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Jul 1, 2019 15:23:52   #
slatten49 (a regular here)
 
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if the cop asks permission to search your car without warrant? I mean if I have nothing to hide, then why not let the cop search the car?

By Keith Carlton, retired LEO. Supported by Kevin Shomura, 28+ years in Law Enforcement. Retired as a Senior Special Agent and Rick Bruno, Retired street cop

I was a Law Enforcement Officer for over 32 years. I used to think the same way…”Since I don’t have anything to hide, why not let them search.” I also used to think this same way about me asking to search…”If you have nothing to hide, why wouldn’t you let me search?”

About 15 years into my LE career, I attended training about laws and legal rights. The person doing the training was an attorney. She was very pro-police, but also very “you better know your job and you better do it right” kind of person…I respected that.

One of the officers attending the training, during a break, asked her this very question. At first, I was really shocked by her answer…remember, I thought this way at that time.

She told us that she would NEVER allow an officer to search ANYTHING of hers unless they had a warrant.
I think most of us were in shock with this answer. Here she had been telling us this whole time what legal rights we had to search, detain, probable cause…the list goes on, and now she is telling us that she, not having anything to hide, would not allow a consent search…what gives?

She explained it to us this way…

“I don’t have anything to prove to you guys. It is your job to find the probable cause to “get the warrant” so you can do the search, and quite frankly, I don’t have the time to wait around for you to do a search, that you are not entitled to do without a warrant. My time is very valuable and for you to spend 15 minutes of MY time trying to find something that I know isn’t there…well, that is 15 minutes I can never get back. Those lost 15 minutes I could have spent talking to my parents on the phone, or scratching my butt…doesn’t matter how I would have spent those 15 minutes, the fact is that I will never get those 15 minutes back to do what I WANT TO DO!!!” (Yes, those were her words to the class…I was impressed!)

When she finished talking, I sat back in my chair and thought about what she said for the rest of the break…just a few minutes. Damn if she wasn’t right. I never carry anything in my car that is illegal. I know that a search would be pointless for an LEO to do…they would find NOTHING.

Since it would be a waste of their time, that means that it would be an even bigger waste of my time.
My time may not cost very much, but to me it is valuable. I have things I need or want to do. Some things are very important to me…maybe not to others…some things are not very important to me, but I still want to get them done.

Because of what she said in the training, I applied that to my job from that time on.

I would still ask for consent to search because that is part of the job, but if the person declined the search I left it at that. It was their right to decline the search, I respected that right. (I can hear it now…if you respected their right, you wouldn’t have asked in the first place…not true…asking is not disrespecting their right. Forcing, or bullying them into a search is disrespecting their right…and I DID NOT ever do that!!) If they gave consent, I would run them through a card that they would sign that gave them very valuable information…”you do not have to give your consent…you can withdraw your consent at any time…” If they had any questions about giving consent, we would talk about it. Yes, I did have people that changed their mind after giving their consent, and I would stop right where I was at, wrap things up and be on my merry way…no harm…no foul.

Let me tell you, I won more people over by doing that simple thing…protecting their right…than anything else I ever did for people. As far as I was concerned, I was hired to keep the peace, protect people and property, but most of all, protect their rights.

My LE career is over now, but I still find myself protecting people’s rights when I can.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 15:51:39   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
slatten49 wrote:
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if the cop asks permission to search your car without warrant? I mean if I have nothing to hide, then why not let the cop search the car?

By Keith Carlton, retired LEO. Supported by Kevin Shomura, 28+ years in Law Enforcement. Retired as a Senior Special Agent and Rick Bruno, Retired street cop

I was a Law Enforcement Officer for over 32 years. I used to think the same way…”Since I don’t have anything to hide, why not let them search.” I also used to think this same way about me asking to search…”If you have nothing to hide, why wouldn’t you let me search?”

About 15 years into my LE career, I attended training about laws and legal rights. The person doing the training was an attorney. She was very pro-police, but also very “you better know your job and you better do it right” kind of person…I respected that.

One of the officers attending the training, during a break, asked her this very question. At first, I was really shocked by her answer…remember, I thought this way at that time.

