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Mar 20, 2018 18:29:08   #
Morgan
 
pafret wrote:
Why is that health insurance plans which were providing excellent affordable coverage for their client base suddenly no longer met standards? My sons insurance premiums more tha doubled in the course of two months and then his plan was withdrawn and no longer offered. There was no plan which mwet standards which gave him the same coverage and his out of pocket costs made the idea of buying insurance ludicrous. It was cheaper to pay the penalty tax and full price for medical service.. It accomplished Obama's objectives, income redistribution, take the from better off workers and give to those who do not work at all.

What are these standards that killed so many insurance plans and who can honestly say hat what they have now is cheaper and better? Other than freeloaders who get their health care without charge.
Why is that health insurance plans which were prov... (show quote)


I don't know anyone who gets their health plan without cost except for the military and government employed people. I can't answer, your questions on your personal policies I'm not an insurance agent. I know the ACA had problems, but if we had let it play out, as suggested, the more people who enrolled he more prices would come down and level off, but because it came from the left, the right had to destroy it, not allowing it be seen through. It's the equivalent of stopping a game at halftime, just because you weren't winning.

Reply
Mar 20, 2018 18:33:09   #
pafret Loc: Northeast
 
Morgan wrote:
The mandate Dave was to have everyone enrol and be covered, one to bring insurance costs down and two, stop over expenditures in emergency room care being paid by the government.

Have you spoken to the people who were unable to get any coverage due to pre-existing conditions as myself, who could not get coverage?

Or people that lost their cancer coverage during treatment, because of caps, which meant death.

How about the insurance companies would raise your premiums, and you had no choice but to bow out of coverage.

How about the people who went into debt or lost everything trying to pay for their medical care, while the insurance companies made great profits, along with pharmaceuticals and hospitals.
Do YOU care?
We are going to see this all happen again, as soon as the ACA is done, Good Job to the right once again. Perhaps you should at the self-interest of the people who put together this new abominable health plan, designed and constructed basically by the insurance companies. People are going to die because of it, including babies who are born with health conditions, where will the pro-lifers be then?
The mandate Dave was to have everyone enrol and be... (show quote)


You are describing conditions which are not the norm for the majority of the people yet you believe we should all be insured against those conditions. Further, you believe that we should all have to pay higher premiums so that those who do need those coverage items get them.

Why don't we leave the insurance coverage alone and offer governmental guaranteed insurance to cover extreme cases like yours. You need it, you buy it, with whatever subsidies are necessary. The Obamacare insurance was an income redistribution plan, not insurance. It took my money to pay your bills and I am sorry but I worked for my money and I have a right to spend it for my benefit. If you need a handout, ask and if I feel generous I will contribute my money voluntarily. If you are in this country illegally, go home to your country an use their medical programs.

Price gouging by pharmaceutical companies is a problem which has to be addressed. Insurance manipulation isn't the way to do that. Insurance companies protections in market areas need to be removed because prices do not drop except under competition. Those laws were enacted to benefit th Insurance companies, not regulate them.

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 06:44:21   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
Morgan wrote:
The mandate Dave was to have everyone enrol and be covered, one to bring insurance costs down and two, stop over expenditures in emergency room care being paid by the government.

Have you spoken to the people who were unable to get any coverage due to pre-existing conditions as myself, who could not get coverage?

Or people that lost their cancer coverage during treatment, because of caps, which meant death.

How about the insurance companies would raise your premiums, and you had no choice but to bow out of coverage.

How about the people who went into debt or lost everything trying to pay for their medical care, while the insurance companies made great profits, along with pharmaceuticals and hospitals.
Do YOU care?
We are going to see this all happen again, as soon as the ACA is done, Good Job to the right once again. Perhaps you should at the self-interest of the people who put together this new abominable health plan, designed and constructed basically by the insurance companies. People are going to die because of it, including babies who are born with health conditions, where will the pro-lifers be then?
The mandate Dave was to have everyone enrol and be... (show quote)

I never said Obamacare didn't subsidize some people's coverage.

