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Definitions 'Democracy'
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Mar 16, 2019 08:46:42   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous threads that debate and discuss whether America is a democracy of some sort or not...

I have found fascinating arguments and opinions expressed by numerous members...

While I would not wish to start a thread on whether or not America is in fact a democracy, I can't help but feel that many on the OPP are debating with different understandings of the term 'democracy'...

So I invite the members of the OPP to share their definition of what a democracy is...

What does the term mean?

Are there variations on the term?

How does it apply to the US?




Have fun and play nice

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 08:57:32   #
4522chief
 
A democracy is basically majority rule, which doesn’t apply to us because we are a republic.

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 09:15:11   #
Seth
 
4522chief wrote:
A democracy is basically majority rule, which doesn’t apply to us because we are a republic.


Exactly.

Democracy may work up to a point, but it can just as easily descend into the potentially destructive quagmire of mob rule.

Reply
 
 
Mar 16, 2019 09:32:18   #
archie bunker Loc: Texas
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous threads that debate and discuss whether America is a democracy of some sort or not...

I have found fascinating arguments and opinions expressed by numerous members...

While I would not wish to start a thread on whether or not America is in fact a democracy, I can't help but feel that many on the OPP are debating with different understandings of the term 'democracy'...

So I invite the members of the OPP to share their definition of what a democracy is...

What does the term mean?

Are there variations on the term?

How does it apply to the US?




Have fun and play nice
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous th... (show quote)

Three pedephlies and two mothers v****g on the age of consent.

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 10:02:58   #
bahmer
 
archie bunker wrote:
Three pedephlies and two mothers v****g on the age of consent.


Now that is a good one there Archie.

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 10:09:14   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
archie bunker wrote:
Three pedephlies and two mothers v****g on the age of consent.


Hi Arch..

Thanks for taking the question seriously...

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 10:10:11   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
4522chief wrote:
A democracy is basically majority rule, which doesn’t apply to us because we are a republic.


Any variations on the term?

How does a Republic elect its officials?

Reply
 
 
Mar 16, 2019 10:58:12   #
archie bunker Loc: Texas
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Hi Arch..

Thanks for taking the question seriously...


I was being serious, Canuckus. If we were a true democracy, just a handful of population centers would elect Presidents, and set policy for our entire country.

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 11:16:22   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
archie bunker wrote:
I was being serious, Canuckus. If we were a true democracy, just a handful of population centers would elect Presidents, and set policy for our entire country.


Scary thought I agree....

Up for some tennis this evening?

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 11:26:25   #
Airforceone
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous threads that debate and discuss whether America is a democracy of some sort or not...

I have found fascinating arguments and opinions expressed by numerous members...

While I would not wish to start a thread on whether or not America is in fact a democracy, I can't help but feel that many on the OPP are debating with different understandings of the term 'democracy'...

So I invite the members of the OPP to share their definition of what a democracy is...

What does the term mean?

Are there variations on the term?

How does it apply to the US?




Have fun and play nice
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous th... (show quote)


Democracy: basically put is a government by the people (power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly through a system of representatives. The people elect the Senators, Representative and president to form 3 independent but equal branches of government. House , Senate and Executive branches.
This is accomplished thru our Free and f**r e******ns.

Protection of human rights, Rule of law applies equally to all citizens, protects the rights of all citizens, maintains order, and limits the power of government.

It appears that a fair and free e******n in this country is not being adhered two. Every state has different v***r r**********n laws that change from one e******n to another.

Our e******n process is geared to who has the power and that means only one thing. Who has the most money. Citizens united undermined our e******ns by putting the power in the hands of the wealthy which is our corporate lobbyist, wealthy individuals, v**er suppression, V**er purge, v**er intimidation. Our democracy is no longer controlled by the people it’s controlled by the wealthy.

Without a free and f**r e******n our democracy will continue to erode.

E******ns always showed the will of the people now it shows the will of corporate interest and the wealthy.

We are a democracy based on a capitalistic society with social programs to protect all people. And this is only accomplished thru free and f**r e******n and a strong adherence to the rule of law.

Nobody and I mean nobody in this country is above the law.

I wished you asked the difinition of socialism and how socialism is a part of our democracy. Where in our government is the theory of socialism applied. Most citizens do not understand there are 5 forms of socialism.

I wanted to expand on the term democracy but that could take days.But let’s attempt to inject into the your question of what is democracy, then add in socialism, Marxism and capitalism definitions and how each form of government applied to our democracy.

For some reason the terms capitalism, socialism, Marxism are bad words but all they are is a different form of government, each one has positives and negatives and this country has used certain parts of socialism, Capitalism, and Marxism to form our democracy.

I don’t want you to get me wrong so let me try to explain my perception when our founding fathers wanted to build our country based on a capitalistic society.

This country needs to support our capitilist and we do but by what means do we support our capitilist.

We give people social programs to feed and educate the poor. If we educate our people they work and prosper through our capitalist.
Is this not a form of socialism.

We give all citizens an opportunity for a higher education thru PELL Grants does this support our capitalist.

We support our capitilist thru subsidies is this a form of socialism.

