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Trump Thinks He’s ‘Winning’ The Shutdown As Human Suffering Grows
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Jan 11, 2019 23:31:16   #
lindajoy Loc: right here with you....
 
BigMike wrote:
We're going to BEAT them on this! You watch! Europe, this ain't!


I am watching~~~🤷🏻‍♀️👀👁🙀😱😳🙃

Europe it ain’ t darlin!!!

Nice to see you as always.. Do hope Mom is healing nicely and adjusting now..


We’re never alone~~~
https://youtu.be/P2sOshVu7WY

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Jan 12, 2019 00:09:19   #
jack sequim wa Loc: Redding, CA
 
badbob85037 wrote:
Long haul or local you know when we have a federal holiday there is no rush hour traffic. I am also sure that every time you have had to deal with any federal agency they have made matters 10 times worse turning an easy answered problem into a major headache. The Federal Government is given 30 task by our Constitution. Some are done half assed and some done not at all. Can you tell me why we have over 2,000 government agencies, (no one knows the exact number) to fumble around screwing these 30 task up or not doing them at all? Now thanks to our last president these buffoons are now armed with weapons we were forced to buy them. Dealing with many of these agents I believe their IQ's were close to their hat sizes and were sucking welfare screwing up their own lives instead of every American they came in contact with. I also believe they know every way to suck the system and putting them all back on welfare might be a burden it would still be worth it to end this government over reach. with their' file it in the trash and blame the new guy' BS saving Americans thousands of early grave headaches.

Example 1, IRS. A less than $5.00 tax return sent back and forth through the mail. Government demanding payment only to mail it back. Repeating again and again never ending.Threats made to take my house , my car and everything else I owned.

Example 2, Labor Department. Owner of company was fined and made to pay back wages to employees for drive time back to shop at end of day. The back pay mounted into tens of thousands The Drive time agreement was OKed by every employee at the time they were hired. The owner was made to pay the government the back pay, not the employees. To date I have been the only employee to get that back pay from the government and I fought 1 and a half years to get it. I ask what happened to the interest of close to $2000. They told me there was no interest. I ask who's backyard was it buried in and what about the other employees money. They didn't answer either question.

Example 3,IRS. Remember when Obama started giving everybody a bunch trying to do anything to get the economy going. I nor my wife received a dime. It started when a government mailman put a tax return for a couple bucks in the wrong mailbox. As we all have done someone wrote 'not at this address' across it and sent it off. Right address just average government employee. I called IRS and was told I DID not living at the address I lived for 15 years causing all government mail from being delivered. I spent 2 hours giving information to a government employee and it ended with what I was owed would be there in 6 weeks. After 8 weeks I phoned them again finding they never knew anything of my first call. After another 2 hours giving the same information the first employee filed in the trash I was told again 6 weeks. 8 weeks latter I made my third call to the IRS telling me again they had no record of the first or second time I called. Though I didn't have to give the information again because it was passed the deadline to file for the money.

There is only one thing I want from any of the over 2,000 government agencies. That is to be left alone, me and the ones around me that have anything to do with my or my family's life. Put them all back where they belong. Sucking the government freebees setting at the bottom of the food chain. with their heads stuck in that dark stanky place where they cant hurt others.
Long haul or local you know when we have a federal... (show quote)




I compare the government with Boeing engineers I did business with in the 80's. There are rational engineers that use their talents to solve problems then the freaks that create details in details.
An example while having Thanksgiving dinner my wife's uncle (Boeing engineer) was the turkey carver this one year. Momma proudly dressed the table with all the trimmings and lastly the turkey. Where's uncle? In the office printing out directions to carve the turkey.... We waited only about two minutes before he showed up with the directions grasp proudly in hand, sat down and began reading the instructions. One minute passed, two, three, five.... Easily 8-9 minutes passed as we all noticed the hot steaming food was no longer steaming and unanimously we all began taking apart the parts of the turkey we favored most with our forks and butter knifes.