I did say it was wrong to screw my family and millions of other Americans to do it.

Reply
 
 
Mar 21, 2018 09:22:39   #
Morgan
 
pafret wrote:
You are describing conditions which are not the norm for the majority of the people yet you believe we should all be insured against those conditions. Further, you believe that we should all have to pay higher premiums so that those who do need those coverage items get them.

Why don't we leave the insurance coverage alone and offer governmental guaranteed insurance to cover extreme cases like yours. You need it, you buy it, with whatever subsidies are necessary. The Obamacare insurance was an income redistribution plan, not insurance. It took my money to pay your bills and I am sorry but I worked for my money and I have a right to spend it for my benefit. If you need a handout, ask and if I feel generous I will contribute my money voluntarily. If you are in this country illegally, go home to your country an use their medical programs.

Price gouging by pharmaceutical companies is a problem which has to be addressed. Insurance manipulation isn't the way to do that. Insurance companies protections in market areas need to be removed because prices do not drop except under competition. Those laws were enacted to benefit th Insurance companies, not regulate them.
You are describing conditions which are not the no... (show quote)


First off, a preexisting condition isn't considered extreme, there are all kinds of conditions from very serious to mild, but either way, people should ALL be able to be covered. A person should only have to be concerned with getting well and not if they can afford it or not or lose their home, or not. Cancer which is not my condition only an example I used, but it has now come up to 1 in 3 will get cancer, that isn't a rare condition, and those stats are ever increasing, especially with age.

What do you think "insurance" is for? It is paying for future what if's and as far as the future no one knows what can happen to them, they may fall and become crippled, get a disease, or whatever, no one knows.

I never said I believe I believe people should pay higher premiums over others, I said people picked plans they could afford and the ACA should have played out to see prices come down with enlistments. Insurance companies do things by packages like your cable company, they don't personally itemize your every specific need, yet.

What we have now is even more of a distribution plan more than ever. Only the very wealthy will be able to afford a health care that will cover everything that is needed, the rest of us will be doing without, including you unless you are very wealthy, and if you are, that is one damn selfish attitude. The dogma of I'm OK so I don't really give a damn what happens to anyone else, that's their problem. Well that problem might just go to someone like your mother if you can imagine that?

No offence but I am so sick of the" I worked for my money and you're not going to take it"attitude, grow up and look at the big picture. We've ALL worked hard for our money all of our lives and we should not have to go bankrupt to have health care. This "for Profit" health care system will never work for the people. It is a conflict of interest, do you understand that? It has to change.The US pays the most, and the people get the least.

Your quote"You need it, you buy it, with whatever subsidies are necessary." that's just what the ACA was doing!???

You are correct for many of the laws being for the insurance companies, and that won't change until the lobbyist's money stops being exchanged in Congress. Why is that not illegal? There's a law to back.

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 13:32:22   #
pafret Loc: Northeast
 
Morgan wrote:
First off, a preexisting condition isn't considered extreme, there are all kinds of conditions from very serious to mild, but either way, people should ALL be able to be covered. A person should only have to be concerned with getting well and not if they can afford it or not or lose their home, or not. Cancer which is not my condition only an example I used, but it has now come up to 1 in 3 will get cancer, that isn't a rare condition, and those stats are ever increasing, especially with age.

What do you think "insurance" is for? It is paying for future what if's and as far as the future no one knows what can happen to them, they may fall and become crippled, get a disease, or whatever, no one knows.

I never said I believe I believe people should pay higher premiums over others, I said people picked plans they could afford and the ACA should have played out to see prices come down with enlistments. Insurance companies do things by packages like your cable company, they don't personally itemize your every specific need, yet.

What we have now is even more of a distribution plan more than ever. Only the very wealthy will be able to afford a health care that will cover everything that is needed, the rest of us will be doing without, including you unless you are very wealthy, and if you are, that is one damn selfish attitude. The dogma of I'm OK so I don't really give a damn what happens to anyone else, that's their problem. Well that problem might just go to someone like your mother if you can imagine that?

