The Truth That was Never Taught
Jan 22, 2017 18:03:24 #
I would like to start out by saying that I am so confused about who the true people, or tribes, of God will be? I m pron to saying it will be the Jewish, but after reading about the 12 tribe, I've come to believe it may be them...? And wasn't God described as a man with white wooly hair, and skin dark at night.... Someone please explain it to me!!!
Jan 22, 2017 18:36:37 #
Quakerwidow
Loc: Chestertown, MD
Tanya wrote:
I would like to start out by saying that I am so confused about who the true people, or tribes, of God will be? I m pron to saying it will be the Jewish, but after reading about the 12 tribe, I've come to believe it may be them...? And wasn't God described as a man with white wooly hair, and skin dark at night.... Someone please explain it to me!!!
Jesus said: by their fruit you will know them. Also: As you have done to the least of these you have done to me.
Jan 22, 2017 18:37:36 #
Tanya wrote:
I would like to start out by saying that I am so confused about who the true people, or tribes, of God will be? I m pron to saying it will be the Jewish, but after reading about the 12 tribe, I've come to believe it may be them...? And wasn't God described as a man with white wooly hair, and skin dark at night.... Someone please explain it to me!!!
Jan 22, 2017 18:52:11 #
Jan 22, 2017 21:04:58 #
Boo_Boo
Loc: Jellystone
Tanya,
Good questions.
Let me attempt to give you a response. Most people read only the New Testament and only verses, not books. Which causes a system style teaching with verses that support individual beliefs. I will not go into that in this response, but I will assure you tthat if you believe in One G*d who created all of us, from the beginning to and including now; you keep His Commandments (yes, all of them) then you are part of the chosen people. He selected you, personally.
Here is why I believe this with all my heart.
Deuteronomy 7:6 speaks of the 'chosen people'. But, back up to Deuteronomy 6:3-4 reveals it was spoken to Israel. At that time, Israel consisted of all those that came out of Egypt with Moses (see Deuteronomy 7:8). A very similar verse is Deuteronomy 14:2. In 1 Chronicles 16:13, Israel is called "His chosen ones": David wrote Psalm 33:12; 105:6, 43. And Isaiah records these words from the Lord: Isaiah 41:8-9; 43:10,20; 44:1. In Isaiah 48:12, the Lord refers to them as "My called." And Daniel calls them "His chosen people" (Daniel 11:15).
From the above, it can be seen that the phrase, "chosen people" definitely applied to Israel. But, what was the composition of Old Testament Israel? According to the Bible, Israel was made up of: 1) the descendants of Jacob (Exodus 1:1; Joshua 13:6, etc.), and, 2) those who joined Israel through circumcision and keeping the law (Exodus 12:48).
Keeping the covenant was a requirement for all those who wished to remain a part of Israel (Genesis 17:14, Exodus 12:15,19; 30:32,38; 31:14; Leviticus 7:20-21, 25,27; 17:4,9-10, 14; 18:29; 19:8; and Numbers 15:30-31). These Scriptures, and many others, show that membership in the nation of Israel was dependent on obedience to G*d's commandments. To disobey G*d was to lose one's citizenship.
When most people think of Old Testament Israel, they think exclusively in terms of Israel as a nation. Yet, this is not the true Biblical meaning of "Israel". The name "Israel" has always had a twofold significance: one national, and the other religious. For example Exodus 19:6 and Amos 9:11-12 proclaims that the remnant of Israel would be largely an entity of religious instead of national destination. Isaiah says much the same thing (Isaiah 56:7-8).
The primary meaning of "Israel" in the Old Testament stands for the religious covenant community, the people who worship G*d in truth and Spirit. Secondarily, it denotes a distinct ethnic group or nation which is called to become spiritual Israel. Decisive for the Old Testament prophets and their prophecies is the theological quality of the 'people of G*d,' not their ethnic and political characteristics.
The second part of your question, the physical description of Jesus. First, there were no drawing or portraits of him and nothing in the New Testament give a description. But, there are hints. He was from the line of David, and David was a ginger or so it is implied Genies. 25:25; 1 Samuel. 16:12, 17:42. But, science teaches us that red hair is a recessive gene. Mary was a decedent from David, but that only supplies on set of genes... was that enough to produce a ginger haired child. Who knows, but there is further evidence that Jesus was light skinned, light hair, and blue eyes (not uncommon in Jewish people). Especially those along trade routes and Galilee was along a trade line.
A description of Jesus is found in "The Archko Volume" chapter entitled "Gamaliel's Interview" it states concerning Jesus:
"I asked him to describe this person to me, so that I might know him if I should meet him. He said: 'If you ever meet him you will know him. While he is nothing but a man, there is something about him that distinguishes him from every other man. He is the picture of his mother, only he has not her smooth, round face. His hair is a little more golden than hers, though it is as much from sunburn as anything else. He is tall, and his shoulders are a little drooped; his visage is thin and of a swarthy complexion, though this is from exposure. His eyes are large and a soft blue, and rather dull and heavy....' This Jew (Judahite) is convinced that he is the Messiah of the world. ...this was the same person that was born of the virgin in Bethlehem some twenty-six years before..."
This is a reprinting of a letter from Pontius Pilate to Tiberius Caesar describing the physical appearance of Jesus. Copies are in the Congressional Library in Washington, D.C.