In order to change a flat tire the government will write a manual. Then send it to another office to determine the amount of torque required to loosen and tighten the lug nuts. Another on safety procedures of jacking the car up, another to a traffic safety board of risk assessment, hazards to other drivers. Then require flares and reflective signs be placed, then off to another office for testing, another for approval and when it's all said and done. A one hundred page manual taking 30 people from a dozen government departments to change a tire my wife could do.... In ten minutes without any instructions and not break a nail.

It takes dozens of workers to do a one person job.
Not to disrespect many of the hard working government workers not in this loop, yet they often are the ones reading the 100 page manuals.

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Jan 12, 2019 01:05:05   #
badbob85037
 
Do you actually know any hard working government employees? My whole life I have seen one and he was retired military which explains all the hard working part.

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Jan 12, 2019 04:02:09   #
Gatsby
 
Bad Bob wrote:
https://www.politicususa.com/2019/01/11/trump-winning-shutdown.html


Millions of people and their families are suffering because they aren’t getting paid during the government shutdown, but Trump refuses to open government because he thinks that he is winning.
Politico reported:
On the 20th day of the shutdown, the GOP group tried to jump start bipartisan talks before Trump declares a national emergency to get his wall. But the president rejected their idea to allow congressional committees to sort out his border wall request while the government reopened, deeming the idea likely to leave him with nothing to show for the shutdown.

Vice President Mike Pence and acting Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney had been consulting with senators about the matter on Thursday. Pence and Mulvaney took the idea to the president, who shot it down, according to multiple people directly involved in the talks. While the congressional committees could still take up Trump’s border wall plan, the president opposes the idea of opening the government before serious wall negotiations have begun, the people said. He told Senate Republicans he believes he is winning the fight and will not sign any stopgap bills at this point.
https://www.politicususa.com/2019/01/11/trump-winn... (show quote)


Congress forced the government shutdown, by failing to pass a spending bill.

This government shutdown must continue until Congress does pass a spending bill.

Read the Constitution of the United States of America, end your ignorance today, for FREE!

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/constitution-transcript

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Jan 12, 2019 04:39:16   #
Bad Bob Loc: Virginia
 
Wolf counselor wrote:
Are you still getting your social security check ?............Boob ?

If you need a loan, I'll cover you up to a few grand.

But Boob,......You should take better care of yourself.


All I need is my Vanguard.

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Jan 12, 2019 04:41:23   #
Bad Bob Loc: Virginia
 
Buzzer wrote:
Mr. Trump's attempts to disrupt the operation of our federal government for perceived personal gain are in fact direct violations of his oath of office. This failure to administer the proper continuing operation of the government is indeed dereliction of duty --- an impeachable offense ---



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Jan 12, 2019 04:45:41   #
Bad Bob Loc: Virginia
 
trucksterbud wrote:
Yep, for once I agree. This insanity needs to stop NOW..!! The unpaid federal workers shouldn't be caught in the crosshairs of some "Pet Project" of either congress or the President.

I feel that congress and Trump can just step up to the plate and pay 800,000 mortgages and offer food / gas assistance to those in need.... You..??


Damn that's a first!!! I agree with you.

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Jan 12, 2019 06:34:35   #
Idaho
 
Y
Buzzer wrote:
Mr. Trump's attempts to disrupt the operation of our federal government for perceived personal gain are in fact direct violations of his oath of office. This failure to administer the proper continuing operation of the government is indeed dereliction of duty --- an impeachable offense ---


Shill. Hopefully your handler is within the part of Government that is shut down and funds to your handler’s projects are drying up rapidly.

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Jan 12, 2019 06:46:06   #
Bad Bob Loc: Virginia
 
Idaho wrote:
Y

Shill. Hopefully your handler is within the part of Government that is shut down and funds to your handler’s projects are drying up rapidly.


Yeah like $$$$$$ for trump's wall.

