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NRA T-shirt gets eighth-grader suspended and briefly jailed
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Apr 21, 2013 10:37:27   #
OPP Newsletter
 
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Education/2013/0421/Argument-over-NRA-T-shirt-gets-eighth-grader-jailed.-Dress-code-run-amok?cmpid=addthis_reddit#.UXPnrPNgMUQ.reddit

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Apr 21, 2013 11:48:22   #
Tasine Loc: Southwest US
 
IMHO, the only people deserving punishment were members of the school board. Being the typical "highly educated" nitwit, the teacher hasn't a clue about the US Constitution, as it turned out, neither did the school board - fortunately students know more than the teacher OR the school board. Were I his parents I'd yank him out of that school yesterday!

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Apr 21, 2013 13:33:57   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Tasine wrote:
IMHO, the only people deserving punishment were members of the school board. Being the typical "highly educated" nitwit, the teacher hasn't a clue about the US Constitution, as it turned out, neither did the school board - fortunately students know more than the teacher OR the school board. Were I his parents I'd yank him out of that school yesterday!


Do you mean yank him out before the "grabbers" throw him out?

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Apr 21, 2013 16:09:43   #
Christianbiker Loc: Pennsylvania
 
I just think the schools are going over board on this kind of stuff. But they will not stop bullying of kids by other kids. They want to paint a picture of protection by havinga zero tolerance for anything that has to do with guns, i.e., empty shell casings, drawing a gun, saying the word "gun". But let a bully pick on and torment a smaller or less agressive kid, that is ok. If the bullied kid tries to fight back, they throw him out and let the bully go. Those that would send a kid home over a NRA Tshirt are just ignorant. Trying to force a kid to think the way they want him to think instead of how parents are raising him/her.

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Apr 21, 2013 16:48:36   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Christianbiker wrote:
I just think the schools are going over board on this kind of stuff. But they will not stop bullying of kids by other kids. They want to paint a picture of protection by havinga zero tolerance for anything that has to do with guns, i.e., empty shell casings, drawing a gun, saying the word "gun". But let a bully pick on and torment a smaller or less agressive kid, that is ok. If the bullied kid tries to fight back, they throw him out and let the bully go. Those that would send a kid home over a NRA Tshirt are just ignorant. Trying to force a kid to think the way they want him to think instead of how parents are raising him/her.
I just think the schools are going over board on t... (show quote)


I am pretty sure that any kid who wore an Obama T-shirt to school would never be questioned. Turn that one around and put on a shirt that takes Obama to task over anything and he is gone. I have to agree with you about this part of the story.

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Apr 21, 2013 17:18:25   #
oldroy Loc: Western Kansas (No longer in hiding)
 
Christianbiker wrote:
I just think the schools are going over board on this kind of stuff. But they will not stop bullying of kids by other kids. They want to paint a picture of protection by havinga zero tolerance for anything that has to do with guns, i.e., empty shell casings, drawing a gun, saying the word "gun". But let a bully pick on and torment a smaller or less agressive kid, that is ok. If the bullied kid tries to fight back, they throw him out and let the bully go. Those that would send a kid home over a NRA Tshirt are just ignorant. Trying to force a kid to think the way they want him to think instead of how parents are raising him/her.
I just think the schools are going over board on t... (show quote)


I am pretty sure that any kid who wore an Obama T-shirt to school would never be questioned. Turn that one around and put on a shirt that takes Obama to task over anything and he is gone. I have to agree with you about this part of the story.

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Apr 21, 2013 23:39:40   #
Unclet Loc: Amarillo, Tx
 
Tasine wrote:
IMHO, the only people deserving punishment were members of the school board. Being the typical "highly educated" nitwit, the teacher hasn't a clue about the US Constitution, as it turned out, neither did the school board - fortunately students know more than the teacher OR the school board. Were I his parents I'd yank him out of that school yesterday!


This is just my take and opinion, there are lots unknown factors that I am sure that I am unaware of. While it might be best to remove the child from that school, depending on location, parental financial situation, etc. If that happens, no one benefits, not the child, because he has learned to capitulate instead of taking a stand. The School Board and Teacher have learned to bully those who disagree or have an opposing viewpoint. The community loses a family, who have the potential to contribute in a positive way.

If they don't have the ways nor the means to relocate the child they will either stand up to the "Bullies" and not be intimidated. Or they will give in, either way it will be their choice to make. If they move the child, they will have given that decision over to others.