TO TIBERIUS CAESAR:
"A young man appeared in Galilee preaching with humble unction, a new law in the Name of the God that had sent Him. At first I was apprehensive that His design was to stir up the people against the Romans, but my fears were soon dispelled. Jesus of Nazareth spoke rather as a friend of the Romans than of the Jews. One day I observed in the midst of a group of people a young man who was leaning against a tree, calmly addressing the multitude. I was told it was Jesus. This I could easily have suspected so great was the difference between Him and those who were listening to Him. His golden colored hair and beard gave to his appearance a celestial aspect. He appeared to be about 30 years of age. Never have I seen a sweeter or more serene countenance. What a contrast between Him and His bearers with their black beards and tawny complexions! Unwilling to interrupt Him by my presence, I continued my walk but signified to my secretary to join the group and listen. Later, my secretary reported that never had he seen in the works of all the philosophers anything that compared to the teachings of Jesus. He told me that Jesus was neither seditious nor rebellious, so we extended to Him our protection. He was at liberty to act, to speak, to assemble and to address the people. This unlimited freedom provoked the Jews -- not the poor but the rich and powerful.
Later, I wrote to Jesus requesting an interview with Him at the Praetorium. He came. When the Nazarene made His appearance I was having my morning walk and as I faced Him my feet seemed fastened with an iron hand to the marble pavement and I trembled in every limb as a guilty culprit, though he was calm. For some time I stood admiring this extraordinary Man. There was nothing in Him that was repelling, nor in His character, yet I felt awed in His presence. I told Him that there was a magnetic simplicity about Him and His personality that elevated Him far above the philosophers and teachers of His day.
Now, Noble Sovereign, these are the facts concerning Jesus of Nazareth and I have taken the time to write you in detail concerning these matters. I say that such a man who could convert water into wine, change death into life, disease into health; calm the stormy seas, is not guilty of any criminal offense and as others have said, we must agree -- truly this is the Son of God!
Your most obedient servant,
Pontius Pilate
The following description of Jesus Christ was written by Publius Lentrelus, a resident of Judea in the reign of Tiberius Caesar. It first appeared in the writings of Saint Anselm of Canterbury, 11th century:
There lives at this time in Judea a man of singular virtue whose name is Jesus Christ, whom the barbarians esteem as a prophet, but his followers love and adore him as the offspring of the immortal God.
He calls back the dead from the graves and heals all sorts of diseases with a word or touch. He is a tall man, well-shaped, and of an amiable and reverend aspect; his hair of a color that can hardly be matched, falling into graceful curls, waving about and very agreeable crouching upon his shoulders, parted on the crown of the head, running as a stream to the front after fashion of the Nazarites. His forehead high, large and imposing; hs cheeks without spot or wrinkle, beautiful with a lovely red; his nose and mouth formed with exquisite symmetry; his beard, and of a color suitable to his hair, reaching below his chin and parted in the middle like a fork; his eyes bright blue, clear and serene. Look innocent, dignified, manly and mature. In proportion of body most perfect, and captivating; his arms and hands delectable to behold.
He rebukes with majesty, councils with mildness, His whole address whether in word or deed, being eloquent and grave. No man has seen him laugh, yet his manners are exceedingly pleasant, but he has wept frequently in the presence of men. He is temporate, modest and wise. A man for his extraordinary beauty and perfection, surpassing the children of men in every sense.”
Is this proof positive of his appearance, no. But, it is the best information we have.
G*d, according to the Bible is not of form, so when He appeared to His servants He took on any form that pleased Him at the moment.... but none has seen his face, see Exodus 33.
Good questions.
Let me attempt to give you a response. Most people read only the New Testament and only verses, not books. Which causes a system style teaching with verses that support individual beliefs. I will not go into that in this response, but I will assure you tthat if you believe in One G*d who created all of us, from the beginning to and including now; you keep His Commandments (yes, all of them) then you are part of the chosen people. He selected you, personally.
Here is why I believe this with all my heart.
Deuteronomy 7:6 speaks of the 'chosen people'. But, back up to Deuteronomy 6:3-4 reveals it was spoken to Israel. At that time, Israel consisted of all those that came out of Egypt with Moses (see Deuteronomy 7:8). A very similar verse is Deuteronomy 14:2. In 1 Chronicles 16:13, Israel is called "His chosen ones": David wrote Psalm 33:12; 105:6, 43. And Isaiah records these words from the Lord: Isaiah 41:8-9; 43:10,20; 44:1. In Isaiah 48:12, the Lord refers to them as "My called." And Daniel calls them "His chosen people" (Daniel 11:15).
From the above, it can be seen that the phrase, "chosen people" definitely applied to Israel. But, what was the composition of Old Testament Israel? According to the Bible, Israel was made up of: 1) the descendants of Jacob (Exodus 1:1; Joshua 13:6, etc.), and, 2) those who joined Israel through circumcision and keeping the law (Exodus 12:48).
Keeping the covenant was a requirement for all those who wished to remain a part of Israel (Genesis 17:14, Exodus 12:15,19; 30:32,38; 31:14; Leviticus 7:20-21, 25,27; 17:4,9-10, 14; 18:29; 19:8; and Numbers 15:30-31). These Scriptures, and many others, show that membership in the nation of Israel was dependent on obedience to G*d's commandments. To disobey G*d was to lose one's citizenship.
When most people think of Old Testament Israel, they think exclusively in terms of Israel as a nation. Yet, this is not the true Biblical meaning of "Israel". The name "Israel" has always had a twofold significance: one national, and the other religious. For example Exodus 19:6 and Amos 9:11-12 proclaims that the remnant of Israel would be largely an entity of religious instead of national destination. Isaiah says much the same thing (Isaiah 56:7-8).
