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This Maverick Moment
Jul 28, 2017 07:27:06   #
Tgards79
 
An epic moment in an incredible career:
http://www.borntorunthenumbers.com/2017/07/this-maverick-moment.html

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Jul 28, 2017 09:04:02   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Maverick. Right? He's just another liberal in GOP clothing. Can't stand him
Tgards79 wrote:
An epic moment in an incredible career:
http://www.borntorunthenumbers.com/2017/07/this-maverick-moment.html

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Jul 28, 2017 09:15:00   #
Tgards79
 
JFlorio wrote:
Maverick. Right? He's just another liberal in GOP clothing. Can't stand him
Your definition of "liberal" is breathtaking.

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Jul 28, 2017 09:26:14   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Bit of an over reaction don't you think there drama queen? Liberal, as in Ted Kennedy, not today's leftists is what I mean.
Tgards79 wrote:
Your definition of "liberal" is breathtaking.

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Jul 28, 2017 10:36:54   #
Tgards79
 
JFlorio wrote:
Bit of an over reaction don't you think there drama queen? Liberal, as in Ted Kennedy, not today's leftists is what I mean.
I have no idea what distinction you are drawing. Essentially you are calling John McCain a "liberal" which, under any definition, is absurd. McCain may pass for a "moderate" Republican these days, but, issue-for-issue, his positions are down-the-line GOP/conservative.

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Jul 28, 2017 11:25:31   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
News flash. The GOP is not what we Conservatives call Conservative. In a nutshell conservatives have one major definition that makes them Conservative. Small efficient government. The rest of the issues, social and economic vary from individual to individual. Republicans, except for the few, like the Freedom Caucus are for bigger and more intrusive government. The Democrats are for the same. Only for even bigger and more intrusive governent. Do you believe the Democratic Party would consider John F Kennedy a liberal today? Of course not.
Tgards79 wrote:
I have no idea what distinction you are drawing. Essentially you are calling John McCain a "liberal" which, under any definition, is absurd. McCain may pass for a "moderate" Republican these days, but, issue-for-issue, his positions are down-the-line GOP/conservative.

Reply
Jul 28, 2017 11:34:11   #
Tgards79
 
JFlorio wrote:
News flash. The GOP is not what we Conservatives call Conservative. In a nutshell conservatives have one major definition that makes them Conservative. Small efficient government. The rest of the issues, social and economic vary from individual to individual. Republicans, except for the few, like the Freedom Caucus are for bigger and more intrusive government. The Democrats are for the same. Only for even bigger and more intrusive governent. Do you believe the Democratic Party would consider John F Kennedy a liberal today? Of course not.
News flash. The GOP is not what we Conservatives c... (show quote)
The Democratic Party did not consider JFK a liberal back then. Stevenson was the liberal. The liberal wing of the Democratic Party has never managed to nominate a presidential candidate, with the exceptions of George McGovern and Walter Mondale. Every other one, including winners Johnson, Clinton, Carter and Obama, and losers Humphrey, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry and Hillary Clinton, were viewed correctly as pragmatists or centrists. You think Obamacare is what the liberal wing of the Democrats wanted? Of course not -- they want universal coverage. The difference between the parties now is that the Dems are unified despite their vast differences, while the GOP chooses not to bridge their wide gaps. Painting the Democratic Party as a liberal monolith is a mistaken analysis. Perhaps you have never heard of the old saw: "I belong to no organized political party. I'm a Democrat."

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Jul 28, 2017 11:57:49   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
You are a complete and utter idiot. Obama, Hillary, a centrist? The difference is the Republican Party has many factions. You know,
individuals who won't compromise their positions just to get along. The Democrats do follow in lock step. Just like it's lemming followers.
Tgards79 wrote:
The Democratic Party did not consider JFK a liberal back then. Stevenson was the liberal. The liberal wing of the Democratic Party has never managed to nominate a presidential candidate, with the exceptions of George McGovern and Walter Mondale. Every other one, including winners Johnson, Clinton, Carter and Obama, and losers Humphrey, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry and Hillary Clinton, were viewed correctly as pragmatists or centrists. You think Obamacare is what the liberal wing of the Democrats wanted? Of course not -- they want universal coverage. The difference between the parties now is that the Dems are unified despite their vast differences, while the GOP chooses not to bridge their wide gaps. Painting the Democratic Party as a liberal monolith is a mistaken analysis. Perhaps you have never heard of the old saw: "I belong to no organized political party. I'm a Democrat."
The Democratic Party did not consider JFK a libera... (show quote)

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Jul 28, 2017 12:05:45   #
Tgards79
 
JFlorio wrote:
You are a complete and utter idiot. Obama, Hillary, a centrist? The difference is the Republican Party has many factions. You know,
individuals who won't compromise their positions just to get along. The Democrats do follow in lock step. Just like it's lemming followers.
Bernie Sanders was the liberal in the race, in case you didn't notice. Liberals would laugh at you to characterize Obama and Clinton as liberals. They view Obamacare as a sell-out. Now, now, must we resort to name-calling? The difference is that those factions in the GOP cannot pass any legislation...are you happy with that?