We build highways, bridges, railways so our capitalist can t***sport goods across our country. Is this socialism

We created the greatest defense in the world to make this country safe is this socialism

We created the greatest state and local law enforcement agencies to protect all people and is this a form of socialism.

We created loopholes in our tax system is this a form of socialism.

The tax payer shelled out $750 billion under the TARP program to bail out the capitilist. We bailed out our auto industry using Tax payer funds in the amount of $200 billion. This is socialism. Do I agree with these programs yes I do because if the banks failed and our auto industry went bankrupt we would have been in a Depression not a recession. But it was up to our Congress to create legislation to prevent this from happening again. But one party applied the regulations and the other party when they gained the power removed the regulations. If we support our corporation with tax payer funds should the people have the right to regulate. So is regulation a bad word.

We created collective bargaining so our labor poll has some kind of protection is this a form of Marxism.

I can give many examples of Marxism, and socialism in this country and how we are supporting our capitalist thru each policy.

So to form a democracy and to create a strong and sustainable economy we need certain laws to protect all people along with our capitalist.

So yes we have laws to protect our democracy.
We need to protect and support our capitalist thru stronge education, strong healthcare, strong defense, strong labor laws, equal rights, all these policies create a strong democracy. But how do we accomplish this and it damm sure will not be accomplished under a100% capitalistic form of government. That does not create a strong democracy that puts all the power in the hands of a very few wealthy people.

But what we get on OPP if one party supports strong labor laws your called a Marxist if one party supports a social agenda your called as socialist. Then we have one party that wants a pure capitalistic society. ( DEMOCRACY DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY.)

So if you have one party going to far right and the other party going to far left it creates an imbalance in our democracy

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 11:32:32   #
archie bunker Loc: Texas
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
Scary thought I agree....

Up for some tennis this evening?


You bet I am!

Reply
 
 
Mar 16, 2019 11:34:16   #
working class stiff Loc: N. Carolina
 
Canuckus Deploracus wrote:
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous threads that debate and discuss whether America is a democracy of some sort or not...

I have found fascinating arguments and opinions expressed by numerous members...

While I would not wish to start a thread on whether or not America is in fact a democracy, I can't help but feel that many on the OPP are debating with different understandings of the term 'democracy'...

So I invite the members of the OPP to share their definition of what a democracy is...

What does the term mean?

Are there variations on the term?

How does it apply to the US?




Have fun and play nice
These past few weeks or so I have read numerous th... (show quote)


Ok....I'll play. Since I suspect that most responses will fall along the line of 'the US is a republic, not a democracy', I am going to make the case that the 'republic' part of the US government cannot stop the 'democracy' part if a large number of Americans (the so-called mob) agree on an issue.

I posit that if, let's say, 70% of Americans agree on issue X (fill in your own hot button issue), there is nothing in the Constitution that can stop that policy agreement from becoming law. Here's why:

Opponents of the agreed upon policy X would be v**ed out of office fairly quickly. Six years for senators, 4 for the President, 2 for representatives. Legislation for policy X would be drawn up and passed pretty quickly as that would be the promise they were elected upon. That leaves the court system as the only block to the implementation of policy X.

Opponents would sue to stop the policy and may receive a favorable ruling, whether in state or federal courts. If ruled unconstitutional, policy X would be delayed. However, then the court would be up for evaluation by the American people. They would keep electing officials who vow to replace the court officials as they retire or resign. (As a side note, as more states go to electing judicial officials, the American people can have a direct hand in replacing judicial opponents of policy X). Once a certain threshold is reached, even the Supreme Court would have to acknowledge the will of the American people or be replaced...possibly impeached.

It may take 10-15 years, but eventually policy X will be ruled Constitutional. The 'mob' (the American v**er) will win.

Of course, that all rests on a large majority agreeing on policy X. I don't see such an issue or policy on the horizon. The republic is still safe.

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 11:34:28   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
Airforceone wrote:
Democracy: basically put is a government by the people (power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly through a system of representatives. The people elect the Senators, Representative and president to form 3 independent but equal branches of government. House , Senate and Executive branches.
This is accomplished thru our Free and f**r e******ns.

Protection of human rights, Rule of law applies equally to all citizens, protects the rights of all citizens, maintains order, and limits the power of government.

It appears that a fair and free e******n in this country is not being adhered two. Every state has different v***r r**********n laws that change from one e******n to another.

Our e******n process is geared to who has the power and that means only one thing. Who has the most money. Citizens united undermined our e******ns by putting the power in the hands of the wealthy which is our corporate lobbyist, wealthy individuals, v**er suppression, V**er purge, v**er intimidation. Our democracy is no longer controlled by the people it’s controlled by the wealthy.

Without a free and f**r e******n our democracy will continue to erode.

E******ns always showed the will of the people now it shows the will of corporate interest and the wealthy.

We are a democracy based on a capitalistic society with social programs to protect all people. And this is only accomplished thru free and f**r e******n and a strong adherence to the rule of law.

Nobody and I mean nobody in this country is above the law.

I wished you asked the difinition of socialism and how socialism is a part of our democracy. Where in our government is the theory of socialism applied. Most citizens do not understand there are 5 forms of socialism.