She told us that she would NEVER allow an officer to search ANYTHING of hers unless they had a warrant.
I think most of us were in shock with this answer. Here she had been telling us this whole time what legal rights we had to search, detain, probable cause…the list goes on, and now she is telling us that she, not having anything to hide, would not allow a consent search…what gives?

She explained it to us this way…

“I don’t have anything to prove to you guys. It is your job to find the probable cause to “get the warrant” so you can do the search, and quite frankly, I don’t have the time to wait around for you to do a search, that you are not entitled to do without a warrant. My time is very valuable and for you to spend 15 minutes of MY time trying to find something that I know isn’t there…well, that is 15 minutes I can never get back. Those lost 15 minutes I could have spent talking to my parents on the phone, or scratching my butt…doesn’t matter how I would have spent those 15 minutes, the fact is that I will never get those 15 minutes back to do what I WANT TO DO!!!” (Yes, those were her words to the class…I was impressed!)

When she finished talking, I sat back in my chair and thought about what she said for the rest of the break…just a few minutes. Damn if she wasn’t right. I never carry anything in my car that is illegal. I know that a search would be pointless for an LEO to do…they would find NOTHING.

Since it would be a waste of their time, that means that it would be an even bigger waste of my time.
My time may not cost very much, but to me it is valuable. I have things I need or want to do. Some things are very important to me…maybe not to others…some things are not very important to me, but I still want to get them done.

Because of what she said in the training, I applied that to my job from that time on.

I would still ask for consent to search because that is part of the job, but if the person declined the search I left it at that. It was their right to decline the search, I respected that right. (I can hear it now…if you respected their right, you wouldn’t have asked in the first place…not true…asking is not disrespecting their right. Forcing, or bullying them into a search is disrespecting their right…and I DID NOT ever do that!!) If they gave consent, I would run them through a card that they would sign that gave them very valuable information…”you do not have to give your consent…you can withdraw your consent at any time…” If they had any questions about giving consent, we would talk about it. Yes, I did have people that changed their mind after giving their consent, and I would stop right where I was at, wrap things up and be on my merry way…no harm…no foul.

Let me tell you, I won more people over by doing that simple thing…protecting their right…than anything else I ever did for people. As far as I was concerned, I was hired to keep the peace, protect people and property, but most of all, protect their rights.

My LE career is over now, but I still find myself protecting people’s rights when I can.
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if th... (show quote)




There is most likely a canine within 15 minutes of a detained vehicle.

If a person refuses a search, it means nothing to the cop who calls in the dog.

Matter of fact most cops are immediately offended that a person would refuse a search, but that's just in the real world.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 16:45:52   #
badbobby (a regular here)
 
slatten49 wrote:
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if the cop asks permission to search your car without warrant? I mean if I have nothing to hide, then why not let the cop search the car?

By Keith Carlton, retired LEO. Supported by Kevin Shomura, 28+ years in Law Enforcement. Retired as a Senior Special Agent and Rick Bruno, Retired street cop

I was a Law Enforcement Officer for over 32 years. I used to think the same way…”Since I don’t have anything to hide, why not let them search.” I also used to think this same way about me asking to search…”If you have nothing to hide, why wouldn’t you let me search?”

About 15 years into my LE career, I attended training about laws and legal rights. The person doing the training was an attorney. She was very pro-police, but also very “you better know your job and you better do it right” kind of person…I respected that.

One of the officers attending the training, during a break, asked her this very question. At first, I was really shocked by her answer…remember, I thought this way at that time.

She told us that she would NEVER allow an officer to search ANYTHING of hers unless they had a warrant.
I think most of us were in shock with this answer. Here she had been telling us this whole time what legal rights we had to search, detain, probable cause…the list goes on, and now she is telling us that she, not having anything to hide, would not allow a consent search…what gives?

She explained it to us this way…

“I don’t have anything to prove to you guys. It is your job to find the probable cause to “get the warrant” so you can do the search, and quite frankly, I don’t have the time to wait around for you to do a search, that you are not entitled to do without a warrant. My time is very valuable and for you to spend 15 minutes of MY time trying to find something that I know isn’t there…well, that is 15 minutes I can never get back. Those lost 15 minutes I could have spent talking to my parents on the phone, or scratching my butt…doesn’t matter how I would have spent those 15 minutes, the fact is that I will never get those 15 minutes back to do what I WANT TO DO!!!” (Yes, those were her words to the class…I was impressed!)