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Jul 28, 2017 12:21:42   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
I don't like passing legislation just for bragging rights. I know plenty of liberals that voted for Hillary and obama because they are liberal. Bernie is a leftist. There is a difference. I am not happy at all with the Re stumblecans. They are a joke. My probelem is the democrats are even a bigger joke.
Tgards79 wrote:
Bernie Sanders was the liberal in the race, in case you didn't notice. Liberals would laugh at you to characterize Obama and Clinton as liberals. They view Obamacare as a sell-out. Now, now, must we resort to name-calling? The difference is that those factions in the GOP cannot pass any legislation...are you happy with that?

Reply
Jul 28, 2017 13:17:07   #
Tgards79
 
JFlorio wrote:
I don't like passing legislation just for bragging rights. I know plenty of liberals that voted for Hillary and obama because they are liberal. Bernie is a leftist. There is a difference. I am not happy at all with the Re stumblecans. They are a joke. My probelem is the democrats are even a bigger joke.
Look, we don't have to like each other's party. Your point was that the GOP is factioned on principal and the Dems are not. That is simply wrong. I know plenty of moderate Republicans that voted for Trump. That proves nothing. Ideologically, there are many issues that both parties do not have consensus on within them. For the GOP it is, e.g., Ted Cruz versus Susan Collins. For the Dems it is Elizabeth Warren versus Joe Manchin. You can put whatever labels you want on the Dem factions, but they do exist, and the "leftier" wing of the party thinks Obama and the Clintons are in the other wing, the more centrist wing.

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Jul 28, 2017 13:48:38   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
Hell, Trump's no conservative, unless it's a complete turn around for him. So far his Supreme court pick and some of his policies are conservative. All his life he was more of a Democrat than Republican. Joe Manchin is the only blue dog Democrat of any providence you can point at.
Bernie Sanders went along to get along just like all the Democrats. He had the nomination stolen from him by the DNC and Hillary, yet he still supported them. Proves my point. There is no real distension among the rats.
Tgards79 wrote:
Look, we don't have to like each other's party. Your point was that the GOP is factioned on principal and the Dems are not. That is simply wrong. I know plenty of moderate Republicans that voted for Trump. That proves nothing. Ideologically, there are many issues that both parties do not have consensus on within them. For the GOP it is, e.g., Ted Cruz versus Susan Collins. For the Dems it is Elizabeth Warren versus Joe Manchin. You can put whatever labels you want on the Dem factions, but they do exist, and the "leftier" wing of the party thinks Obama and the Clintons are in the other wing, the more centrist wing.
Look, we don't have to like each other's party. Y... (show quote)

Reply
Jul 28, 2017 13:52:28   #
Tgards79
 
JFlorio wrote:
Hell, Trump's no conservative, unless it's a complete turn around for him. So far his Supreme court pick and some of his policies are conservative. All his life he was more of a Democrat than Republican. Joe Manchin is the only blue dog Democrat of any providence you can point at.
Bernie Sanders went along to get along just like all the Democrats. He had the nomination stolen from him by the DNC and Hillary, yet he still supported them. Proves my point. There is no real distension among the rats.
Hell, Trump's no conservative, unless it's a compl... (show quote)
So you would rather your party was a set of sub-factions that cannot get together to actually pass legislation? You do understand that governance and politics are all about compromise?

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Jul 28, 2017 14:15:02   #
JFlorio Loc: Seminole Florida
 
You can and should compromise around the edges. No problem with that personally. You can't have someone change their core value and then call it a compromise. Did you see the Dem"s want to compromise on the ACA? I sure didn't. I thought some famous Democrat said, "Elections have consequences." "I have a phone and a pen". You mean that kind of compromise? We are never going to agree. I can't make you be right.
Tgards79 wrote:
So you would rather your party was a set of sub-factions that cannot get together to actually pass legislation? You do understand that governance and politics are all about compromise?

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