I wanted to expand on the term democracy but that could take days.But let’s attempt to inject into the your question of what is democracy, then add in socialism, Marxism and capitalism definitions and how each form of government applied to our democracy.

For some reason the terms capitalism, socialism, Marxism are bad words but all they are is a different form of government, each one has positives and negatives and this country has used certain parts of socialism, Capitalism, and Marxism to form our democracy.

I don’t want you to get me wrong so let me try to explain my perception when our founding fathers wanted to build our country based on a capitalistic society.

This country needs to support our capitilist and we do but by what means do we support our capitilist.

We give people social programs to feed and educate the poor. If we educate our people they work and prosper through our capitalist.
Is this not a form of socialism.

We give all citizens an opportunity for a higher education thru PELL Grants does this support our capitalist.

We support our capitilist thru subsidies is this a form of socialism.

We build highways, bridges, railways so our capitalist can t***sport goods across our country. Is this socialism

We created the greatest defense in the world to make this country safe is this socialism

We created the greatest state and local law enforcement agencies to protect all people and is this a form of socialism.

We created loopholes in our tax system is this a form of socialism.

The tax payer shelled out $750 billion under the TARP program to bail out the capitilist. We bailed out our auto industry using Tax payer funds in the amount of $200 billion. This is socialism. Do I agree with these programs yes I do because if the banks failed and our auto industry went bankrupt we would have been in a Depression not a recession. But it was up to our Congress to create legislation to prevent this from happening again. But one party applied the regulations and the other party when they gained the power removed the regulations. If we support our corporation with tax payer funds should the people have the right to regulate. So is regulation a bad word.

We created collective bargaining so our labor poll has some kind of protection is this a form of Marxism.

I can give many examples of Marxism, and socialism in this country and how we are supporting our capitalist thru each policy.

So to form a democracy and to create a strong and sustainable economy we need certain laws to protect all people along with our capitalist.

So yes we have laws to protect our democracy.
We need to protect and support our capitalist thru stronge education, strong healthcare, strong defense, strong labor laws, equal rights, all these policies create a strong democracy. But how do we accomplish this and it damm sure will not be accomplished under a100% capitalistic form of government. That does not create a strong democracy that puts all the power in the hands of a very few wealthy people.

But what we get on OPP if one party supports strong labor laws your called a Marxist if one party supports a social agenda your called as socialist. Then we have one party that wants a pure capitalistic society. ( DEMOCRACY DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY.)

So if you have one party going to far right and the other party going to far left it creates an imbalance in our democracy
Democracy: basically put is a government by the pe... (show quote)


Thanks for the response...
It was well thought out...

I agree that there should be the same v***r r**********n laws throughout the country.. But I'm equally certain that each state believes their v**er laws are the best...

You are correct in that Marxism, Socialism and C*******m all employ democratic elements..

And education is essential to any system...

Hope to hear more from you... Give it some time and I'm sure you will receive better responses than mine to your post

Your friend, Kyle

PS: I did a Definitions thread on socialism a few back in February... It had some pretty interesting responses and you might find it intetesting to read over

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 11:39:55   #
Canuckus Deploracus Loc: North of the wall
 
working class stiff wrote:
Ok....I'll play. Since I suspect that most responses will fall along the line of 'the US is a republic, not a democracy', I am going to make the case that the 'republic' part of the US government cannot stop the 'democracy' part if a large number of Americans (the so-called mob) agree on an issue.

I posit that if, let's say, 70% of Americans agree on issue X (fill in your own hot button issue), there is nothing in the Constitution that can stop that policy agreement from becoming law. Here's why:

Opponents of the agreed upon policy X would be v**ed out of office fairly quickly. Six years for senators, 4 for the President, 2 for representatives. Legislation for policy X would be drawn up and passed pretty quickly as that would be the promise they were elected upon. That leaves the court system as the only block to the implementation of policy X.

Opponents would sue to stop the policy and may receive a favorable ruling, whether in state or federal courts. If ruled unconstitutional, policy X would be delayed. However, then the court would be up for evaluation by the American people. They would keep electing officials who vow to replace the court officials as they retire or resign. (As a side note, as more states go to electing judicial officials, the American people can have a direct hand in replacing judicial opponents of policy X). Once a certain threshold is reached, even the Supreme Court would have to acknowledge the will of the American people or be replaced...possibly impeached.

It may take 10-15 years, but eventually policy X will be ruled Constitutional. The 'mob' (the American v**er) will win.

Of course, that all rests on a large majority agreeing on policy X. I don't see such an issue or policy on the horizon. The republic is still safe.
Ok....I'll play. Since I suspect that most respon... (show quote)


Sounds like a good system...

Glad you could join the thread...

Do you ever get the feeling that officials are intentionally feeding the divide so that they can remain in office?

Reply
Mar 16, 2019 11:45:01   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
archie bunker wrote:
Three pedephlies and two mothers v****g on the age of consent.


Lololol ya dang nut!! Spillage of my coffee, sending you my bill for yet again getting another shirt wet!!!

Reply
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