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Jan 12, 2019 06:47:30   #
Iamdjchrys Loc: Decatur, Texas
 
proud republican wrote:
These people are going to get paid....But we are talking about something that is more important....We are talking about people that losing their loved once.......Democrats should stop playing with people' lives and give him money for Border Security that we really need...Or maybe Pelosi and Schumer SHOULD VISIT THE bORDER LIKE President trump did and see for themselves what is going on over there...


Border Security yes...the Wall, no! Ask the people like my neighbors in McAllen, Texas what they think of the Wall and they will laugh in your face. It's Trump who is playing with people's lives with this unconscionable shutdown! 800,000 Federal workers, most living paycheck to paycheck, will tell you in no uncertain terms what THEY think of the shutdown, and they are not, contrary to what President Trump is putting out there, in support. The "threat" of illegal drugs coming over the border via illegal means is pure, unmitigated bullshit...in point of fact, the vast majority of illegal drugs come across the border at legal entrances. The denial of amnesty for those escaping unfathomable terror is what is un-American. Border security is entirely feasible without "the Wall" via modern technology. And I'm assuming that you aren't one of the many property owners whose land is subject to whatever seizure the government deems "necessary".

| Reply
Jan 12, 2019 06:57:32   #
Bad Bob Loc: Virginia
 
Iamdjchrys wrote:
Border Security yes...the Wall, no! Ask the people like my neighbors in McAllen, Texas what they think of the Wall and they will laugh in your face. It's Trump who is playing with people's lives with this unconscionable shutdown! 800,000 Federal workers, most living paycheck to paycheck, will tell you in no uncertain terms what THEY think of the shutdown, and they are not, contrary to what President Trump is putting out there, in support. The "threat" of illegal drugs coming over the border via illegal means is pure, unmitigated bullshit...in point of fact, the vast majority of illegal drugs come across the border at legal entrances. The denial of amnesty for those escaping unfathomable terror is what is un-American. Border security is entirely feasible without "the Wall" via modern technology. And I'm assuming that you aren't one of the many property owners whose land is subject to whatever seizure the government deems "necessary".
Border Security yes...the Wall, no! Ask the peopl... (show quote)



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Jan 12, 2019 07:31:47   #
snowbear37 Loc: MA.
 
Bad Bob wrote:
https://www.politicususa.com/2019/01/11/trump-winning-shutdown.html


Millions of people and their families are suffering because they aren’t getting paid during the government shutdown, but Trump refuses to open government because he thinks that he is winning.
Politico reported:
On the 20th day of the shutdown, the GOP group tried to jump start bipartisan talks before Trump declares a national emergency to get his wall. But the president rejected their idea to allow congressional committees to sort out his border wall request while the government reopened, deeming the idea likely to leave him with nothing to show for the shutdown.

Vice President Mike Pence and acting Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney had been consulting with senators about the matter on Thursday. Pence and Mulvaney took the idea to the president, who shot it down, according to multiple people directly involved in the talks. While the congressional committees could still take up Trump’s border wall plan, the president opposes the idea of opening the government before serious wall negotiations have begun, the people said. He told Senate Republicans he believes he is winning the fight and will not sign any stopgap bills at this point.
https://www.politicususa.com/2019/01/11/trump-winn... (show quote)


B,S. You call a delay in paychecks "human suffering"? How about the people that have lost loved ones because of illegal aliens disregard for our laws? THAT'S human suffering! These people won't EVER get their loved ones back. What's with "millions of people and their families" when it's about 800,000 (many of whom agree with Trump)?

Are you going for the CNN clone award?

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Jan 12, 2019 07:44:35   #
Seth
 
snowbear37 wrote:
B,S. You call a delay in paychecks "human suffering"? How about the people that have lost loved ones because of illegal aliens disregard for our laws? THAT'S human suffering! These people won't EVER get their loved ones back. What's with "millions of people and their families" when it's about 800,000 (many of whom agree with Trump)?

Are you going for the CNN clone award?


This is why I find it becoming increasingly difficult to respect today's Democrats as anything resembling human beings.