The primary meaning of "Israel" in the Old Testament stands for the religious covenant community, the people who worship G*d in truth and Spirit. Secondarily, it denotes a distinct ethnic group or nation which is called to become spiritual Israel. Decisive for the Old Testament prophets and their prophecies is the theological quality of the 'people of G*d,' not their ethnic and political characteristics.
The second part of your question, the physical description of Jesus. First, there were no drawing or portraits of him and nothing in the New Testament give a description. But, there are hints. He was from the line of David, and David was a ginger or so it is implied Genies. 25:25; 1 Samuel. 16:12, 17:42. But, science teaches us that red hair is a recessive gene. Mary was a decedent from David, but that only supplies on set of genes... was that enough to produce a ginger haired child. Who knows, but there is further evidence that Jesus was light skinned, light hair, and blue eyes (not uncommon in Jewish people). Especially those along trade routes and Galilee was along a trade line.
A description of Jesus is found in "The Archko Volume" chapter entitled "Gamaliel's Interview" it states concerning Jesus:
"I asked him to describe this person to me, so that I might know him if I should meet him. He said: 'If you ever meet him you will know him. While he is nothing but a man, there is something about him that distinguishes him from every other man. He is the picture of his mother, only he has not her smooth, round face. His hair is a little more golden than hers, though it is as much from sunburn as anything else. He is tall, and his shoulders are a little drooped; his visage is thin and of a swarthy complexion, though this is from exposure. His eyes are large and a soft blue, and rather dull and heavy....' This Jew (Judahite) is convinced that he is the Messiah of the world. ...this was the same person that was born of the virgin in Bethlehem some twenty-six years before..."
This is a reprinting of a letter from Pontius Pilate to Tiberius Caesar describing the physical appearance of Jesus. Copies are in the Congressional Library in Washington, D.C.
TO TIBERIUS CAESAR:
"A young man appeared in Galilee preaching with humble unction, a new law in the Name of the God that had sent Him. At first I was apprehensive that His design was to stir up the people against the Romans, but my fears were soon dispelled. Jesus of Nazareth spoke rather as a friend of the Romans than of the Jews. One day I observed in the midst of a group of people a young man who was leaning against a tree, calmly addressing the multitude. I was told it was Jesus. This I could easily have suspected so great was the difference between Him and those who were listening to Him. His golden colored hair and beard gave to his appearance a celestial aspect. He appeared to be about 30 years of age. Never have I seen a sweeter or more serene countenance. What a contrast between Him and His bearers with their black beards and tawny complexions! Unwilling to interrupt Him by my presence, I continued my walk but signified to my secretary to join the group and listen. Later, my secretary reported that never had he seen in the works of all the philosophers anything that compared to the teachings of Jesus. He told me that Jesus was neither seditious nor rebellious, so we extended to Him our protection. He was at liberty to act, to speak, to assemble and to address the people. This unlimited freedom provoked the Jews -- not the poor but the rich and powerful.
Later, I wrote to Jesus requesting an interview with Him at the Praetorium. He came. When the Nazarene made His appearance I was having my morning walk and as I faced Him my feet seemed fastened with an iron hand to the marble pavement and I trembled in every limb as a guilty culprit, though he was calm. For some time I stood admiring this extraordinary Man. There was nothing in Him that was repelling, nor in His character, yet I felt awed in His presence. I told Him that there was a magnetic simplicity about Him and His personality that elevated Him far above the philosophers and teachers of His day.
Now, Noble Sovereign, these are the facts concerning Jesus of Nazareth and I have taken the time to write you in detail concerning these matters. I say that such a man who could convert water into wine, change death into life, disease into health; calm the stormy seas, is not guilty of any criminal offense and as others have said, we must agree -- truly this is the Son of God!
Your most obedient servant,
Pontius Pilate
The following description of Jesus Christ was written by Publius Lentrelus, a resident of Judea in the reign of Tiberius Caesar. It first appeared in the writings of Saint Anselm of Canterbury, 11th century:
There lives at this time in Judea a man of singular virtue whose name is Jesus Christ, whom the barbarians esteem as a prophet, but his followers love and adore him as the offspring of the immortal God.
He calls back the dead from the graves and heals all sorts of diseases with a word or touch. He is a tall man, well-shaped, and of an amiable and reverend aspect; his hair of a color that can hardly be matched, falling into graceful curls, waving about and very agreeable crouching upon his shoulders, parted on the crown of the head, running as a stream to the front after fashion of the Nazarites. His forehead high, large and imposing; hs cheeks without spot or wrinkle, beautiful with a lovely red; his nose and mouth formed with exquisite symmetry; his beard, and of a color suitable to his hair, reaching below his chin and parted in the middle like a fork; his eyes bright blue, clear and serene. Look innocent, dignified, manly and mature. In proportion of body most perfect, and captivating; his arms and hands delectable to behold.
He rebukes with majesty, councils with mildness, His whole address whether in word or deed, being eloquent and grave. No man has seen him laugh, yet his manners are exceedingly pleasant, but he has wept frequently in the presence of men. He is temporate, modest and wise. A man for his extraordinary beauty and perfection, surpassing the children of men in every sense.”
Is this proof positive of his appearance, no. But, it is the best information we have.
G*d, according to the Bible is not of form, so when He appeared to His servants He took on any form that pleased Him at the moment.... but none has seen his face, see Exodus 33.
Tanya wrote:
I would like to start out by saying that I am so confused about who the true people, or tribes, of God will be? I m pron to saying it will be the Jewish, but after reading about the 12 tribe, I've come to believe it may be them...? And wasn't God described as a man with white wooly hair, and skin dark at night.... Someone please explain it to me!!!
