bahmer

Please watch the video before commenting. Thanks.

https://youtu.be/BfJ25LXtLTg

slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas

I listened to the entire video and sorry friend, but I prefer patriotism to nationalism and better than I can explain it, here is why:

Nationalism vs Patriotism https://www.differencebetween.com/difference-between-nationalism-and-vs-patriotism/

Nationalism and Patriotism are two terms that show differences between them even though both of them are concerned with individual relationships towards nations. Nationalism consists in showing interest in the unification of a nation based on cultural and linguistic equanimity. On the other hand patriotism consists in developing love for a nation based on its values and beliefs. This is the major difference between nationalism and patriotism.

Nationalism gives a feeling that one’s country is superior to another in every aspect and hence it is often described as the worst enemy of peace according to the great thinker George Orwell. On the other hand patriotism does not pave the way for enmity towards other nations but instead, strengthens the admiration towards one’s own country. There is another important difference between nationalism and patriotism. Patriotism is rooted in affection whereas nationalism is rooted in rivalry and hatred. Patriotism has peace as its substratum. In other words it can be said that patriotism works from the base of peace. On the other hand nationalism has militancy as substratum and it works from the base of enmity.

There is some difference between the two when it comes to the way in which a nationalist and a patriot think. A nationalist believes that his country is better than any other country whereas a patriot believes that his country is one of the best and that it can advance in many fields with effort and hard work.

Patriotism is thus considered a common property and is construed equally all over the world. On the other hand a nationalist considers that the people belonging to his own country alone are important. Patriotism expresses the love of an individual towards his country in a passive way. Nationalism is on the other hand aggressive in its concept.

(BTW, I did listen to the entire video above)

JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida

I believe one can be both.

bahmer

I would say that Patriotism was where we were for a good number of years here in America and it wasn't until Trump came along and reversed some trends where we were giving large sums away in our trade deals that were actually harmful for America and not beneficial. That was the reason so many companies left America was the taxes and the difference in labor rates. I believe that one can be proud of ones own county and believe that it is superior to other countries and try to help the other countries to try and succeed as opposed to giving them unfair trade deals. So I really believe that one can be both but what we have seen of Nationalism here in America it seems to be working in a positive way for both America and those that we trade with by teaching them how trade is going to work in the future. They are no longer on a free ride anymore and will have to work to get ahead. Nationalism is sort of like do not feed the animals signs one sees in the national parks. The more you feed them the more dependent the animals become on the humans for food and they lose both the desire to forage and the ability to know how to forage. We have done the same to our poor in this country. Now most of them don't know how to go to an interview and get a jjob or go to work all that they want is a handout from big brother which doesn't help them and it doesn't help this country either.

slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas

I wouldn't argue that. https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/patriotism-vs-nationalism

slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas

Ol' buddy, this could prove to be an interesting thread.

bahmer

Depending on where one is I could see either side myself.

JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida

Either extreme could be viewed negatively.

bahmer

True anything can be carried to a fault. That is true with anything in life I suppose.

dongreen76

Franklin Roosevelt tried the nationalism approach concerning our getting involved in world war ll and it was later reasoned that had he not assumed that attitude that a lot horrific atrociousities that WW2 produced such as the Holocaust,and deaths that occurred on the battlefields could have been averted.
Also,there other factors to consider ,nationalisim is not a unprecedented revolutionary social innovative concept; It has been tried throughout history.When any nation seeks seclusion from the rest of the world,it has always been inherent of mans nature to interlope for all kind of various reasons,lust for power/aggression,for land and wealth and numerous other reasons;with the idea of being independent ,a nation has to be economically self sufficient,have an abundance of natural resources so that it would never be at any other nations discretions - for OIL, or any other natural commodity;any time it would be dependent on another nation to procure said
resource it could never be totally independent.
The idea of - is the nation strong enough militarily to back up it's nationalistic approach manifest ; Hence- this manifestation brings about the idea of arms races,every body wants the ultimate weaponry of nuclear defenses,the whole world with nuclear capabilities inherently promulgates the possibility of world annihilation.

slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas

Thank you, Don, for your thoughts/input.

ACP45 Loc: Rhode Island

Key Takeaways from the video:

"A Nationalist believes the world is governed best when nations are free to chart their own independent course, cultivate their traditions, and pursuing their interests without interference. Nationalism is not about R****m, or Isolationism. It is the opposite of globalism or t***snationalism which are all names for an attempt to bring peace and prosperity to the world by uniting mankind under a single political authority."

"A lot of people still think that good borders make good neighbors"

"The key to human freedom is to build political life out of this natural loyalty - 1st Family, 2nd Community, 3rd Nation. By putting decision making into the hands of Family, Community, and the independent Nation, you could get people to co-operate with one another, join in the common defense, and willingly obey laws. The only alternative to this community and nation based politics is to use force, and to coerce obedience.

Sounds pretty good to me! If this is the definition of "Nationalism", count me in.

ACP45 Loc: Rhode Island

By the way, consider the last part of Nationalism, i.e. "By putting decision making into the hands of Family, Community, and the independent Nation, you could get people to co-operate with one another, join in the common defense, and willingly obey laws. The only alternative to this community and nation based politics is to use force, and to coerce obedience."

As a nation, how well do we co-operate with each other and willingly obey many of the laws that are being created today. Ask yourself how force and coercion is being used more and more frequently to get people to comply. Ask yourself if government surveillance, oversea wars, and a legal and judicial system that is blatantly politicized contributes to many people questioning the real meaning of "Patriotism".

JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida

Are you saying if Roosevelt hadn’t been a Nationalist the Holcaust wouldn’t have happened? Are you suggesting we shouldn’t have gotten involved in WWII?

slatten49 Loc: Lake Whitney, Texas