When she finished talking, I sat back in my chair and thought about what she said for the rest of the break…just a few minutes. Damn if she wasn’t right. I never carry anything in my car that is illegal. I know that a search would be pointless for an LEO to do…they would find NOTHING.

Since it would be a waste of their time, that means that it would be an even bigger waste of my time.
My time may not cost very much, but to me it is valuable. I have things I need or want to do. Some things are very important to me…maybe not to others…some things are not very important to me, but I still want to get them done.

Because of what she said in the training, I applied that to my job from that time on.

I would still ask for consent to search because that is part of the job, but if the person declined the search I left it at that. It was their right to decline the search, I respected that right. (I can hear it now…if you respected their right, you wouldn’t have asked in the first place…not true…asking is not disrespecting their right. Forcing, or bullying them into a search is disrespecting their right…and I DID NOT ever do that!!) If they gave consent, I would run them through a card that they would sign that gave them very valuable information…”you do not have to give your consent…you can withdraw your consent at any time…” If they had any questions about giving consent, we would talk about it. Yes, I did have people that changed their mind after giving their consent, and I would stop right where I was at, wrap things up and be on my merry way…no harm…no foul.

Let me tell you, I won more people over by doing that simple thing…protecting their right…than anything else I ever did for people. As far as I was concerned, I was hired to keep the peace, protect people and property, but most of all, protect their rights.

My LE career is over now, but I still find myself protecting people’s rights when I can.
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if th... (show quote)


welcome back Sir Slatten
sumpin to ponder


| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 17:04:23   #
Rose42 (a regular here)
 
slatten49 wrote:
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if the cop asks permission to search your car without warrant? I mean if I have nothing to hide, then why not let the cop search the car?

By Keith Carlton, retired LEO. Supported by Kevin Shomura, 28+ years in Law Enforcement. Retired as a Senior Special Agent and Rick Bruno, Retired street cop

I was a Law Enforcement Officer for over 32 years. I used to think the same way…”Since I don’t have anything to hide, why not let them search.” I also used to think this same way about me asking to search…”If you have nothing to hide, why wouldn’t you let me search?”

About 15 years into my LE career, I attended training about laws and legal rights. The person doing the training was an attorney. She was very pro-police, but also very “you better know your job and you better do it right” kind of person…I respected that.

One of the officers attending the training, during a break, asked her this very question. At first, I was really shocked by her answer…remember, I thought this way at that time.

She told us that she would NEVER allow an officer to search ANYTHING of hers unless they had a warrant.
I think most of us were in shock with this answer. Here she had been telling us this whole time what legal rights we had to search, detain, probable cause…the list goes on, and now she is telling us that she, not having anything to hide, would not allow a consent search…what gives?

She explained it to us this way…

“I don’t have anything to prove to you guys. It is your job to find the probable cause to “get the warrant” so you can do the search, and quite frankly, I don’t have the time to wait around for you to do a search, that you are not entitled to do without a warrant. My time is very valuable and for you to spend 15 minutes of MY time trying to find something that I know isn’t there…well, that is 15 minutes I can never get back. Those lost 15 minutes I could have spent talking to my parents on the phone, or scratching my butt…doesn’t matter how I would have spent those 15 minutes, the fact is that I will never get those 15 minutes back to do what I WANT TO DO!!!” (Yes, those were her words to the class…I was impressed!)

When she finished talking, I sat back in my chair and thought about what she said for the rest of the break…just a few minutes. Damn if she wasn’t right. I never carry anything in my car that is illegal. I know that a search would be pointless for an LEO to do…they would find NOTHING.

Since it would be a waste of their time, that means that it would be an even bigger waste of my time.
My time may not cost very much, but to me it is valuable. I have things I need or want to do. Some things are very important to me…maybe not to others…some things are not very important to me, but I still want to get them done.

Because of what she said in the training, I applied that to my job from that time on.