Jan 23, 2017 00:11:26 #
Thank you Pennylynn, yes you helped me out a lot. I know that to be one of Gods chosen, we have to honor and obey his Commands in all things. By that I mean in everything we do and say, so when we seek HIM and have questions about his Commands or about something else,is it a sin?? I know we are not to question his words or works, but if we humbly ask him is that also a sin!!
I have been given some information from a questionable affiliate program and it has said that the only ones God will choose will be of the 12 Tribes. I am one that doesn't just go by what is said, I need back up information. So I've been reading and writing things down to prove or disprove what their teaching. Can you explain why the 12Tribes are assumed to be the chosen people??
I have been given some information from a questionable affiliate program and it has said that the only ones God will choose will be of the 12 Tribes. I am one that doesn't just go by what is said, I need back up information. So I've been reading and writing things down to prove or disprove what their teaching. Can you explain why the 12Tribes are assumed to be the chosen people??
Jan 23, 2017 01:06:26 #
Boo_Boo
Loc: Jellystone
You present excellent questions, and I thank you! If you have questions, anything you do not understand whether it be a law or just uncertainty, it is both proper and necessary to ask for G*d's guidance. If you ask the questions, not out of arrogance or mistrust. Is it not written that Abraham quested “Shall the Judge of all the earth not do justice?” “Why, Lord, why have you brought trouble on this people?” asked Moses. “Why does the way of the wicked prosper? Why do all the faithless live at ease?” asked Jeremiah. The book of Job is largely constructed out of questions, and G*d’s answer consists of four chapters of yet deeper questions: “Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? … Can you catch Leviathan with a hook? … Will it make an agreement with you and let you take it as your slave for life?” These are only examples, and at no time did G*d become impatient or tell them it is sinful. Indeed, He showed not only mercy but responses to each. As for sins, look no further than His teaching, what does He command you not to do.... those are sins. Now that gives you a breath of clear air, if you don't do what He said is sinful, then you do not need to go through life worrying that you have offended. He gave the 'rules' one time, He did not add to them nor did He remove any. I will not tell you that you will remember all the rules, until you grow in his love and follow your heart (He is always there giving you nudges). If you make a mistake, not all is lost for there are only a very few laws given by our Father that puts you outside of the Chosen. As soon as you recognize the error, ask Him with expectation of His forgiveness and then you will have learned.
The 12 tribes... again, a great question. Who are they, how did they get their names and why are they important. Genesis 49 list the tribes: Reuben; Simeon; Levi (this priestly tribe did not receive a territory, and sometimes is not listed when the tribe of Joseph is listed as two separate tribes); Judah; Zebulun; Issachar; Dan; Gad; Asher; Naphtali; Joseph (often listed as two tribes named for his sons, Ephraim and Manasseh); Benjamin. There are important things to remember, the 12 tribes was the fulfillemnt of a promise G*d made to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. G*d promised Abraham that his descendants would be numerous (Genesis 13:16; 17:2; 22:17) and that his descendants would eventually constitute “many nations” (Genesis 17:4-5). He also promised Abraham that his descendants would “possess the gate of their enemies” (Genesis 22:17) and be “blessed” mightily by G*d (Genesis 22:16-18). G*d also said that his descendants would be identified throughout history by the name of Abraham’s son, “Isaac” (Genesis 21:12).
The blessings given to Abraham and Isaac were called the “birthright” blessings because they were passed on to successive generations as a right of their birth… The “birthright” blessings given to Abraham were passed on to Isaac, who married Rebekah.
The blessing of numerous descendants who would possess the gates of their enemies was a continuation of the blessing G*d had promised Abraham that He would fulfill in Isaac (Genesis 17:17-19, 21).
It’s important to note here that… Abraham had a previous son, Ishmael, by Hagar, and Ishmael’s descendants were also prophesied to become numerous and constitute a “great nation” that would feature “twelve princes” (Genesis 17: 20). The “great nation” of Ishmael’s descendants today is the Arab world. But, Ishmael was not G*d’s promised son to Abraham and from whom the twelve tribes of Israel would come.
Now fast forward, Egypt happened (if you are interested, I will fill in this area) and so the "children" departed Egypt. When they departed, many people who were not Hebrews also left with them. Of the Hebrews, the number was 600,000 men of course some had wives and children. The number of non-Hebrews is not specific in the Bible. It is during the 42 years after leaving Egypt that G*d encouraged His children to not only accept those traveling with them and care for them, He also said that anyone who converted, as we discussed last time, will be a part of the nation.... no class, color, or financial considerations, it was across the board as in all and any. Those that did not convert, they were cared for (fed, clothed, and treated as a creation of G*d, but there were rules about marriage, cohabitation, lending money and so on... see Leviticus).
Now it gets a little complicated. When the 12 tribes of Israel entered the Promised Land, they eventually formed the nation of Israel under King David and Solomon. Soon after Solomon’s death, this empire was torn apart by a civil war. The northern 10 tribes formed the kingdom of Israel, while the southern two tribes, Judah and Benjamin (joined by the priestly tribe of Levi), formed the southern kingdom of Judah. The northern kingdom of Israel was called “Israel” because it was led by the tribes of Ephraim and Manasseh who bore the name of “Israel” (Genesis 48:16). The southern kingdom was led by the tribe of Judah.
The northern kingdom of Israel went into captivity in 722 B.C. because of sin and rebellion toward G*d. Judah was taken into captivity by the Babylonians between 604 and 586 B.C. Just before the fall of Israel, the prophet Amos noted that the northern 10 tribes were known by the name “house of Isaac” (Amos 7:16) just as the prophecies of Genesis 21:12 and 48:16 had predicted.
