experience combat, don't cope well. It isn't right, but it happens.

Third, there is a long phase where you try to adjust to having your life back. To be honest, it is never the same as before you left. You are changed by the experience of a combat deployment, even after the first. Every time you go, you change. And so does everyone else that you care about. Everyone matures naturally, but independent of each other, and you have to reintegrate into each other's lives again. Young Marines often have a hard time keeping control; husbands fight with wives, and fathers can't communicate with kids (and don't be naive, this is different from those people who think it is the same as having teenagers). It takes time before everything settles down emotionally. Most people make it through this phase OK, but unfortunately, many don't.

These are the parts of coming home most people don't really talk about.
Jonathan Kirk Davis, Veteran of Operation Iraqi Fr... (show quote)


I agree 100%. The only thing that I could add is the sorrow of seeing this great nation being destroyed. Coming home to a changed America.

Reply
 
 
Nov 7, 2019 14:26:45   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
PLT Sarge wrote:
I agree 100%. The only thing that I could add is the sorrow of seeing this great nation being destroyed. Coming home to a changed America.

Thank you, Sarge. I recall your response to this the first time I posted it. I see it as something that needs to be posted at least annually, perhaps especially on Veteran's Day.

Once again, I salute your many years of service to our nation while in the Army & National Guard.

Reply
Nov 7, 2019 18:50:19   #
Lt. Rob Polans ret.
 
slatten49 wrote:
Yes, Lt. Rob, he did.


The things he didn't say, they are kind of depressing. Some men have their bodies make it back to America, but their minds or hearts, souls still in rice paddies or deserts. Depending on where they served. I have one weird PTSD symptom from in country, when I hear sounds that really shouldn't be there I'll reach for my weapon, but my wife is a bit too smart and leaves it unloaded. I often hear a couple having a conversation in my office. Can't make it out exactly, for all I know it's the neighbors playing slap n' tickle. Then a newer one, but this is real. How do I know? 3 years ago it was me. Some neighbor blasts his music. We have similar taste, so it's okay. Or another thing left out a few became really attached to their k9 partners. You've probably seen the cartoons "If daddy isn't out in 2 minutes I'm going in." Or the dog may stop and point at what he perceives as a bomb, but back in the US?

Reply
Nov 7, 2019 19:08:52   #
slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas
 
Lt. Rob Polans ret. wrote:
The things he didn't say, they are kind of depressing. Some men have their bodies make it back to America, but their minds or hearts, souls still in rice paddies or deserts. Depending on where they served. I have one weird PTSD symptom from in country, when I hear sounds that really shouldn't be there I'll reach for my weapon, but my wife is a bit too smart and leaves it unloaded. I often hear a couple having a conversation in my office. Can't make it out exactly, for all I know it's the neighbors playing slap n' tickle. Then a newer one, but this is real. How do I know? 3 years ago it was me. Some neighbor blasts his music. We have similar taste, so it's okay. Or another thing left out a few became really attached to their k9 partners. You've probably seen the cartoons "If daddy isn't out in 2 minutes I'm going in." Or the dog may stop and point at what he perceives as a bomb, but back in the US?
The things he didn't say, they are kind of depress... (show quote)

It took me years to free myself from flashbacks...some triggered simply by choppers flying overhead, the smell of diesel fuel, or sudden sounds/noises...etc. I still startle fairly easily and am always look to sit with my back to the wall and facing entrances to places I'm in. Still, I have relaxed and calmed down quite a bit from earlier days.

My biggest difficulty remains coping with personal loss/tragedy and the accompanying grief. Such leads to painful memories and depression.

Reply
Nov 7, 2019 19:18:33   #
Lt. Rob Polans ret.
 
slatten49 wrote:
It took me years to free myself from flashbacks...some triggered simply by choppers flying overhead, the smell of diesel fuel, or sudden sounds/noises...etc. I still startle fairly easily and am always look to sit with my back to the wall and facing entrances to places I'm in. Still, I have relaxed and calmed down quite a bit from earlier days.

My biggest difficulty remains coping with personal loss/tragedy and the accompanying grief. Such leads to painful memories and depression.
It took me years to free myself from flashbacks...... (show quote)


For me it isn't the smell of diesel fuel (actually I like it) it's the sight. Hard to distinguish it from napalm. Yeah, although I'm surrounded by fish tanks and paraphernalia I face the door too.

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