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Apr 22, 2013 01:21:50   #
ABBAsFernando Loc: Ohio
 
Way past time to round up the c*******t agents pretending to be educators and send their sorry asses to Cuba!



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Apr 22, 2013 08:14:21   #
Tasine Loc: Southwest US
 
Unclet wrote:
This is just my take and opinion, there are lots unknown factors that I am sure that I am unaware of. While it might be best to remove the child from that school, depending on location, parental financial situation, etc. If that happens, no one benefits, not the child, because he has learned to capitulate instead of taking a stand. The School Board and Teacher have learned to bully those who disagree or have an opposing viewpoint. The community loses a family, who have the potential to contribute in a positive way.

If they don't have the ways nor the means to relocate the child they will either stand up to the "Bullies" and not be intimidated. Or they will give in, either way it will be their choice to make. If they move the child, they will have given that decision over to others.
This is just my take and opinion, there are lots u... (show quote)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
" If that happens, no one benefits, not the child, because he has learned to capitulate instead of taking a stand."
Oh, unclet, I have great respect for your thinking and your ideas, but on this issue I couldn't disagree more. Every kid removed from that school means X dollars that school will NO LONGER RECEIVE from the government, including federal money and construction dollars, it was about $12,000 in 2007-08. I don't see that as "giving in to the bullies." I see that as truly meaningful fighting back. Imagine if 20 kids were removed from that school because of bullying - that is $12,000 dollars times 20 for a grand loss of $240,000. A school district can be BROKEN if the parents have some guts and some determination.

Any school district that has stupid rules, unprincipled employees and boards of education, can be called to heel by parents - IF those parents would get together, hire some tutors.......shouldn't be too expensive if several people are sharing the cost, and the kids could be removed from the violence, blue language, gang fights, intimidation and all other non-education interests that go on in public schools. Additionally, they could be taught the American way, the US Constitution, their history, decency, etc.

Frankly, I believe public education is quite injurious to the most defenseless, I believe it is more harmful than helpful to the children, I believe it is excessively expensive, and I believe without public schooling, our nation would not be in the throes of death as it now is. Put succinctly, I despise public education and what it stands for. Yes, I know there are dedicated teachers, and a few of the older ones know what America is, but MOST DO NOT and DO NOT CARE. More and more they have fallen to the "feel good" method of making decisions rather than to the "right thing". And that is what is being taught to our kids - and they will suffer as a result of it.

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Apr 22, 2013 08:40:54   #
roy
 
hey maybe they just had a dress code.

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Apr 22, 2013 08:43:27   #
Unclet Loc: Amarillo, Tx
 
Tasine wrote:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
" If that happens, no one benefits, not the child, because he has learned to capitulate instead of taking a stand."
Oh, unclet, I have great respect for your thinking and your ideas, but on this issue I couldn't disagree more. Every kid removed from that school means X dollars that school will NO LONGER RECEIVE from the government, including federal money and construction dollars, it was about $12,000 in 2007-08. I don't see that as "giving in to the bullies." I see that as truly meaningful fighting back. Imagine if 20 kids were removed from that school because of bullying - that is $12,000 dollars times 20 for a grand loss of $240,000. A school district can be BROKEN if the parents have some guts and some determination.

Any school district that has stupid rules, unprincipled employees and boards of education, can be called to heel by parents - IF those parents would get together, hire some tutors.......shouldn't be too expensive if several people are sharing the cost, and the kids could be removed from the violence, blue language, gang fights, intimidation and all other non-education interests that go on in public schools. Additionally, they could be taught the American way, the US Constitution, their history, decency, etc.

Frankly, I believe public education is quite injurious to the most defenseless, I believe it is more harmful than helpful to the children, I believe it is excessively expensive, and I believe without public schooling, our nation would not be in the throes of death as it now is. Put succinctly, I despise public education and what it stands for. Yes, I know there are dedicated teachers, and a few of the older ones know what America is, but MOST DO NOT and DO NOT CARE. More and more they have fallen to the "feel good" method of making decisions rather than to the "right thing". And that is what is being taught to our kids - and they will suffer as a result of it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ br " If that happens... (show quote)


Tas - While I agree with the premise of what you say, that public education is not what it once was. It is expensive, and for the most part ineffectual. We can lay most of the problem with schools on two things - Tenure and the PTA.