I will go more into this later, I want to make sure that my memory is not faulty and I am not misleading or telling an unintentional lie. I promise I will finish this tomorrow.
The 12 tribes... again, a great question. Who are they, how did they get their names and why are they important. Genesis 49 list the tribes: Reuben; Simeon; Levi (this priestly tribe did not receive a territory, and sometimes is not listed when the tribe of Joseph is listed as two separate tribes); Judah; Zebulun; Issachar; Dan; Gad; Asher; Naphtali; Joseph (often listed as two tribes named for his sons, Ephraim and Manasseh); Benjamin. There are important things to remember, the 12 tribes was the fulfillemnt of a promise G*d made to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. G*d promised Abraham that his descendants would be numerous (Genesis 13:16; 17:2; 22:17) and that his descendants would eventually constitute “many nations” (Genesis 17:4-5). He also promised Abraham that his descendants would “possess the gate of their enemies” (Genesis 22:17) and be “blessed” mightily by G*d (Genesis 22:16-18). G*d also said that his descendants would be identified throughout history by the name of Abraham’s son, “Isaac” (Genesis 21:12).
The blessings given to Abraham and Isaac were called the “birthright” blessings because they were passed on to successive generations as a right of their birth… The “birthright” blessings given to Abraham were passed on to Isaac, who married Rebekah.
The blessing of numerous descendants who would possess the gates of their enemies was a continuation of the blessing G*d had promised Abraham that He would fulfill in Isaac (Genesis 17:17-19, 21).
It’s important to note here that… Abraham had a previous son, Ishmael, by Hagar, and Ishmael’s descendants were also prophesied to become numerous and constitute a “great nation” that would feature “twelve princes” (Genesis 17: 20). The “great nation” of Ishmael’s descendants today is the Arab world. But, Ishmael was not G*d’s promised son to Abraham and from whom the twelve tribes of Israel would come.
Now fast forward, Egypt happened (if you are interested, I will fill in this area) and so the "children" departed Egypt. When they departed, many people who were not Hebrews also left with them. Of the Hebrews, the number was 600,000 men of course some had wives and children. The number of non-Hebrews is not specific in the Bible. It is during the 42 years after leaving Egypt that G*d encouraged His children to not only accept those traveling with them and care for them, He also said that anyone who converted, as we discussed last time, will be a part of the nation.... no class, color, or financial considerations, it was across the board as in all and any. Those that did not convert, they were cared for (fed, clothed, and treated as a creation of G*d, but there were rules about marriage, cohabitation, lending money and so on... see Leviticus).
Now it gets a little complicated. When the 12 tribes of Israel entered the Promised Land, they eventually formed the nation of Israel under King David and Solomon. Soon after Solomon’s death, this empire was torn apart by a civil war. The northern 10 tribes formed the kingdom of Israel, while the southern two tribes, Judah and Benjamin (joined by the priestly tribe of Levi), formed the southern kingdom of Judah. The northern kingdom of Israel was called “Israel” because it was led by the tribes of Ephraim and Manasseh who bore the name of “Israel” (Genesis 48:16). The southern kingdom was led by the tribe of Judah.
The northern kingdom of Israel went into captivity in 722 B.C. because of sin and rebellion toward G*d. Judah was taken into captivity by the Babylonians between 604 and 586 B.C. Just before the fall of Israel, the prophet Amos noted that the northern 10 tribes were known by the name “house of Isaac” (Amos 7:16) just as the prophecies of Genesis 21:12 and 48:16 had predicted.
I will go more into this later, I want to make sure that my memory is not faulty and I am not misleading or telling an unintentional lie. I promise I will finish this tomorrow.
Tanya wrote:
Thank you Pennylynn, yes you helped me out a lot. ... (show quote)
Jan 23, 2017 08:07:28 #
Boo_Boo
Loc: Jellystone
I am sorry for cutting off my response last evening, but I needed to make sure I had the fact correct.
So, here is the rest of my response (I bet you are now sorry you asked).
The Blessings and Cursing of Deuteronomy… The Mountain of Blessing: “These shall stand on Mount Gerizim to bless the people when you have come over Jordan: Simeon, and Levi, and Judah, and Issachar, and Joseph, and Benjamin.” Deuteronomy 27:12
The Mountain of Cursing: “And these shall stand on Mount Ebal to curse: Reuben, Gad, and Asher, and Zebulun, Dan, and Naphtali.” Deuteronomy 27:13
Beginning in 721 BC, the Assyrian king Shalmaneser besieged Israel’s capital, Samaria, and it fell three years later (2 Kings 18:9-12). This event fulfilled Isaiah’s prophecy that G*d would use Assyria as the “rod of His anger” (Isaiah 10:5-19); that is, the Assyrian Empire was implementing G*d’s judgment against the idolatrous Israelites. The sovereign G*d takes full credit as the source of Assyria’s authority (compare Isaiah 7:18; 8:7; 9:11; and Daniel 4:17). Secular history records that in 703 BC Assyria under King Sennacherib suppressed a major Chaldean challenge.
In the fourteenth year of Hezekiah’s reign, in 701 BC, the Assyrians under Sennacherib took 46 of Judah’s fortified cities (Isaiah 36:1). Then they laid siege to Jerusalem—the Assyrian king engraved upon his stele that he had the king of Judah caught like a caged bird in his own country.
However, even though Sennacherib’s army occupied Judah up to the very doorstep of Jerusalem, and even though Sennacherib’s emissary Rabshakeh boasted against G*d and Hezekiah (Isaiah 36:4-21), Assyria was rebuffed. Hezekiah prayed, and G*d promised that the Assyrians would never set foot inside the city (Isaiah 37:33). G*d slew 185,000 Assyrian forces in one night (Isaiah 37:36), and Sennacherib returned to Nineveh where he was slain by his own sons as he worshiped his G*d Nisroch (Isaiah 37:38).