No offence but I am so sick of the" I worked for my money and you're not going to take it"attitude, grow up and look at the big picture. We've ALL worked hard for our money all of our lives and we should not have to go bankrupt to have health care. This "for Profit" health care system will never work for the people. It is a conflict of interest, do you understand that? It has to change.The US pays the most, and the people get the least.

Your quote"You need it, you buy it, with whatever subsidies are necessary." that's just what the ACA was doing!???

You are correct for many of the laws being for the insurance companies, and that won't change until the lobbyist's money stops being exchanged in Congress. Why is that not illegal? There's a law to back.
First off, a preexisting condition isn't considere... (show quote)


You ignored my concomitant condition of 'leave my insurance alone and you buy whatever the government is offering as medical insurance'. My insurance like many others was affordable, with copays and out of pocket deductibles that were also affordable. They are not any longer with the government's plans, which were supposed to be cheaper and better that what I had.

Your accusations of heartlessness are what are to be expected from those whose attitude is that what is mine is mine and what is yours is also mine. Do you impute some form of selfishness to me because I provided for my own health insurance by earning the money to buy it? Should I have turned my paycheck over to you to see if anyone else wanted to claim the results of my labors? Yet you believe that I should be willing to shoulder other's health problems while my own go begging because I can no longer afford to go to the doctor or the hospital -- particularly since I work for a living. Your example of a close relative is just guilt tripping; obviously I am going to take care of my family but the real question is why aren't you taking care of yours?

Going bankrupt because of health care is a hard cross to bear. I personally reached near that point with my five year old son's medical treatment for Cancer. My solution to this problem was to work two full time jobs, which I did for a period of three years. My wife had the full time, unassisted, responsibility of raising four young children and keeping our home. She and I worked our way out of the near financial disaster. This may not be a possibility fo many people but it was for me and was consistent with my personal credo of paying my own way.

We are all well aware that insurance is gambling. The insurance companies employ teams of statisticians, actuaries et.al., to constantly figure the odds and then price their policies accordingly. They may lose in your particular case but overall they win and win big. The packages or bundles are undoubtedly like the automotive industries accessory groups, they always include several features nobody wants but are extremely profitable to the manufacturer along with the critical, must have "accessory". The government introduced distortions into the calculations by requiring excessive coverage via these groups or bundles which always include profit winners. These distortions ranged from preexisting conditions, to unneeded coverage in bundles extended to all, to absolutely bad bets such as the newly insured needing horrendously expensive treatments, which he was unable to get anyone to pay for. Most policies I have seen had prohibitions on pre-existing conditions for a period of time buit I am not familiar with all policies. It may be that some conditions are not covered forever.

The end result was that prices went up. Obama's government had entered into agreement with the insurers to cover any loses incurred, to eliminate their opposition. At the same time, the government wanted to make sure they would not have to pay out for any loses the insurance companies incurred so they compelled the extremely high out of pocket expense. Presto, everybody has health insurance. Those with catastrophic diseases or no insurance benefit immediately, everyone else pays the bill and never benefits from their so-called "Health Insurance". They give it up or do not participate because it is cheaper to pay the bill. They are saddled with fines and penalties for not participating in this wealth redistribution scheme. Of course, in your view they are selfish for not wanting to pay all of their own medical expenses and yours as well. It is wondrous to realize that we were doing that before under the gambling paradigm, what could possibly have changed?

None of this considers the destructive effect on society caused by the regulations on employers, which forced them to convert full time jobs with benefits, to part time employment. Nor the effect on workers who had to find additional part time jobs and have no benefits (health insurance, 501K plans etc.) at any of them. Some of the effects of this we have seen already, the real crunch will come when these workers try to retire with no savings, a likely reduced Social Security and no prospects of continuing their existence.

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 14:26:05   #
Morgan
 
Super Dave wrote:
I never said Obamacare didn't subsidize some people's coverage.

I did say it was wrong to screw my family and millions of other Americans to do it.


We're getting more screwed with more people not carrying any insurance at all. How come you guy's don't get that?