Tenure, because it pretty much make teachers unfireable and when someone cannot be punished or corrected they tend to stray or be lead down the "feel good" path that you mention, this comes across in their teachings.

PTA - parent teacher association for the most part does not exist in today's public school system. It has become a "parent, let me tell you how it is going to be" meeting. Frankly most parents or at least the ones that I know are fairly disconnected from the school system and have no idea what is being taught to their children. Certainly, they have no interest in "home schooling", either parent taught nor tutor taught.

School Boards for the most part are still elected by the community. Most members are parents, but not always, some are past parents and so on. They do the hiring and firing of teachers - and used to pick the cirriculum. That has now been turned over to Gov't. They dictate what will be taught and now they have come up with a "Core" program, that is really Liberal. With Core comes monitors that the school has to hire (unions) to ensure that the program is taught as it is supposed to be, no variation. This is wrong, but mainly it occurred because of the disassociation of parents, and the community as a whole.

I wish everyone had the wherewithall, and fortitude to do as Tas suggested. I just don't know that the Assets and Interest are there to make it happen. If not then we need to find a different way to effect change in our school systems, toward the better.

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Apr 22, 2013 08:58:25   #
Tasine Loc: Southwest US
 
Unclet said: I wish everyone had the wherewithall, and fortitude to do as Tas suggested. I just don't know that the Assets and Interest are there to make it happen. If not then we need to find a different way to effect change in our school systems, toward the better.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1. Hire no union teachers
2. No tenure
3. No federal money accepted, hence no federal interference
4. Run the schools "bare bones".....there's too much extra stuff that isn't necessary, isn't beneficial
5. Keep salaries at logical levels
6. Stop this constant "education" of the teachers. They don't learn a lot, and a lot of what they learn isn't necessary OR good.

Those would be a decent start. Think you'll live long enough to see even ONE of those ideas implemented? Me neither. Home school your kids, or hire someone to do it for you, or get a group together and share the education and the teaching.

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Apr 22, 2013 09:14:56   #
Unclet Loc: Amarillo, Tx
 
Tasine wrote:
Unclet said: I wish everyone had the wherewithall, and fortitude to do as Tas suggested. I just don't know that the Assets and Interest are there to make it happen. If not then we need to find a different way to effect change in our school systems, toward the better.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1. Hire no union teachers
2. No tenure
3. No federal money accepted, hence no federal interference
4. Run the schools "bare bones".....there's too much extra stuff that isn't necessary, isn't beneficial
5. Keep salaries at logical levels
6. Stop this constant "education" of the teachers. They don't learn a lot, and a lot of what they learn isn't necessary OR good.

Those would be a decent start. Think you'll live long enough to see even ONE of those ideas implemented? Me neither. Home school your kids, or hire someone to do it for you, or get a group together and share the education and the teaching.
Unclet said: I wish everyone had the wherewithall... (show quote)


Again, I don't disagree. I just don't think it will ever happen. I don't believe, in today's world that there is enough parential interest in the school system. They are to busy maintaining their lifestyle, but that is another topic.

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Apr 22, 2013 12:08:54   #
JimYardley
 
"...charged with obstruction and disturbing the education process.." I've just got to wonder, obstruction of what, exactly? And exactly what education was taking place that this kid was "disturbing"?

Teachers can apparently have you tossed in jail for telling them that they are wrong? Seriously?

Suppose the kid walked into class carrying a book, say "The Road to Serfdom"...would that constitute "disturbing the education process", or would it be obstructing ongoing indoctrination and brain washing?

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Apr 22, 2013 13:04:02   #
Tasine Loc: Southwest US
 
JimYardley wrote:
"...charged with obstruction and disturbing the education process.." I've just got to wonder, obstruction of what, exactly? And exactly what education was taking place that this kid was "disturbing"?

Teachers can apparently have you tossed in jail for telling them that they are wrong? Seriously?

Suppose the kid walked into class carrying a book, say "The Road to Serfdom"...would that constitute "disturbing the education process", or would it be obstructing ongoing indoctrination and brain washing?
"...charged with obstruction and disturbing t... (show quote)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
C'mon, Jim. You should know better than to throw logic at us peons, us dummy peons. LOL. The kid was probably obstructing and disturbing because all the little street gangs who don't know left from right had jumped on him and were pummeling him with fists and other sundry tools. The teacher, being at one with the street gangs and the left saw this kid in the tee shirt as very disruptive - he/she didn't have the guts to tell them to all "sit and be quiet."

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