In 612 BC, Nineveh was besieged by an alliance of the Medes, Babylonians and Scythians, and the city was so completely destroyed that even its location was forgotten until British archeologist Sir Austen Layard began uncovering it in the nineteenth century. Thus, as the Babylonian Empire ascended, Assyria dropped off the pages of history. Along with them, so the ten tribes fall out of biblical history.
History tells us some interesting facts. First the conquered people were spread out in their empire to prevent them from forming groups and resisting their captivity. So, where did they put the tribes… North Africa, specifically Ethiopia became home to a mixed group of Hebrews. We know this through breakthroughs in DNA. Those Jews were saved by Israel and brought home. They maintained their faith and worship, even at the threat of death. They were also dispersed as far North and East as India, and those Jews are now migrating to Israel. This leaves the question of the European Jew, or the Ashkenazi Jew. DNA does trace them back to a bottleneck of about 350 people originating from Lavent (the name given to Israel, Iraq, Syria, Jordan and Lebanon which also includes the new state of Palestine). They spread from what is now Russia. The joke is, all Ashkenazi Jews are “a 30th cousin.”
So, we have bible prophecy being fulfilled that G*d would use His hand to return the Hebrews to the Promised Land. From Northeast Africa, India, and Europe…. Where are the others? But, G*d said the Hebrew would also be displaced to “islands.” To this, I do not know, in His time He will make them known and return them.
Now you know who the tribes are, but for what purpose did G*d select this group of people and will they be the only ones that G*d “saves?” The purpose of this small group of people is clearly stated in the Bible, they are to be “the light to the nations.” What that means, to bring mankind into the knowledge of G*d, His will and His Commandments. Being a light does not imply recruitment, but living by the laws is an example to follow. "Obey my voice, and I will be your G*d, and you shall be my people; and walk in all the way that I command you, that it may be well with you." Jer. 7:23. "I am the Lord, I have called you in righteousness, I have taken you by the hand and kept you; I have given you as a covenant to the people, a light to the nations, to open the eyes that are blind." Isaiah 42: 6-7. According to the teachings of the prophets, Amos, Hosea and Isaiah, being chosen by G*d no longer meant privilege but responsibility.
But, what about this relationship with G*d, it is quite simple… Israel (the Hebrews regardless of where they are) are servants of G*d, not an elite position or raised above everyone else, but a “tool” used by our Father to show the way to living for the pleasure of G*d, at His will. Does this mean to be “saved” does one need to convert? That is a touchy question for most Christians. Jesus says yes, however Paul aka Saul says absolutely no because what came before Jesus does not matter. Per him, all the Laws were eliminated and only a few remain applicable to the gentile. And this the question you posed, will the “saved” be part of the 12 tribes. And I have gone the long way around to respond. It depends on if you are a Pauline Christian. In Romans 3, 29 and 30 he says “Is G*d the G*d of Jews only? Is He not the G*d of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is One G*d, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.…” Therefore, he teaches that the tribes of Israel and their obligation ended with Jesus. However, Jesus quoted Isiah 55 “Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; let him return to the LORD, and He will have mercy on him; and to our G*d, for He will abundantly pardon.” See Luke 13:3: “I tell you … unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.” So, Jesus says repent and return to G*d, and that means following the laws given by Him. In a sense, you become Jewish.
Now then, I will leave it to you. Religion is very personal. Certainly, being a Pauline Christian is much easier than converting to the rigors of the Jewish faith. I am not saying that one must convert in fact, if you are comfortable in your knowledge or certainty of heaven, then why would you want to become a Jew? The New Testament, which is mostly the doctrine of Paul/Saul who writes that he was ordained by Jesus to spread the world to the gentile says it is unnecessary. In fact, he condemns the Jews saying that they had fallen from favor and until they convert to Christianity, they are all doomed. For this, see Romans…. The entire book, it is replete with his judgment of the wayward Jew.
So, here is the rest of my response (I bet you are now sorry you asked).
The Blessings and Cursing of Deuteronomy… The Mountain of Blessing: “These shall stand on Mount Gerizim to bless the people when you have come over Jordan: Simeon, and Levi, and Judah, and Issachar, and Joseph, and Benjamin.” Deuteronomy 27:12
The Mountain of Cursing: “And these shall stand on Mount Ebal to curse: Reuben, Gad, and Asher, and Zebulun, Dan, and Naphtali.” Deuteronomy 27:13
Beginning in 721 BC, the Assyrian king Shalmaneser besieged Israel’s capital, Samaria, and it fell three years later (2 Kings 18:9-12). This event fulfilled Isaiah’s prophecy that G*d would use Assyria as the “rod of His anger” (Isaiah 10:5-19); that is, the Assyrian Empire was implementing G*d’s judgment against the idolatrous Israelites. The sovereign G*d takes full credit as the source of Assyria’s authority (compare Isaiah 7:18; 8:7; 9:11; and Daniel 4:17). Secular history records that in 703 BC Assyria under King Sennacherib suppressed a major Chaldean challenge.
In the fourteenth year of Hezekiah’s reign, in 701 BC, the Assyrians under Sennacherib took 46 of Judah’s fortified cities (Isaiah 36:1). Then they laid siege to Jerusalem—the Assyrian king engraved upon his stele that he had the king of Judah caught like a caged bird in his own country.