The Democrats lost their souls or something, they have no problem with Americans being raped, robbed and murdered as long as their party leaders can score cheap political points off the misery for which they are responsible.

Pelosi and Schumer wouldn't even tour the border areas like President Trump did because they couldn't care less what the situation is down there -- like with everything the Democratic Party stands for, it's all about politics and their craving for power, not about the people these fungi were elected to serve.

They and all who support them are an especially low form of vermin.

| Reply
Jan 12, 2019 09:21:25   #
markc Loc: Tennessee
 
I agree and here are some thought from a concerned engineer:

“To recap: Iʼm a licensed structural and civil engineer with a MS in structural engineering from the top program in the nation and over a decade of experience on high- performance projects, and particularly of cleaning up design disasters where the factors werenʼt properly accounted for, and Iʼm an adjunct professor of structural analysis and design at UH-Downtown. I have previously been deposed as an expert witness in matters regarding proper construction of walls and the various factors associated therein, and my testimony has passed Daubert.
Am I a wall expert? I am. I am literally a court-accepted expert on walls.
Structurally and civil engineering-wise, the border wall is not a feasible project. Trump did not hire engineers to design the thing. He solicited bids from contractors, not engineers. This means itʼs not been designed by professionals. Itʼs a disaster of numerous types waiting to happen.
What disasters?
Off the top of my head...
1) It will mess with our ability to drain land in flash flooding. Anything impeding the ability of water to get where it needs to go (doesnʼt matter if there are holes in the wall or whatever) is going to dramatically increase the risk of flooding.
2) Messes with all kind of stuff ecologically. For all other projects, we have to do an Environmental Site Assessment, which is arduous. Theyʼre either planning to circumvent all this, or they havenʼt accounted for it yet, because thatʼs part of the design process, and this thing hasnʼt been designed. 3) The prototypes they came up with are nearly impossible to build or donʼt actually do the job. This article explains more:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.engineering.com/amp /17599.html
And so on.
The estimates provided for the cost are arrived at unreasonably. You can look for yourself at the two-year-old estimate that you see everyone citing.
http://fronterasdesk.org/sites/default/files/field/docs/2016/0 7/Bernstein-%20The%20Trump%20Wall.pdf
It does not account for rework, complexities beyond the prototype design, factors to prevent flood and environmental hazard creation, engineering redesign... Itʼs going to be higher than $50bn. The contractors will hit the government with near CONSTANT change orders. “Cost overrun” will be the name of the game. It will not be completed in Trumpʼs lifetime.
Iʼm a structural forensicist, which means Iʼm called in when things go wrong. This is a project that WILL go wrong. When projects go wrong, the original estimates are just *obliterated*. And when that happens, good luck getting it fixed, because there arenʼt that many forensicists out there to right the ship, particularly not that are willing to work on a border wall project— a large quotient of us are immigrants, and besides, we canʼt afford to bid on jobs that are this political. Weʼre small firms, and weʼre already busy, and we donʼt gamble our reputations on political footballs. So youʼd end up with a revolving door of contractors making a giant, uncoordinated muddle of things, and itʼd generally be a mess. Good money after bad. The GAO agrees with me.
And it wonʼt be effective. I could, right now, purchase a 32 foot extension ladder and weld a cheap custom saddle for the top of the proposed wall so that I can get over it. I donʼt know who they talked to about the wall design and its efficacy, but it sure as heck wasnʼt anybody with any engineering imagination.
Another thing: we are not far from the day where inexpensive drones will be able to pick up and carry someone. This will happen in the next ten years, and itʼs folly to think that the coyotes who ferry people over the border wonʼt purchase or create them. Theyʼre low enough, quiet enough, and small enough to quickly zip people over any wall we could build undetected with our current monitoring setup.
Letʼs have border security, by all means, but letʼs be smart about it. This is not smart. Itʼs not effective. Itʼs NOT cheap. The returns will be diminishing as technology advances, too. This is a ridiculous idea that will never be successfully executed and, as such, would be a monumental waste of money.”