Tell me, do you also feel screwed when the governmental elite and their Cadillac policies get coverage for many things that are usually not covered in regular policies, as plastic surgery for their wives and not battle affiliated?

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 14:46:28   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
Morgan wrote:
We're getting more screwed with more people not carrying any insurance at all. How come you guy's don't get that?

Tell me, do you also feel screwed when the governmental elite and their Cadillac policies get coverage for many things that are usually not covered in regular policies, as plastic surgery for their wives and not battle affiliated?
That's got nothing to with screwing up my healthcare plan and million of others.

nd yes, I get it entirely.

Reply
 
 
Mar 21, 2018 19:15:08   #
Morgan
 
pafret wrote:
You ignored my concomitant condition of 'leave my insurance alone and you buy whatever the government is offering as medical insurance'. My insurance like many others was affordable, with copays and out of pocket deductibles that were also affordable. They are not any longer with the government's plans, which were supposed to be cheaper and better that what I had.

Your accusations of heartlessness are what are to be expected from those whose attitude is that what is mine is mine and what is yours is also mine. Do you impute some form of selfishness to me because I provided for my own health insurance by earning the money to buy it? Should I have turned my paycheck over to you to see if anyone else wanted to claim the results of my labors? Yet you believe that I should be willing to shoulder other's health problems while my own go begging because I can no longer afford to go to the doctor or the hospital -- particularly since I work for a living. Your example of a close relative is just guilt tripping; obviously I am going to take care of my family but the real question is why aren't you taking care of yours?

Going bankrupt because of health care is a hard cross to bear. I personally reached near that point with my five year old son's medical treatment for Cancer. My solution to this problem was to work two full time jobs, which I did for a period of three years. My wife had the full time, unassisted, responsibility of raising four young children and keeping our home. She and I worked our way out of the near financial disaster. This may not be a possibility fo many people but it was for me and was consistent with my personal credo of paying my own way.

We are all well aware that insurance is gambling. The insurance companies employ teams of statisticians, actuaries et.al., to constantly figure the odds and then price their policies accordingly. They may lose in your particular case but overall they win and win big. The packages or bundles are undoubtedly like the automotive industries accessory groups, they always include several features nobody wants but are extremely profitable to the manufacturer along with the critical, must have "accessory". The government introduced distortions into the calculations by requiring excessive coverage via these groups or bundles which always include profit winners. These distortions ranged from preexisting conditions, to unneeded coverage in bundles extended to all, to absolutely bad bets such as the newly insured needing horrendously expensive treatments, which he was unable to get anyone to pay for. Most policies I have seen had prohibitions on pre-existing conditions for a period of time buit I am not familiar with all policies. It may be that some conditions are not covered forever.

The end result was that prices went up. Obama's government had entered into agreement with the insurers to cover any loses incurred, to eliminate their opposition. At the same time, the government wanted to make sure they would not have to pay out for any loses the insurance companies incurred so they compelled the extremely high out of pocket expense. Presto, everybody has health insurance. Those with catastrophic diseases or no insurance benefit immediately, everyone else pays the bill and never benefits from their so-called "Health Insurance". They give it up or do not participate because it is cheaper to pay the bill. They are saddled with fines and penalties for not participating in this wealth redistribution scheme. Of course, in your view they are selfish for not wanting to pay all of their own medical expenses and yours as well. It is wondrous to realize that we were doing that before under the gambling paradigm, what could possibly have changed?

None of this considers the destructive effect on society caused by the regulations on employers, which forced them to convert full-time jobs with benefits, to part-time employment. Nor the effect on workers who had to find additional part time jobs and have no benefits (health insurance, 501K plans etc.) at any of them. Some of the effects of this we have seen already, the real crunch will come when these workers try to retire with no savings, a likely reduced Social Security and no prospects of continuing their existence.
You ignored my concomitant condition of 'leave my ... (show quote)




Yes, Co-pay certainly still exists, being affordable is subjective to a person's income, before the ACA we were easily paying a person's annual salary, while never making a claim. Once claims come in the premium rises, not a good place for seniors.