However, even though Sennacherib’s army occupied Judah up to the very doorstep of Jerusalem, and even though Sennacherib’s emissary Rabshakeh boasted against G*d and Hezekiah (Isaiah 36:4-21), Assyria was rebuffed. Hezekiah prayed, and G*d promised that the Assyrians would never set foot inside the city (Isaiah 37:33). G*d slew 185,000 Assyrian forces in one night (Isaiah 37:36), and Sennacherib returned to Nineveh where he was slain by his own sons as he worshiped his G*d Nisroch (Isaiah 37:38).
In 612 BC, Nineveh was besieged by an alliance of the Medes, Babylonians and Scythians, and the city was so completely destroyed that even its location was forgotten until British archeologist Sir Austen Layard began uncovering it in the nineteenth century. Thus, as the Babylonian Empire ascended, Assyria dropped off the pages of history. Along with them, so the ten tribes fall out of biblical history.
History tells us some interesting facts. First the conquered people were spread out in their empire to prevent them from forming groups and resisting their captivity. So, where did they put the tribes… North Africa, specifically Ethiopia became home to a mixed group of Hebrews. We know this through breakthroughs in DNA. Those Jews were saved by Israel and brought home. They maintained their faith and worship, even at the threat of death. They were also dispersed as far North and East as India, and those Jews are now migrating to Israel. This leaves the question of the European Jew, or the Ashkenazi Jew. DNA does trace them back to a bottleneck of about 350 people originating from Lavent (the name given to Israel, Iraq, Syria, Jordan and Lebanon which also includes the new state of Palestine). They spread from what is now Russia. The joke is, all Ashkenazi Jews are “a 30th cousin.”
So, we have bible prophecy being fulfilled that G*d would use His hand to return the Hebrews to the Promised Land. From Northeast Africa, India, and Europe…. Where are the others? But, G*d said the Hebrew would also be displaced to “islands.” To this, I do not know, in His time He will make them known and return them.
Now you know who the tribes are, but for what purpose did G*d select this group of people and will they be the only ones that G*d “saves?” The purpose of this small group of people is clearly stated in the Bible, they are to be “the light to the nations.” What that means, to bring mankind into the knowledge of G*d, His will and His Commandments. Being a light does not imply recruitment, but living by the laws is an example to follow. "Obey my voice, and I will be your G*d, and you shall be my people; and walk in all the way that I command you, that it may be well with you." Jer. 7:23. "I am the Lord, I have called you in righteousness, I have taken you by the hand and kept you; I have given you as a covenant to the people, a light to the nations, to open the eyes that are blind." Isaiah 42: 6-7. According to the teachings of the prophets, Amos, Hosea and Isaiah, being chosen by G*d no longer meant privilege but responsibility.
But, what about this relationship with G*d, it is quite simple… Israel (the Hebrews regardless of where they are) are servants of G*d, not an elite position or raised above everyone else, but a “tool” used by our Father to show the way to living for the pleasure of G*d, at His will. Does this mean to be “saved” does one need to convert? That is a touchy question for most Christians. Jesus says yes, however Paul aka Saul says absolutely no because what came before Jesus does not matter. Per him, all the Laws were eliminated and only a few remain applicable to the gentile. And this the question you posed, will the “saved” be part of the 12 tribes. And I have gone the long way around to respond. It depends on if you are a Pauline Christian. In Romans 3, 29 and 30 he says “Is G*d the G*d of Jews only? Is He not the G*d of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is One G*d, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.…” Therefore, he teaches that the tribes of Israel and their obligation ended with Jesus. However, Jesus quoted Isiah 55 “Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; let him return to the LORD, and He will have mercy on him; and to our G*d, for He will abundantly pardon.” See Luke 13:3: “I tell you … unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.” So, Jesus says repent and return to G*d, and that means following the laws given by Him. In a sense, you become Jewish.
Now then, I will leave it to you. Religion is very personal. Certainly, being a Pauline Christian is much easier than converting to the rigors of the Jewish faith. I am not saying that one must convert in fact, if you are comfortable in your knowledge or certainty of heaven, then why would you want to become a Jew? The New Testament, which is mostly the doctrine of Paul/Saul who writes that he was ordained by Jesus to spread the world to the gentile says it is unnecessary. In fact, he condemns the Jews saying that they had fallen from favor and until they convert to Christianity, they are all doomed. For this, see Romans…. The entire book, it is replete with his judgment of the wayward Jew.
Jan 23, 2017 14:10:24 #
Thank you Pennylynn, I have always had a faithful and loyal relationship with G#d. But over the last couple of years I strayed away because of the Propaganda that has become more prevalent among the different races. It wasn't that I was looking for ways to dishonor his Works or Words, I was seeking enlightenment about life in general.
I had a very harsh life lesson in 2005, my dad was diagnosed with Oat Cell Cancer in July, by August he passed, he was my daily reminder that Gods Love was stronger than his illness. Then 11mths later my Sister who was an amazing Sister, Aunt, Daughter passed away right before my eyes. She never strayed from Gods Words. The day she passed, we had a very unique conversation about Faith and never forgetting to have it..
I have since lost my. Mom. We were never really as close as some, but I learned to leave her disdain for LIFE to her and prayed for God to show Mercy on the way she became.
Now I seek out the answers to Gods Works. I'm not a person of no morals,or understanding, I am a conisuer of his Words. The more I read, I want to know more. So, when I'm presented with the Propaganda of certain secular Faiths, I want to know beyond a reasonable doubt that what I know and live by is Gods. So the reason I keep bringing up the 12 Tribes is because my. Husband was approached and given a Propaganda tool that didn't set well with MY knowledge of the Bible. So, I have been seeking out the TRUTH of GODS Words.