I would still ask for consent to search because that is part of the job, but if the person declined the search I left it at that. It was their right to decline the search, I respected that right. (I can hear it now…if you respected their right, you wouldn’t have asked in the first place…not true…asking is not disrespecting their right. Forcing, or bullying them into a search is disrespecting their right…and I DID NOT ever do that!!) If they gave consent, I would run them through a card that they would sign that gave them very valuable information…”you do not have to give your consent…you can withdraw your consent at any time…” If they had any questions about giving consent, we would talk about it. Yes, I did have people that changed their mind after giving their consent, and I would stop right where I was at, wrap things up and be on my merry way…no harm…no foul.

Let me tell you, I won more people over by doing that simple thing…protecting their right…than anything else I ever did for people. As far as I was concerned, I was hired to keep the peace, protect people and property, but most of all, protect their rights.

My LE career is over now, but I still find myself protecting people’s rights when I can.
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if th... (show quote)


Great post. I know numerous cops and they're good guys who have to put up with a lot of garbage. People tend to forget that.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 17:32:57   #
lpnmajor (a regular here)
 
slatten49 wrote:
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if the cop asks permission to search your car without warrant? I mean if I have nothing to hide, then why not let the cop search the car?

By Keith Carlton, retired LEO. Supported by Kevin Shomura, 28+ years in Law Enforcement. Retired as a Senior Special Agent and Rick Bruno, Retired street cop

I was a Law Enforcement Officer for over 32 years. I used to think the same way…”Since I don’t have anything to hide, why not let them search.” I also used to think this same way about me asking to search…”If you have nothing to hide, why wouldn’t you let me search?”

About 15 years into my LE career, I attended training about laws and legal rights. The person doing the training was an attorney. She was very pro-police, but also very “you better know your job and you better do it right” kind of person…I respected that.

One of the officers attending the training, during a break, asked her this very question. At first, I was really shocked by her answer…remember, I thought this way at that time.

She told us that she would NEVER allow an officer to search ANYTHING of hers unless they had a warrant.
I think most of us were in shock with this answer. Here she had been telling us this whole time what legal rights we had to search, detain, probable cause…the list goes on, and now she is telling us that she, not having anything to hide, would not allow a consent search…what gives?

She explained it to us this way…

“I don’t have anything to prove to you guys. It is your job to find the probable cause to “get the warrant” so you can do the search, and quite frankly, I don’t have the time to wait around for you to do a search, that you are not entitled to do without a warrant. My time is very valuable and for you to spend 15 minutes of MY time trying to find something that I know isn’t there…well, that is 15 minutes I can never get back. Those lost 15 minutes I could have spent talking to my parents on the phone, or scratching my butt…doesn’t matter how I would have spent those 15 minutes, the fact is that I will never get those 15 minutes back to do what I WANT TO DO!!!” (Yes, those were her words to the class…I was impressed!)

When she finished talking, I sat back in my chair and thought about what she said for the rest of the break…just a few minutes. Damn if she wasn’t right. I never carry anything in my car that is illegal. I know that a search would be pointless for an LEO to do…they would find NOTHING.

Since it would be a waste of their time, that means that it would be an even bigger waste of my time.
My time may not cost very much, but to me it is valuable. I have things I need or want to do. Some things are very important to me…maybe not to others…some things are not very important to me, but I still want to get them done.

Because of what she said in the training, I applied that to my job from that time on.

I would still ask for consent to search because that is part of the job, but if the person declined the search I left it at that. It was their right to decline the search, I respected that right. (I can hear it now…if you respected their right, you wouldn’t have asked in the first place…not true…asking is not disrespecting their right. Forcing, or bullying them into a search is disrespecting their right…and I DID NOT ever do that!!) If they gave consent, I would run them through a card that they would sign that gave them very valuable information…”you do not have to give your consent…you can withdraw your consent at any time…” If they had any questions about giving consent, we would talk about it. Yes, I did have people that changed their mind after giving their consent, and I would stop right where I was at, wrap things up and be on my merry way…no harm…no foul.

