Dave Loc: Upstate New York

One wonders is there is any point where personal responsibiity plays into the equation -

Another point one might ponder is where does all the stuff those in poverty come from?


http://townhall.com/columnists/walterewilliams/2014/02/12/dependency-not-poverty-n1792538?utm_source=thdaily&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl

bobgssc

Poverty is a relative term. No, poor people here can't generally be compared to poor people in third world nations, but we aren't in a third world nation. When I say it's cold, I usually mean that it is approaching the point where we might find a bit of frost on the grass in the morning while someone in the north east might consider the same temperature "downright balmy". Same with poverty, it is simply a measurement by comparison. As far as where does all the stuff come from, I'm sure it's different in every case.

Dave Loc: Upstate New York

You skipped over the question of individual responsibility, I'm guessing it was on purpose.

As to the stuff, it all came from ultimately one source - the efforts of others to produce it and t***sport it to a place where those who have it can use it. Some of those producers are in 3rd world countries.

bobgssc

Not at all, I just wanted to mention that poverty was a relative term, didn't realize I needed to mention every point on the post.
I'm sure personal responsibility plays a large part to some, and a minor part to others.
Some choose to live on welfare because they are lazy, while some are in poverty due to no fault of their own (some people don't have the mental capacity to have great paying jobs, or encountered debilitating injuries for example). I'm not a trained sociologist so I really don't have all the answers to all the questions. Have a great day tho!

Dave Loc: Upstate New York

Seems perhaps you hadn't read the article written by Dr. Williams - you might want to, you may find it informative

bobgssc

Read the article, simply gave my own opinion. This is a discussion board and that's mainly what people do in discussion boards is to share their opinions on matters. If that is threatening to you somehow, I'm sorry... I didn't realize my opinion was an attack on yours.
Which of his points did you want me to comment on? I mentioned something he either left out or I missed (possible), when I said that not every person has the mental capacity to bring him/herself out of poverty. That wasn't a statement on any race, nationality nor even group, just about some individuals.

Tasine Loc: Southwest US

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In my view and to my knowledge America has no one in poverty, and if it does, that poverty is the result of decisions of the adult. The only possible helpless poverty victims are the children of ignorant parents or the mentally or physically handicapped who have relatives that don't look after their needs. And those are cases that deserve a good and hard investigation and changes made or people arrested for child endangerment.

As to the poor in our country. If they are on welfare, they are not then poor. They probably have as much of most things as they need - same as me. I'm not wealthy, don't have the money for the latest, best, most expensive "things", but I eat well, sleep under a roof, have an electric fan for summer and a wooden pellet stove for winter. I have clothes to wear. I don't do movies, don't do CD music, don't do concerts, don't do drugs, don't drink, don't smoke, don't do rallies, don't do pasture parties, NOR highbrow parties, don't do car or horse or dog races, don't gamble, don't try to outdo friends and neighbors, don't eat out a lot, don't have a huge screen TV. I am not hurting. I maintain those on welfare aren't hurting either EXCEPT via personal choices which so many seem totally incapable of making.

I was taught by my poor (financially) parents, to scorn hand-outs and to NEVER accept a handout, that there was no excuse for taking something for free without GIVING something in return - it didn't have to be a physical something. I still feel that. No one should be handed things EXPECTING it to be totally and absolutely FREE. I understand many of us could use help from time to time, and I understand a few need help all the time - I am not talking about those people. I AM talking about welfare bums. We, our government, has taught, no, PREACHED, that they are ENTITLED to the "free" stuff that others worked to provide. The Democrats try to call this "charity". This is NOT charity. This is graft and theft. I am happy to help those who need help. I am not happy to have GOVERNMENT make those decisions for me and DEMAND I contribute to a program that is managed terribly and wastefully and that contains so much fraud.

Where does poverty come from? It comes from personal decisions. And the number of people in the world today who cannot make good decisions is growing by leaps and bounds - could welfare be the cause of this dumbing down?

bobgssc

Well stated.

Tasine Loc: Southwest US

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Please note that I managed to post it before finishing it. It's now complete.
:lol:

Dave Loc: Upstate New York

What he said was how little it took to not be in poverty - and he also made a comparison of the living space here vs. several European countries - none of which are 3rd world.

Meanwhile, I have no idea on why you found my post somehow attacking your position - or as interpreting it as an attack on mine. I did find, however, it to not seem to be responsive to what was written by Dr. Williams, and I simply tried to suggest you may want to read it - and had you really read it you successfully hid that in your response.

emarine

http://billmoyers.com/2014/01/16/ten-examples-of-welfare-for-corporations-and-the-ultra-rich/
Two sides to every penny Dave....

Dave Loc: Upstate New York

Both articles have a common theme - realize it or not - that is get the government, particularly the federal government, out of much of what it is in to.

Establishment Republicans have the justified reputation of being friend of the corporations and the wealthy - unfortunately the other political partys is easily as guilty of this - masters of cronyism - but most folks don't realize it.

Further, what most folks don't realize is that both of them villify the tea party as r****ts, stupid, selfish and all the rest of it simply because they see the tea party as the only viable risk to thier hold on governmental power

Tasine Loc: Southwest US

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What it all boils down to is this: POWER is the strongest aphrodiasiac there is. Our politicians, both sides are totally under its control and they are not about to let go and do the right thing. The ONLY ones to trust are those who are new to Congress. Every year let's get newbies. They're less dangerous.

stan3186

Tasine, I agree with most everything that you post. You may not be wealthy financially by you are very rich in character and that is to be commended. If more people were to have your attitude this country would be so much better off. I enjoy your post and wish you all the best.

stan3186

You are absolutely right the ruling numbers of both parties are cut from the same cloth. All of them are power hungry and elitist whether they be Democrat or Republican. I think the Democrats (which are not really Democrats any longer but progressives) are more treacherous crooks than the Republican crooks. All of Democrats nonetheless.

You're right that the Tea Party is villainized by both Democrats and Republicans because they are a true threat with support to their it elitist status. All of the older and established politicians should be v**ed out of office And Replace with Either TEA Party Members or Young People.