I'm am very Proud that we have had this conversation about Faith and never forgetting to have it. By his Works we are Healed... Thank you Pennylynn,
Tanya
I had a very harsh life lesson in 2005, my dad was diagnosed with Oat Cell Cancer in July, by August he passed, he was my daily reminder that Gods Love was stronger than his illness. Then 11mths later my Sister who was an amazing Sister, Aunt, Daughter passed away right before my eyes. She never strayed from Gods Words. The day she passed, we had a very unique conversation about Faith and never forgetting to have it..
I have since lost my. Mom. We were never really as close as some, but I learned to leave her disdain for LIFE to her and prayed for God to show Mercy on the way she became.
Now I seek out the answers to Gods Works. I'm not a person of no morals,or understanding, I am a conisuer of his Words. The more I read, I want to know more. So, when I'm presented with the Propaganda of certain secular Faiths, I want to know beyond a reasonable doubt that what I know and live by is Gods. So the reason I keep bringing up the 12 Tribes is because my. Husband was approached and given a Propaganda tool that didn't set well with MY knowledge of the Bible. So, I have been seeking out the TRUTH of GODS Words.
I'm am very Proud that we have had this conversation about Faith and never forgetting to have it. By his Works we are Healed... Thank you Pennylynn,
Tanya
Jan 23, 2017 17:21:39 #
Boo_Boo
Loc: Jellystone
Tanya,
Thank you for sharing such personal insights and I am very sorry for your loss. There are times and situations that make us question everything, to include the existence or even love of our Creator. Questioning is not offensive to our Father, wanting to know is not offensive and you should not worry because you have taken the time to search for answers. In times when all seems to be stripped away from us, we turn inward to ask so many questions, and most of those questions are to ourselves although we dress it up as questioning our faith in G*d, but you do have faith and you do know His love else His name would not be part of that conversation. That may not be clear to you now, and I am not the best to explain this... but, as long as you are searching for Him, He will guide you.
Take heart, for I firmly believe that whoever looks for G*d, He will make Himself known. When you were created, it was by design and purpose just as each and every last baby placed into the womb of a mother, that child has a unique gift and purpose. Some go about their lives never experiencing or looking for that purpose and sadly they cut themselves off from G*d. G*d never cuts you off, but we having the one gift of making choices all too often cut Him out of our lives and heart. Keep searching, soon you will find the truth.... and you will know it instantly, it will feel right, it will be pure and clean...your skepticism will vanish and the weight you feel when you ask questions will dissolve, you will feel free to ask why without feeling guilty or as if you have done something wrong. Is it not written, "You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart." Jeremiah 29:13
Zechariah 8:20-23
20 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:
21 And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the Lord, and to seek the Lord of hosts: I will go also.
22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the Lord of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the Lord.
23 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that G*d is with you.
Continue to ask questions and if anytime I can be a sounding board, a shoulder, or a hand to lift your spirits, just say the word...
Thank you for sharing such personal insights and I am very sorry for your loss. There are times and situations that make us question everything, to include the existence or even love of our Creator. Questioning is not offensive to our Father, wanting to know is not offensive and you should not worry because you have taken the time to search for answers. In times when all seems to be stripped away from us, we turn inward to ask so many questions, and most of those questions are to ourselves although we dress it up as questioning our faith in G*d, but you do have faith and you do know His love else His name would not be part of that conversation. That may not be clear to you now, and I am not the best to explain this... but, as long as you are searching for Him, He will guide you.
Take heart, for I firmly believe that whoever looks for G*d, He will make Himself known. When you were created, it was by design and purpose just as each and every last baby placed into the womb of a mother, that child has a unique gift and purpose. Some go about their lives never experiencing or looking for that purpose and sadly they cut themselves off from G*d. G*d never cuts you off, but we having the one gift of making choices all too often cut Him out of our lives and heart. Keep searching, soon you will find the truth.... and you will know it instantly, it will feel right, it will be pure and clean...your skepticism will vanish and the weight you feel when you ask questions will dissolve, you will feel free to ask why without feeling guilty or as if you have done something wrong. Is it not written, "You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart." Jeremiah 29:13
Zechariah 8:20-23
20 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:
21 And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the Lord, and to seek the Lord of hosts: I will go also.
22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the Lord of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the Lord.
23 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that G*d is with you.
Continue to ask questions and if anytime I can be a sounding board, a shoulder, or a hand to lift your spirits, just say the word...
Tanya wrote:
Thank you Pennylynn, I have always had a faithful ... (show quote)
Jan 29, 2017 15:36:06 #
susanblange
Loc: USA
Tanya wrote:
I would like to start out by saying that I am so confused about who the true people, or tribes, of God will be? I m pron to saying it will be the Jewish, but after reading about the 12 tribe, I've come to believe it may be them...? And wasn't God described as a man with white wooly hair, and skin dark at night.... Someone please explain it to me!!!
Three tribes comprised the southern kingdom, the House of Judah. They are called Israel today and consist of the Jews. The other ten tribes, the northern kingdom, went into Assyrian captivity in 721 bce and they never returned. They migrated to the north and west into the coastlands and isles. This was north western Europe, what used to be called "free Europe". They are the true Israel. About 100 million people will survive on earth up to the resurrection, not 144 thousand in the NT. The SOS gives a physical description of the Messiah. She is "white and ruddy" (5:10), she has purple hair (7:5), she has green eyes (1:15-16), she is called the "fairest among women" (5:9). Jesus has been reincarnated and he has blond hair and blue eyes.
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