Like I said you are the one fixated on what people are taking away from you. Who is really taking anything away from you? Taxes? We the self-employed, are the major payers, and as long as poverty grows along with the military and government jobs, (who have it paid for through taxes also) we will continue to go down this same road, taking from you and I, the tax base...so who are the winners really, we know the answer to that don't we.

Looking at this new health plan, it seems to be designed to promote the sick and elderly to die, maybe their way of filtering out the dead wood and only have productive people exist, while not acknowledging their lifetime of service, only that their use has expired. These are the people I refer to being selfish, but if you go along with their plan then you would be compliant also.

Our healthcare has been below the world status for a long time. Although the U.S. has the most expensive health care system in the world, the nation ranks lowest in terms of efficiency, equity and outcomes. It is our tax money, a pool to be dispersed by priority. You concentrate your thoughts so much on the poor you don't see the real unbalanced distribution of money is to the wealthy, but for some reason you choose to ignore them and resent the people who have nothing, though many of them bust their buts working very hard every day, and are torn between fixing their car or paying for insurance or a doctors bill.

A good part of the money given to the ACA was from tax money from the wealthy off of their dividends, the profit they gambled on it in the market which acquired a good return. Where was the harm in a slight increase in the percentage of tax in that to help bring down healthcare costs? Which is what Obama did.

I've noticed in this new health plan, there weren't any new regulations for pharmaceutical gauging or price fixing.

I ask you are people heartless when they choose profit over peoples lives? I did not ask for anyone to pay for anyone including myself which no one does. We, like you, have worked many years and long hours, all I'm asking for is reasonably priced insurance that actually gives quality coverage. The rest you stated of what I want, are incorrect assumptions from preconceived notions, and not my opinion.

I didn't refer to you as selfish unless you were part of the elite that is for this so-called health plan, which is no health plan at all, it does nothing but put all the control back into the hands of the unreined insurance companies, and people will die because of it. Yes, I think that is heartless.

People will go uninsured, once again, and that cost will still go to us, the taxpayer, not an insurance company that would be helping to fit the bill.

Personally, I think workingclasstiff has the right idea, get rid of insurance companies, put all that money into healthcare for all. This would also put a halt to companies having to supply health insurance as you mentioned and thereby possibly freeing up more money to pay employees a decent wage.

My apologies I thought I had commented on people keeping their own insurance. That's fine more power to you if you have the extra funds. I don't see why they can't work it like the school system, one private and one public.

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 20:25:31   #
Morgan
 
Super Dave wrote:
That's got nothing to with screwing up my healthcare plan and million of others.

nd yes, I get it entirely.


Sure it does

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 20:39:54   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
Morgan wrote:
Sure it does
So you're not satisfied with getting other people to subsidize your expenses, you insist everyone else lose their health coverage.

Aren't you special....

Reply
Mar 21, 2018 21:00:03   #
pafret Loc: Northeast
 
Morgan wrote:
Yes, Co-pay certainly still exists, being affordable is subjective to a person's income, before the ACA we were easily paying a person's annual salary, while never making a claim. Once claims come in the premium rises, not a good place for seniors.

Like I said you are the one fixated on what people are taking away from you. Who is really taking anything away from you? Taxes? We the self-employed, are the major payers, and as long as poverty grows along with the military and government jobs, (who have it paid for through taxes also) we will continue to go down this same road, taking from you and I, the tax base...so who are the winners really, we know the answer to that don't we.

Looking at this new health plan, it seems to be designed to promote the sick and elderly to die, maybe their way of filtering out the dead wood and only have productive people exist, while not acknowledging their lifetime of service, only that their use has expired. These are the people I refer to being selfish, but if you go along with their plan then you would be compliant also.

Our healthcare has been below the world status for a long time. Although the U.S. has the most expensive health care system in the world, the nation ranks lowest in terms of efficiency, equity and outcomes. It is our tax money, a pool to be dispersed by priority. You concentrate your thoughts so much on the poor you don't see the real unbalanced distribution of money is to the wealthy, but for some reason you choose to ignore them and resent the people who have nothing, though many of them bust their buts working very hard every day, and are torn between fixing their car or paying for insurance or a doctors bill.