Let me tell you, I won more people over by doing that simple thing…protecting their right…than anything else I ever did for people. As far as I was concerned, I was hired to keep the peace, protect people and property, but most of all, protect their rights.

My LE career is over now, but I still find myself protecting people’s rights when I can.
Why do so many people advise to refuse a cop if th... (show quote)


See, not all cops are aholes.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 18:48:16   #
Lonewolf (a regular here)
 
I liked the old days when they really had to have a reason to pull you over

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 19:55:13   #
archie bunker (a regular here)
 
byronglimish wrote:
There is most likely a canine within 15 minutes of a detained vehicle.

If a person refuses a search, it means nothing to the cop who calls in the dog.

Matter of fact most cops are immediately offended that a person would refuse a search, but that's just in the real world.


Been there, done that. A long time ago in Memphis, Tx.
I hope things have changed some since, because if I ever run to any of those assholes who patted down my kids, and made them stand on the side of the road with me in handcuffs, throat punches are coming!

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 20:09:41   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
archie bunker wrote:
Been there, done that. A long time ago in Memphis, Tx.
I hope things have changed some since, because if I ever run to any of those assholes who patted down my kids, and made them stand on the side of the road with me in handcuffs, throat punches are coming!



I respect, respectful cops.

I wouldn't blame you, cops like that should have their hands and feet put in stocks so anyone can go up and do whatever they want to them.

While asking them how it feels to be helpless and at the mercy of anyone.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 20:43:40   #
archie bunker (a regular here)
 
byronglimish wrote:
I respect, respectful cops.

I wouldn't blame you, cops like that should have their hands and feet put in stocks so anyone can go up and do whatever they want to them.

While asking them how it feels to be helpless and at the mercy of anyone.


I have family members who are cops, and get along with cops out on the road as well as long as, like you said, they're respectful.
I've always taken that as a one off incident because the guy was being a dick from the start, and I prolly didn't help any. That was back in the late 90's, and I was full of spunk myself. But still, him, and his buddies had no right to put my wife, and kids through that.
I filed a complaint with the Texas Dept. Of Public Safety, and received a form letter.

I do have more knowledge of my rights now, and it won't happen again!

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 20:57:35   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
archie bunker wrote:
I have family members who are cops, and get along with cops out on the road as well as long as, like you said, they're respectful.
I've always taken that as a one off incident because the guy was being a dick from the start, and I prolly didn't help any. That was back in the late 90's, and I was full of spunk myself. But still, him, and his buddies had no right to put my wife, and kids through that.
I filed a complaint with the Texas Dept. Of Public Safety, and received a form letter.

I do have more knowledge of my rights now, and it won't happen again!
I have family members who are cops, and get along ... (show quote)


I already knew that you are a man who respects the law.

Knowing the law is a bonus.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 21:08:12   #
archie bunker (a regular here)
 
byronglimish wrote:
I already knew that you are a man who respects the law.

Knowing the law is a bonus.


You, and me, and even my very honest, and good friend Slatten are prolly violating some law as we speak.
I need to look up how many laws are actually on the books. Too many for sure!

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 21:15:31   #
byronglimish (a regular here)
 
archie bunker wrote:
You, and me, and even my very honest, and good friend Slatten are prolly violating some law as we speak.
I need to look up how many laws are actually on the books. Too many for sure!


I believe that is Slatten is good people too.

As far as me breaking any laws, ..i'm pure as the driven snow.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 22:17:52   #
slatten49 (a regular here)
 
I have brothers, nephews, cousins and uncles who are/were LEOs. I respect officers of the law.

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 22:19:56   #
archie bunker (a regular here)
 
byronglimish wrote:
I believe that is Slatten is good people too.

As far as me breaking any laws, ..i'm pure as the driven snow.


Slatten is good people! My wife actually hugged the furry beast! Twice!

| Reply
Jul 1, 2019 22:26:34   #
archie bunker (a regular here)
 
slatten49 wrote:
I have brothers, nephews, cousins and uncles who are/were LEOs. I respect officers of the law.


As well as I do. I've always refused to let one bad experience define my opinion.
Over my years of driving for a living, I can fill a hat with warnings, and sport a squeaky clean MVR!

| Reply
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