| Reply
Jan 12, 2019 09:28:27   #
Seth
 
markc wrote:
I agree and here are some thought from a concerned engineer:

“To recap: Iʼm a licensed structural and civil engineer with a MS in structural engineering from the top program in the nation and over a decade of experience on high- performance projects, and particularly of cleaning up design disasters where the factors werenʼt properly accounted for, and Iʼm an adjunct professor of structural analysis and design at UH-Downtown. I have previously been deposed as an expert witness in matters regarding proper construction of walls and the various factors associated therein, and my testimony has passed Daubert.
Am I a wall expert? I am. I am literally a court-accepted expert on walls.
Structurally and civil engineering-wise, the border wall is not a feasible project. Trump did not hire engineers to design the thing. He solicited bids from contractors, not engineers. This means itʼs not been designed by professionals. Itʼs a disaster of numerous types waiting to happen.
What disasters?
Off the top of my head...
1) It will mess with our ability to drain land in flash flooding. Anything impeding the ability of water to get where it needs to go (doesnʼt matter if there are holes in the wall or whatever) is going to dramatically increase the risk of flooding.
2) Messes with all kind of stuff ecologically. For all other projects, we have to do an Environmental Site Assessment, which is arduous. Theyʼre either planning to circumvent all this, or they havenʼt accounted for it yet, because thatʼs part of the design process, and this thing hasnʼt been designed. 3) The prototypes they came up with are nearly impossible to build or donʼt actually do the job. This article explains more:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.engineering.com/amp /17599.html
And so on.
The estimates provided for the cost are arrived at unreasonably. You can look for yourself at the two-year-old estimate that you see everyone citing.
http://fronterasdesk.org/sites/default/files/field/docs/2016/0 7/Bernstein-%20The%20Trump%20Wall.pdf
It does not account for rework, complexities beyond the prototype design, factors to prevent flood and environmental hazard creation, engineering redesign... Itʼs going to be higher than $50bn. The contractors will hit the government with near CONSTANT change orders. “Cost overrun” will be the name of the game. It will not be completed in Trumpʼs lifetime.
Iʼm a structural forensicist, which means Iʼm called in when things go wrong. This is a project that WILL go wrong. When projects go wrong, the original estimates are just *obliterated*. And when that happens, good luck getting it fixed, because there arenʼt that many forensicists out there to right the ship, particularly not that are willing to work on a border wall project— a large quotient of us are immigrants, and besides, we canʼt afford to bid on jobs that are this political. Weʼre small firms, and weʼre already busy, and we donʼt gamble our reputations on political footballs. So youʼd end up with a revolving door of contractors making a giant, uncoordinated muddle of things, and itʼd generally be a mess. Good money after bad. The GAO agrees with me.
And it wonʼt be effective. I could, right now, purchase a 32 foot extension ladder and weld a cheap custom saddle for the top of the proposed wall so that I can get over it. I donʼt know who they talked to about the wall design and its efficacy, but it sure as heck wasnʼt anybody with any engineering imagination.
Another thing: we are not far from the day where inexpensive drones will be able to pick up and carry someone. This will happen in the next ten years, and itʼs folly to think that the coyotes who ferry people over the border wonʼt purchase or create them. Theyʼre low enough, quiet enough, and small enough to quickly zip people over any wall we could build undetected with our current monitoring setup.
Letʼs have border security, by all means, but letʼs be smart about it. This is not smart. Itʼs not effective. Itʼs NOT cheap. The returns will be diminishing as technology advances, too. This is a ridiculous idea that will never be successfully executed and, as such, would be a monumental waste of money.”
I agree and here are some thought from a concerned... (show quote)


All the more reason to let the US Army Corps of Engineers have the project. If they could complete a complex job like the Panama Canal back when technology and scientific knowledge were considerably at a lower stage of development than they are today, they could probably build the wall with allowances made for intrusive "forays" into mischief by nature.

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