A good part of the money given to the ACA was from tax money from the wealthy off of their dividends, the profit they gambled on it in the market which acquired a good return. Where was the harm in a slight increase in the percentage of tax in that to help bring down healthcare costs? Which is what Obama did.

I've noticed in this new health plan, there weren't any new regulations for pharmaceutical gauging or price fixing.

I ask you are people heartless when they choose profit over peoples lives? I did not ask for anyone to pay for anyone including myself which no one does. We, like you, have worked many years and long hours, all I'm asking for is reasonably priced insurance that actually gives quality coverage. The rest you stated of what I want, are incorrect assumptions from preconceived notions, and not my opinion.

I didn't refer to you as selfish unless you were part of the elite that is for this so-called health plan, which is no health plan at all, it does nothing but put all the control back into the hands of the unreined insurance companies, and people will die because of it. Yes, I think that is heartless.

People will go uninsured, once again, and that cost will still go to us, the taxpayer, not an insurance company that would be helping to fit the bill.

Personally, I think workingclasstiff has the right idea, get rid of insurance companies, put all that money into healthcare for all. This would also put a halt to companies having to supply health insurance as you mentioned and thereby possibly freeing up more money to pay employees a decent wage.

My apologies I thought I had commented on people keeping their own insurance. That's fine more power to you if you have the extra funds. I don't see why they can't work it like the school system, one private and one public.
Yes, Co-pay certainly still exists, being affordab... (show quote)


This is such a mish mash concatenation of issues there is no way to respond to this in any rational manner, Taxes, Wealth inequity, the poor, who pays the taxes etc etc. Everything but the fact that Obamacare is a wealth distribution scheme right out of the marxists playbook. Take from the rich and ive to the poor. Only it has been modified to take from the moderately better off and spread around so everyone is poor.

As far back as 1891 Pope Leo XIII in his encyclical Rerum Novarum addressed the issue of the workman's entitlement to the fruits of his labor and the Capitalists obligations in that regard. You should take the time to read it. It does not cover health care, it just covers compensation for work performed and who is entitled to that income. He has some words about Socialists and Socialism, which are as pertinent now as they were then.

http://w2.vatican.va/content/leo-xiii/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_15051891_rerum-novarum.html
Encyclical Rerum Novarum of Leo XIII, 15 May 1891

Reply
 
 
Mar 23, 2018 09:38:34   #
Morgan
 
Super Dave wrote:
So you're not satisfied with getting other people to subsidize your expenses, you insist everyone else lose their health coverage.

Aren't you special....


Something has been lost in translation, how did you arrive at that conclusion? My expenses? Let's try and stay on topic and not make it personal, my husband and I have very good coverage.

Are you happy with the escalated costs of the uninsured, that absorbs higher tax dollars and higher hospital costs to you and I and everyone else who carries insurance? The point is no one should lose their health care or their coverage.

Reply
Mar 23, 2018 09:49:37   #
Morgan
 
pafret wrote:
This is such a mish mash concatenation of issues there is no way to respond to this in any rational manner, Taxes, Wealth inequity, the poor, who pays the taxes etc etc. Everything but the fact that Obamacare is a wealth distribution scheme right out of the marxists playbook. Take from the rich and ive to the poor. Only it has been modified to take from the moderately better off and spread around so everyone is poor.

As far back as 1891 Pope Leo XIII in his encyclical Rerum Novarum addressed the issue of the workman's entitlement to the fruits of his labor and the Capitalists obligations in that regard. You should take the time to read it. It does not cover health care, it just covers compensation for work performed and who is entitled to that income. He has some words about Socialists and Socialism, which are as pertinent now as they were then.

http://w2.vatican.va/content/leo-xiii/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_15051891_rerum-novarum.html
Encyclical Rerum Novarum of Leo XIII, 15 May 1891
This is such a mish mash concatenation of issues t... (show quote)


Health care should not be part of the capitalist's engine, it is a conflict of interest to profit-making on the backs of the sick...period.
Another fact, we rank 37 in the world ranking, the richest country in the world is 37, absolutely deplorable, obscene.

Tell me what is tour fix, to be ranked #1 as France, who also kills us for healthy school lunches of real food for our children.


World Health Organization Ranking; The World’s Health Systems
1 France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates***even they are ahead of us!
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica
37 USA
38 Slovenia
39 Cuba
40 Brunei
41 New Zealand
42 Bahrain
43 Croatia
44 Qatar
45 Kuwait
46 Barbados
47 Thailand
48 Czech Republic
49 Malaysia
50 Poland
51 Dominican Republic
52 Tunisia
53 Jamaica
54 Venezuela
55 Albania
56 Seychelles
57 Paraguay
58 South Korea
59 Senegal
60 Philippines
61 Mexico
62 Slovakia
63 Egypt
64 Kazakhstan 65 Uruguay
66 Hungary
67 Trinidad and Tobago
68 Saint Lucia
69 Belize
70 Turkey
71 Nicaragua
72 Belarus
73 Lithuania
74 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
75 Argentina
76 Sri Lanka
77 Estonia
78 Guatemala
79 Ukraine
80 Solomon Islands
81 Algeria
82 Palau
83 Jordan
84 Mauritius
85 Grenada
86 Antigua and Barbuda
87 Libya
88 Bangladesh
89 Macedonia
90 Bosnia-Herzegovina
91 Lebanon
92 Indonesia
93 Iran
94 Bahamas
95 Panama
96 Fiji
97 Benin
98 Nauru
99 Romania
100 Saint Kitts and Nevis
101 Moldova
102 Bulgaria
103 Iraq
104 Armenia
105 Latvia
106 Yugoslavia
107 Cook Islands
108 Syria
109 Azerbaijan
110 Suriname
111 Ecuador
112 India
113 Cape Verde
114 Georgia
115 El Salvador
116 Tonga
117 Uzbekistan
118 Comoros
119 Samoa
120 Yemen
121 Niue
122 Pakistan
123 Micronesia
124 Bhutan
125 Brazil
126 Bolivia
127 Vanuatu 128 Guyana
129 Peru
130 Russia
131 Honduras
132 Burkina Faso
133 Sao Tome and Principe
134 Sudan
135 Ghana
136 Tuvalu
137 Ivory Coast
138 Haiti
139 Gabon
140 Kenya
141 Marshall Islands
142 Kiribati
143 Burundi
144 China
145 Mongolia
146 Gambia
147 Maldives
148 Papua New Guinea
149 Uganda
150 Nepal
151 Kyrgystan
152 Togo
153 Turkmenistan
154 Tajikistan
155 Zimbabwe
156 Tanzania
157 Djibouti
158 Eritrea
159 Madagascar
160 Vietnam
161 Guinea
162 Mauritania
163 Mali
164 Cameroon
165 Laos
166 Congo
167 North Korea
168 Namibia
169 Botswana
170 Niger
171 Equatorial Guinea
172 Rwanda
173 Afghanistan
174 Cambodia
175 South Africa
176 Guinea-Bissau
177 Swaziland
178 Chad
179 Somalia
180 Ethiopia
181 Angola
182 Zambia
183 Lesotho
184 Mozambique
185 Malawi
186 Liberia
187 Nigeria
188 Democratic Republic of the Congo
189 Central African Republic
190 Myanmar
http://thepatientfactor.com/canadian-health-care-information/world-health-organizations-ranking-of-the-worlds-health-systems/

Reply
Mar 23, 2018 12:13:17   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
Morgan wrote:
Something has been lost in translation, how did you arrive at that conclusion? My expenses? Let's try and stay on topic and not make it personal, my husband and I have very good coverage.

Are you happy with the escalated costs of the uninsured, that absorbs higher tax dollars and higher hospital costs to you and I and everyone else who carries insurance? The point is no one should lose their health care or their coverage.
I thought you said:
1. You needed Obamacare to cover your preexisting condition.
2. Changing my policy against my will was necessary.

Was I mistaken?

Reply
Mar 23, 2018 12:18:07   #
Super Dave Loc: Realville, USA
 
Morgan wrote:
Health care should not be part of the capitalist's engine, it is a conflict of interest to profit-making on the backs of the sick...period.
Another fact, we rank 37 in the world ranking, the richest country in the world is 37, absolutely deplorable, obscene.

Tell me what is tour fix, to be ranked #1 as France, who also kills us for healthy school lunches of real food for our children.


World Health Organization Ranking; The World’s Health Systems
1 France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates***even they are ahead of us!
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica
37 USA
38 Slovenia
39 Cuba
40 Brunei
41 New Zealand
42 Bahrain
43 Croatia
44 Qatar
45 Kuwait
46 Barbados
47 Thailand
48 Czech Republic
49 Malaysia
50 Poland
51 Dominican Republic
52 Tunisia
53 Jamaica
54 Venezuela
55 Albania
56 Seychelles
57 Paraguay
58 South Korea
59 Senegal
60 Philippines
61 Mexico
62 Slovakia
63 Egypt
64 Kazakhstan 65 Uruguay
66 Hungary
67 Trinidad and Tobago
68 Saint Lucia
69 Belize
70 Turkey
71 Nicaragua
72 Belarus
73 Lithuania
74 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
75 Argentina
76 Sri Lanka
77 Estonia
78 Guatemala
79 Ukraine
80 Solomon Islands
81 Algeria
82 Palau
83 Jordan
84 Mauritius
85 Grenada
86 Antigua and Barbuda
87 Libya
88 Bangladesh
89 Macedonia
90 Bosnia-Herzegovina
91 Lebanon
92 Indonesia
93 Iran
94 Bahamas
95 Panama
96 Fiji
97 Benin
98 Nauru
99 Romania
100 Saint Kitts and Nevis
101 Moldova
102 Bulgaria
103 Iraq
104 Armenia
105 Latvia
106 Yugoslavia
107 Cook Islands
108 Syria
109 Azerbaijan
110 Suriname
111 Ecuador
112 India
113 Cape Verde
114 Georgia
115 El Salvador
116 Tonga
117 Uzbekistan
118 Comoros
119 Samoa
120 Yemen
121 Niue
122 Pakistan
123 Micronesia
124 Bhutan
125 Brazil
126 Bolivia
127 Vanuatu 128 Guyana
129 Peru
130 Russia
131 Honduras
132 Burkina Faso
133 Sao Tome and Principe
134 Sudan
135 Ghana
136 Tuvalu
137 Ivory Coast
138 Haiti
139 Gabon
140 Kenya
141 Marshall Islands
142 Kiribati
143 Burundi
144 China
145 Mongolia
146 Gambia
147 Maldives
148 Papua New Guinea
149 Uganda
150 Nepal
151 Kyrgystan
152 Togo
153 Turkmenistan
154 Tajikistan
155 Zimbabwe
156 Tanzania
157 Djibouti
158 Eritrea
159 Madagascar
160 Vietnam
161 Guinea
162 Mauritania
163 Mali
164 Cameroon
165 Laos
166 Congo
167 North Korea
168 Namibia
169 Botswana
170 Niger
171 Equatorial Guinea
172 Rwanda
173 Afghanistan
174 Cambodia
175 South Africa
176 Guinea-Bissau
177 Swaziland
178 Chad
179 Somalia
180 Ethiopia
181 Angola
182 Zambia
183 Lesotho
184 Mozambique
185 Malawi
186 Liberia
187 Nigeria
188 Democratic Republic of the Congo
189 Central African Republic
190 Myanmar
http://thepatientfactor.com/canadian-health-care-information/world-health-organizations-ranking-of-the-worlds-health-systems/
Health care should not be part of the capitalist's... (show quote)

Who gives a rip what the WHO says?

The UN does not support freedom. They cater to Socialists, Communists, and anti-Semities.

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